New M3 vs. 996-997

I can't wait to drive the new M3 when it comes out. 400HP and new SMG gearbox will hopefully convince Porsche to step up before hanging on to the tip or current 997 for more than 7 years.... Robert

I agree it's going to be a nice car. I think Porsche is going with DSG.

M3 will be at least 3 yrs away I think. I hate Bimmers so I'd never switch. 3 series are for yuppies and I don't think any M3 will match up to 911 in looks, performance - given the same model year.

I love Porsche but damn do i have a soft spot for the M3. If I were given the choice between a 996 C2 or a E46 M3, I would probably take the M3. Extremely close perfomance with a ton more practicality.

What? A 996 C2 weighs over 400lbs less than an M3 coupe, has only 8 less hp, but has more torque. 3.2 litre for the M3, 3.6 litre for the later 996s. The E46 may have a more user-friendly back seat, but trunk space is similar in both cars. The new M3 is going to be running a V8, and will yet again, be heavier than the current E46 M3. The only true M3 has 4 cylinders The new M3 will probably have an SMG system close to that of the new M5/M6s that will be out shortly, 7 gears, no option for a manual. The new SMG system is supposed to be really nice from what Ive heard. To each their own, they are both nice cars which anyone would love to have in their garage. ~Apex

Interesting comparison. As someone who just purchased a barely used 996 instead of a new M3 conv., I can tell you that I was very disappointed in the M3. I honestly thought I was going to love it, but didn't. Don't get me wrong, I am a big BMW fan, and have been for life, but I think BMW is designing the soul out of their cars in recent years. While the M3 was fast, it did not feel nearly as fast as the comparable 996, yet had a quirkiness about it that felt disconnected. I drove a 6-speed, and thought the gearbox was much more rubbery than my friends 330Ci 5-speed (go figure). I did not drive the SMG, but drove a 545i with the SMG and while the throttle blips when downshifting were cool, it beat you up during high rev shifts. I hope BMW reduces the technoology focus and returns an M3 like the old ones- high revs, stiff suspension, light weight and FUN. Don't get me wrong, I am much happier that the 911 was the better car, because I have wanted one for 10 years, but can't help think how disappointing the M3 was.

I drove the M3 SMG and 6 speed. Then I ordered my C4S.

My brother has an 04 M3 convertible with SMG box....It is heavy as hell and I do think the C4S or my C2 is much better and faster. I would think BMW would make a light M3 to compete with Porsche but I guess they are different markets....

I think the original was talking about the new M3 w/V8 400 HP not the current E46.

The car that could really be awesome is the 500 HP '06 Z06 which is scheduled to be released next year. A 3100 lb car with 500 HP could provide unreal acceleration provided that GM can come up with a way to put all of that power on the road.

the V8 m3 will be lighter than the current m3. it will probably also get SMG 4, rather than the latest in the M5, SMG 3.

"M3 will be at least 3 yrs away I think. I hate Bimmers so I'd never switch. 3 series are for yuppies and I don't think any M3 will match up to 911 in looks, performance - given the same model year." Wow, that's disheartening. As an M3 and 911 owner, I'de have to say the M3 is not what you described it. A yuppie car? I see a MUCH greater percentage and number of M3's at track events than I do 911's, especiall the standard 996. If BMW's are yuppie cars, I don't know who own porsches then . . . And the performance of my E36 M3 is JUST BARELY behind that of my GT3 (the m3 has mods) The M3 is easier to drive, more balanced, and just a great car given the cost. The E46 is a schoolbus, but nonetheless, it will outaccelerate the 996 despite 400 more lbs and onlly 8 extra HP. For those of you who want to trash on a car just because it costs less than yours: go drive it first.

"I hope BMW reduces the technoology focus and returns an M3 like the old ones- high revs, stiff suspension, light weight and FUN." Amen, the new one is not that great. Its a luxury tank, as will be the new V8. The E36 and the E30 are classics . . .

3 series is definitely the epitome of a yuppie car. No question about it. You see tons of 323, 325, 328, 330 with yuppies that think their car is the baddest. They traded their Honda ricer and never make it to the track. They buy the car for looks or brand. My problem with BMW is it's claim of being the ultimate driving machine. Ultimate driving machine doesn't weigh a ton. Utimate driving machines aren't fugly like the Z, 5 & 7 series. Ultimate machine shouldn't come with under powered 2.5 V6 making less hp than a Camry V6. E46 M3 probly has better value than 996 comparing performance per dollar. Then again, if I want bang for the buck, I'd have bought a C6 instead.

I have driven both the 996 C2 and the E46 M3. I own neither as I am still a teenager. I would take either car, and you most likely are seeing more M3s at the track than 996s is because it is a lot cheaper to purchase an M3, and cheaper to repair if you break anything while out on the track. And, I was referring to STOCK cars. Of course a modded E36 (yeah, because that car has no aftermarket ) will perform better or very close to a GT3. Oh yeah, I drive a Subaru btw.

Interesting. Just last week I test drove an M3 convertible with SMG and was almost going to trade my 04 911 for it. Problem was that my Porsche was worth so little on trade (low 60's) that I decided it wasn't worth it. If I could have gotten $70K I probably would have done it. The 911 seems faster and better all out performance to me but I really liked the SMG and the usable back seat.

I think you're going to be happier having stuck with the 996. I don't have an M3 cab, but my wife has a 330 cab, and I find it very heavy feeling with a noticeable loss of steering responsiveness compared to our 325i sedan (on the same tires). Certainly the M3 compensates somewhat compared to the standard 330, but it still has the same basic structure which I find compromised in the cab versions. And I think the increase in weight over the M3 coupes would probably become apparent after you drove the thing for awhile.

Yes, I'm probably better off that it didn't work out. I knew I was going to be compromising performance for more practicality. May have regretted it down the road.

mrpc12, you have the best 911 out right now. I almost traded mine in for a 40th but just did not want to take a bath on both cars. Mine is like new anyway, so I bought some new rims to hold me over. My car had some heavy chipped up 19's on it when i bought it. My brother wishes he had just bought the 330 cab instead. The M3 convert is to heavy and bumpy and rough for his taste. M3 should only be a coupe!

According top the January '05 issue of Road and Track, the '07 M3 will only have 380 HP. That's a lot of HP but not for a car with a curb weight of around 3500 lbs. Now if you want awesome speed at an affordable price the '06 Z06 will be the car for you. That car will have 500 HP and 500 lb/ft of torque with a curb weight of around 3100 lbs, and the price will be around $60K. If GM can figure out a way to put all of that power on the road without a lot of tire spinning, there won't be many cars on the road that will be faster. Maybe street slicks will be required to harness all of that power.

i really hope porsche sticks w/ manual...too many people are wussies and think flappy panel/smg is fun...sorry i think its that kid in HS who has a really 'cool' lookin car but its auto smg = works well...but it takes the fun out of driving...imo anyways...bmw did make a lightweight m3 like a year back...the csl its pretty much completely CF w/ a side of cardboard trunk...no radio/aircon pretty much base...and some more power...but it was just nippin at the heals of the gt3...nothin like the gt3 RS

as a previous e46 m3 owner, here are my thoughts : Here are my thoughts...(previous owner of an E46///M3 - current owner of an 02' 996) Coming from the BMW tuning community (as somewhat of a torch bearer as well) the E46 ///M3 is one of the best "daily driver" liveable sports cars available. Great power, lots of room , easy to live with daily. My particular M3 saw everything from morning drives to work, to being in the 2002 SEMA Show Toyo Tires booth (driven from OC to LV). With a few mods here and there, the M3 was my idea of the perfect daily driven sports car. If I needed to carry more than 2 people, no problem - the M3 sat 4. I also enjoyed run-ins with the usual Roush Mustang, C4 Vette, etc...all while enjoying heated seats and a extremely comfortable driving environment. Again, I can't say enough about a good mix of power along with incredible comfort. As a new 996 owner (3 months now) IMO, they are 2 completely different automobiles. The 996 is a "true" sportscar (again, my opinion) in that the entire road is felt through the drivers position. My M3 was lowered with full custom H&R Coilover suspension (custom valve settings) and it still doesn't compare to my stock 996 suspension. While I never took the M3 on a track, I did take it on an average of 100MPH run from Santa Barbara to San Francisco, held well through the twisties (we took highway 1) but I can tell you easily that the Porsche just feels more confident in the turns. Straight line power between the M and the 996 is nill - specs are pretty close on either side, besides - this all comes down to driver. I had a funny run-in with a new 350Z and the 996 walked it at speed in 6th gear ( I didn't even bother to down shift). The overall feel of the 996 is just simply designed for performance driving rather than daily comfort. I have a hard time living with the 996 daily (I ebay a lot of stuff and only half of it fits in the 996) - not to mention the lack of 2 usable back seats for passengers. (That being said I just picked up a Scion Xb for daily driving). To sum it up, in my opinion - the E46 M3 is better to live with daily, but the 996 is easily a better sportscar.

You averaged 100 mph on Hwy 1 between SB and SF? Is that calculated via trip computer? That can't be right. I can't even average 100 mph on 101 due to traffic let alone Hwy 1. Maybe you were flying, literally.

Yes, I even have a witness (friend with a 330 following) as well as a fun video of me pulling away up the grapevine

bumble, great observations and thanks for the input. I agree, the 996 is tough on a daily basis and the M3 is better for daily driving. I could not be happier with my 996 and the fun I have had at driving school, autocross's (7) last year, and fun runs up to the mountains!!!

I drove my friends 03 M3 with SMG and I handled great, cornering was very good, maybe as good as the 996, but the SMG - Is not for me. simply said.

SMG? Shift My Gears? if you are going to make a decision based on SMG vs manual, maybe you do not need a sports car. Like steering response/feedback, shifting gears is one of the BEST connections between your car and you. I think SMGs and the like are pretty cool technologies but I would NEVER drive a car that did not have manual transmission. Ok, maybe if I go broke and I have to drive POS car... Back to the original topic... I love Porsches because, to my senses, they epitomise the essence of a sport car. And having the title of a sport car does not only mean "fast". If I only wanted to go fast, I would have a Z06. M3 better than 911? We will never agree. Many have fought this war and have not lived to tell... it can not be won. Go and drive both and let your senses tell you which one is the best for you... not somebody else's opinion. Both have great things to offer. For my senses, I stay with Porsche. It does not have a rear seat? If I wanted space, I'd have an SUV. If I wanted someone else to shift gears for me, I'd have a tiptronic-ish car. Sport cars will ALWAYS have compromises, deal with it. My VERY opinionated view... I hope I did not offend anyone. Peace.