996 IMS Solution vs Retro Fit

2 questions, please.. How many have purchased the "solution" kit from LN versus the retro fit kits for the 996's? In both of those scenarios, how many have still gone through an engine failure even after the updated bearing? Thank you in advance for the opinions/information.

heard of Jack Raby? best to message/contact him. best of luck.

The "solution" is new on the market, so very few takers so far relative to the retrofit which has been around for quite some time. I'm not aware of failures with either that are attributable to the product itself, although there have been issues arising from engines that were already in trouble and not "qualified" as being acceptable for a bearing replacement, thus eventually wrecking the replacement product from within. Finally, the replacement bearing is not a one-time cure-all, generally it is acknowledged to be a maintenance item.

According to the class-action stats (the only ones we've got that could be considered halfway reliable) there is a 92% survival rate of the OEM single row bearing without any intervention at all (not pulling seals, not installing DOF, nada). So although the solution is a brilliant bit of engineering, I consider it overkill from a cost-risk standpoint vs a retrofit. And the thing I also don't care for about it is that it depends on a single feed line to supply it with oil. If that line were to be interrupted (clog up, break) the engine is toast in seconds. Just because it hasn't happened (yet) in the tiny number of units installed doesn't remove it from possibility. I personally like the idea of immersion/splash lubrication better. Assuming there is no swarf in the engine from a failing bearing, and the retrofit installation is done expertly and correctly, I see no reason why the retrofit shouldn't be expected to last the lifetime of the engine. Again, remembering 92% of the OEM bearings last the lifetime, and the LN is made of more durable material and has a stronger center shaft. In fact there is no guarantee by replacing the retrofit bearing at 50K miles, that the replacement bearing won't fail in 5K miles whereas the one you replaced might have lasted another 50K. That said, when my warranty runs out my LN bearing will have close to 50K on it, and if the clutch pedal is getting stiff I might consider doing that and replacing the LN with either the 2-row PRO or the Vertex cylindrical, depending what reports there are about failures between now and then.

So is the LN bearing considered a "retrofit" and the "solution" people sometimes mention is "either the 2-row PRO or the Vertex cylindrical"? Trying to get up to speed on these things...and for those who guard these forums against the Walking Newbs ...no, this isnt clear in 'the-thread-that-shall-be-read-before-one-dares-post-a-question'. Thanks

"The IMS Solution" is (I guess) a copyrighted name for the device that replaces the ball bearing with a plain bearing fed by a proprietary oil tube connected to a proprietary aftermarket oil filter adapter. But I can see where it's confusing because every competitor in that niche market touts their own product as being the solution to the IMS problem. Vertex claims that their cylindrical bearing is good for the life of the engine. DOF people claim their oil squirter solves the problem permanently. Only LN advises replacing their dual-row and 2-row "PRO" retrofit ball bearings at intervals.

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Here is "The Solution" by LN. I do not think that there are many members that are up to speed on this kit. I was not aware of it until I contact Jake @ LN this past weekend. He said it's $1,800 for the kit only.. http://theimssolution.com This kit has no moving bearing parts but I do agree on the oil line risk! Although I really do like their solution. Contemplating between this or the retro kit.

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Oh yeh...most us members have no clue about this at all. Where is my "not this $hit again" photo?

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Anyone on this forum with a pulse is familiar with this product. WTF?

Right, who is Jack Rugby?

he can do an LS swap...that COULD take care of the problem, not sure though

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So good.

I don't get why some of you are having such a beef on this thread. I'm just saying not everyone is talking about the non-bearing kit on this site and so one would assume either A: no market for it or B: not enough knowledge of the kit. Sorry if I ruined your Monday...

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Read through ALL the IXX threads and see if you get mad too.

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try Vicodin..

The chance of that oil feed line clogging is about the same as if any of the other oil passages clog.......very very little. The chances are higher for the line to ever break than to clog.

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I don't think either of us is in any position to state authoritatively and accurately what the probability is of the line clogging or breaking. All we can state with confidence is that if it clogged or broke, the Solution would seize up in a matter of seconds and the engine would be a goner. Given that according to the class action suit statistics there is a 92% probability that an un-modified OEM single row IMSB will not fail prematurely, all these retrofits are for peace of mind. And knowing my engine's survival hinges on that oil tube doesn't give me any more peace of mind than an open ceramic bearing lubed by immersion and splash.

I'm very confident that what I stated was accurate. My "oppinion" is based on working on all lkinds of engines for the better part of 25 years. It's a general observation but I feel it is still very valid even for these engines. Most piston engines work pretty much the same, with some variation, but the basics are the same. Oil passages don't clog up unless there is a serious problem with the engine. And if the engine has major problems, then the clogged oil line won't matter anyways.

Just out of curiosity, in your 25 years of wrenching on engines that you base your "oppinion" on, how many oil passageways have you seen that consisted of an approximately foot-long flexible hose running from an aftermarket oil filter adapter through a hand-cut hole in the bellhousing to an aftermarket flange?

I am rebuilding an M96 that had an LN bearing fitted within 1000 miles of the engine self destructing. The problem was not the LN ceramic bearing -it was perfect.The single row original was perfect also !. The problem was the P.O. (like so many noobs) was distracted by the IMS obsession and did not also evaluate the 23+(thanks Jake) other reasons an M96 can fail. If you 'do' the IMS but fail to evaluate other risk factors 'while-you-are-in-there' ,it can become (needlessly) very,very expensive. These 24 "Modes of Failure" of the M96 probably cause lots of dissatisfaction with Porsche cost of ownership . There is lots of info scattered around several Forums on the 24 modes of failure. But until Jake actually publishes his book,The M96/M97 Definitive Guide, there is no single source to give a checklist of all the remedial/preventative work required to guard against future engine failure. Meanwhile an attempt at such a checklist would make a very useful Sticky for this Forum ? To get the list started I'll offer one easy,no cost 'while you are in there check' .Measure the total(yes , left+right) free-play around the circumference of the DMF. Checking the friction plate and pressure plate is obvious but the DMF freeplay is often not mentioned or incorrectly measured.The LUK/Schaeffler site has useful info on this.

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There's gotta be an award for how many straw men can be put into one sentence.

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Is that Jakes brother?

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The slot in the case is about 3/4"x3/4". Located in the horizontal flange below the IMS cover. The oil filter adapter is billet aluminum. The SS braided line has swaged fittings and metal elbows and is about 8" long. Looks nicer than many of the SS brake lines. The passage and line are at least 1/8" ID and would take quite a bit to block. The design and operation of the bearing is the same as every lay shaft bearing in every flat six engine built by Porsche from the beginning P time.

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What material is the hose itself inside the SS braiding? And aren't brake lines considered a service item that need replacement at some interval short of the 200K+ miles/no-time-limit an engine is hoped to last? If the line ought to be considered a service item, replacement would require dropping the transmission just as it would for replacing the IMSB, wouldn't it? I did not know the ID was that large though. I agree, it would be hard to imagine it clogging up under normal circumstances. I haven't completely ruled out getting The Solution, just expressing my concerns. By the time I have 50K on my current LN bearing, the engine itself will have over 80K and the car will be 12 years old. I'm not even sure I'll keep the car past that, as my warranty will be expired and other potential repairs might well exceed the monetary value of the car unless the 997 starts to appreciate like the air cooleds.

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Ask Jake for questions like this. Concerns made up out of thin air aren't useful for your own understanding or others'. I can make up 50 more concerns about the car too without doing the work to understand which ones are realistic.

Not sure about the interior of the tube. I believe the brake lines are a Teflon tube and you're they are a wear item. I was just passing along what is installed on my engine to help clarify.

Some of us have the early 1999 or 2000 cars and the oil fed baring isn't an option. We get the splash oiled double roller and nothing else to think about.

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Uh, no. Starting with the Boxster/996 911 flat 6 engines the layshaft (IMS) was fitted with a roller bearing and the layshaft was full length. Previously the flat 6 engine had a plain bearing and the shaft was short. The layshaft in my Turbo's engine is gear driven, too, not chain driven.

this thread is finally going somewhere... There are numerous different opinions on the oil line in "The Solution" but does anyone actually have this installed and if so, how long has it been in there (miles/hours)? If not much feedback from owners of this kit, I think that it may be best to just go with the "tried and true" retro fit. I do agree that the retro bearing should be considered a wear item and should be replaced at certain intervals. Still, how many of you 996 owners found the stock bearing to be fine when it came out during the retro swap?

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I am in the process of breaking in the Solution on my 2003 C2. the installation followed an IMS bearing failure and engine rebuild. Someone more knowledgeable can correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure that the shaft end of the plain bearing used in the solution experiences the "immersion/spash lubrication" that you value. The oil feed simply insures continuous introduction of clean oil into the back end of that bearing. This "solution" seemed far more intuitive to me, and still does. I can check all of its wear parts pretty easily.

I guess no one like to see the IMS thread and prefer to start a "new one" why???

It's kinda ironic how many people worry about bearings and lines when there are cars that have over 200k on wheel bearings which get a lot of abuse(albeit seals/grease intact though) and brake lines that never get changed out for 200-300k miles and is under a lot more pressure. I also get mixed up between DOF and The Solution but isn't the oil filtered anyways when it comes to concerns about clogging? In terms of the line breaking, I would think that would be the least of your worries as you'd probably have a cracked block or oil pan at the least. Technically anything that moves or deteriorates can be considered a wear part. Do you plan on getting dentures as your teeth wears too? Also, they use these same lines in Nascar if that says anything. LOL Oh gawd, suckered into ANOTHER IXX post again...

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You are deflecting now. Clogged oil passages are extremly rare, regardless if they are external lines or internal. Why do I have the feeling that you are a plastic mechanic?

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Idk, maybe for the same reason you made this post, to deflect from answering a question you are unable to?

[QUOTE=911 carrera blue;11797437] I guess no one like to see the IMS thread and prefer to start a "new one" why??? This is a thread about LN's "The Solution" kit compared to their "Retro" bearing swap and people's experience/opinions on each. I am sure other members would appreciate this discussion if/when making a decision to address their IMS on their 996's.

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Good points!

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I didn�t answer because your were side tracking the discussion. You must be a lawyer or watched My Cousin Vinny too many times. But to answer it anyways, bearings are fed with external oil lines all the time in the heavy or industrial machinery industry and I�ve seen a few of those. Is this relevant to the topic at hand, NO!

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I'm just sticking to the classic Rennlist pattern...question is asked...opinions started...arguments arise...it gets off topic...some off topic pics thrown in... off topic remarks...boobie pics...if it goes further then something about unicorns...

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Yes I was talking about the plain bearing thanks for the corrections Mr. Perfect.

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I'm not, and there's no such a thing as watching it too many times

I am a lawyer and can confirm that you cannot watch that movie too often. EYE--DENT--ICK--UHLLL

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Somebody forget to take his nap?

You won't find a lot of owners here with the IMS Solution, but there are a few. If you really want to get feedback, email us and we'll contact a few owners and give them your email address or number and I am sure they will want to share their story with you. One has already posted in this thread, he just chose to stay anonymous. I originally invented this for my engines only; I never released it until all the copy cat band wagon IMS kits showed up on the market, and we decided to put them in their places. It took Charles from LN a LONG time to convince me to co- market the IMS Solution to distribution. The IMS Solution has been available on the open market for two years now, and for longer than that inside my reconstructed engines. For a long while I'd not even mention the IMS Solution to anyone until they had committed to an engine and sent their deposit in, then I'd give them an option and share something with them that they'd never heard of, or even seen before. The first time one of those cars went to a dealership for a shift cable repair, things got really interesting under the car. No one had a clue what it was. As for the oil line. Unless you own a rally 996, you won't have any issues. As part of our R&D Charles and I took a 7,800 mile trip to Edmonton AB Canada and 107 miles of that trip was on a dirt road. Out of the hundreds that have been sold, not one has had a road hazard issue. The ONLY ammo that the opposition has against the IMS Solution, is stating that the oil line is a vulnerability; because they KNOW that its what Porsche should have done, and they wish they would have invented and developed it before I did. Want to speak to at least two people that can argue this point? One of them has less than 1K miles on his story. I can arrange the meeting.

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Thanks for this, Jake. :thumb up: Really appreciate you addressing this!

I am glad to be one of those to chime in. I purchased a low mileage (28,000 miles),one owner, garage queen in August of last year. I had done my research and went in knowing that this 02 had the single row bearing and that I would be looking at doing some upgrade in the near future. Could have waited for the clutch to go but decided better to be proactive than reactive. I decided to get the work done last winter and I could have gone with the basic retrofit that had been around for a number of years, the IMS Solution that had been out a little over a year, or the new IMS Pro (double row replacement for my single row that had just been released. I talked to several members in my PCA club, read all of the forum posts on this site, read Tony Callas's write up from last fall on the IMS Solution, and finally, had some communication with Jake. I decided that I wanted to pay up a little and go with what I considered to be the final answer on this issue so that I didn't need to think about it anymore. IMS solution was installed in March and just changed the oil (JG DT40) after 3,500 miles. Engine runs great and I sleep better. Happy to discuss with you if that would help.

All the criticism about this thread being "just another IMS thread" is silly because I, for one, found this thread incredibly helpful, especially after Mr. Raby posted. So I went to the link for the "solution" and it says there are only a few mechanics certified to do this. Does that mean that my local independent P-car mechanic cannot do it?

I think you should call Jake Raby and ask?

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This is Rennlist. Members don't do that around here. Just like they'd rather ask about what's wrong with something a mechanic recently did instead of taking the car back and letting the mechanic fix it. Or asking about a problem they might have when they planned on all along taking it to a mechanic for their expert diagnosis rendering the thread they originally started practically useless. Or saying they heard a sound and have everyone chime in on all the terminal cases and theories while in the end finding out the noise was a small stone trapped in the calipers.

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No, it means that he isn't Certified and hasn't been trained or evaluated. It also means that he doesn't have to follow a code of conduct to maintain his certification. Certified Installers have something to lose and they are watched very closely, having to submit pictures and old bearings of each engine they retrofit. We endorse these people and hand select those to be evaluated on an invitation only basis from our hands on training classes. Normal shops have nothing to lose. They install a part and if something goes wrong they just throw their hands up and say the problem isn't theirs, that it's ours...

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Ouch! I've been a member for ten years, and even though you are right, it still hurts! I like to look on the forum as a group of guys shootin' the breeze and, while the information may sometimes be wrong, you can still learn from the other guys. It takes little effort for someone to type a reply to my answer -- I didn't think I was asking for too much. I have a call in to Raby now.

Some Forum members get irritated when Jake(or others) goes into technical details that they misconstrue as self promotion. I love it ! If like me you do all your own mechanical work, you'll probably really appreciate the time Jake takes to help us. The devilment of this M96 engine is in the small details that he harps on. Having 'done' an IMS bearing myself, I understand the many opportunities there are for an unscrupulous/lazy mechanic to do poor work that would cause a premature failure of a new IMS bearing. Jake might say it is "just procedural/sequential and fastitious" but some human nature prefers to cut corners and race against the All Data or OEM time clock for a job. That is part of the reason I do my own work.This is significant since I have an interest in an exotic car repair/service facility.The only mechanic there that I would allow to work on the M96 is also Jag/Aston Martin Master Tech. Wisely ,he declines to touch it ! When I first started working on the M96 I was rather dismissive of the required approach. Then ,after almost making a few blunders I was ready to discard the M96 & return to the engines I already understand. Eventually I realized that if you just follow the Raby Directives to the letter, it may be tedious but it works. The M96 is a flawed work of (mechanical) art. Fortunately Raby/LN sells us tools and parts to fix some of those flaws. If you ever assemble an M96 after a complete tear-down ,you'll appreciate the intricacies and be overwhelmed by the lack of information on how to ensure a successful build.So anyone who helps our community by giving information ,I applaud.

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I don't see any calls in our system, but did you leave a message at IMS solution from a 914 area code?

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Jake - I live in Dallas, TX. Looks like there is no one near that is certified? I know there are some great places like RAC Performance (used to be RUF). What does someone do if they like your solution best? Ship or drive to the nearest state that has certification? or I am assuming RAC can get the parts and I am on my own from the standpoint they are not certified?

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Any shop that buys from SSF, Worldpac, or IMC can get the parts, and they can do the work, but like I said, they are not Certified. Being able to "do the job" has many definitions, and most shops just want to power through and do the work, they don't pre qualify and they don't post evaluate as thoroughly as they should. Certified Installers are mandated to do these things and to be in constant contact with the IMS Solution team. If a Certified Installer makes a bad judgement call and retrofits an engine thats not worthy- we pull their Certification. We also ensure that purchasers are happy with the service the Certified Installers extend, and we'll pull a Certification if the shop has poor service and doesn't exhibit integrity. This happened to a NJ shop over a year ago, and we don't extend second chances to ruin our reputation. Fact: RAC has a car on their lot waiting to be shipped to my facility now. Lots of Texas cars come to us for the IMS Solution, we've done at least 20 this year so far from Texas. That said, in my latest hand's on class a group from Texas impressed Charles and I and were one of 4 people (out of 20) that were invited to start the Certified Installer evaluation process. I am awaiting their written evaluation back for review now, and then comes the rest of the evaluation, which may include a spontaneous visit to the shop; or could include the shop being tasked with a practical application evaluation of an IMS Solution Retrofit process. We don't make this easy. All in all anyone that hopes to become Certified has to attend the 16 hour WTI class to be qualified for my M96 102 Hands On Class, then attend that class, which is 40 more hours of hands on instruction. All in all I have someone in my presence for at least 56 hours before I even attempt to invite them to the Certification stages. Most of them don't even know they are being evaluated, until I drag them aside after the hands on class and put them in a small group of others that have also been chosen. Thats the way I like it. In my opinion, the way I structured this for the IMS Solution is how all the retrofit products should have been structured. It would have mandated training for all, evaluation for all, and a code of conduct for all; stating they'd not use retrofit products to "fix" engines that should not be repaired, and they they'd document the entire process to turn into the database. If this would have happened, I don't believe that any retrofit product would have failed to date. Anywhere from Texas to Georgia is under 500 bucks, and we we that haul at least monthly.

never mind

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Extension 627 :-) I have been home sick all week with a virus that brought me to my knees. I had to get some kind of work done, but if I went to the shop I'd just spread the funk and knock everyone out. So, I decided to stay home and work on the book, and try to get over this mess, so thats why I have been on the forum so much lately. BUT my New Year's resolution is to end all forum posts and visits, because its not good for my health. I get so mad that I can spit nails every time I make a visit. Your New Year's Resolution should be the IMS Solution. HA!

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Thanks Jake and I get what you are saying. Thanks for taking the time to post. I hope you feel better. Lets hope Texas gets some love!

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Yes, Jake. I did leave a msg at IMS from 914. Reading your response to my earlier post answered my question that was the reason for the call. I understand now why taking it to a certified shop is MUCH more desirable. My only problem with that is that to bring it to you or a certified mechanic will require me taking a half week off or spending upwards of $1500 shipping the car. These are enormous barriers for me. I know that revenue now is better than later, but maybe you could whisper me a hint if you know of a shop in the NY area being certified in the near future? That would be best for me and I would commit immediately. Shipping the car five or six states away gives me pause for obvious reasons.

Tlisotta, I didn't read what year your car is but if its an early 99 or 2000 and has the double row bearing the IMS SOLUTION can NOT be installed in those cars. The early cars get another double row bearing that is supposed to be good for at least 75000 miles and is splash lubricated. The Solution is a pressure lubricated plain bearing that Jake was initially only going to put in the engines his shop built but it can only be used in the cars that came with a single row bearing. This is all info I got when I was making my decision on having them do mine. I'm pretty sure its accurate as that was only a month ago and I think my memory span is still good for about that long. By the way they are a great shop to work with.

If the early and late bearings only have 1% failure...the problem is mostly about the cars in the middle with the 8% failure rate. I was chatting with a mechanic on the JUSTASK site and he said the basic reason the Turbo 996 does not have the IMS failure is because their bearing is lubricated with engine oil and is not a sealed bearing. If this is the plain and simple problem...which of the "fixes" best emulates the 996 Turbo bearing lubrication design? LN? EPS? Others? Alternately...if the early (twin row) and late (large single) IMS bearings only suffer a 1% failure rate vs the second generation small single bearing with an 8% failure rate, which year/engines did the large single bearing come into service? And which sealed bearing solution best matches or exceeds the factory OEM large bearing and can be fitted into cars with the small single bearings? Lastly...and the thing that keeps me curious about all this...is the fact that the bearings with the highest failure rate of 8% also have a survival rate of 92%...which means the odds are GREATLY in favor of them not failing.

John, it takes a while for a failure to happen. During that time if yours is one the ones thats going to eventually fail it will be shedding metal. You will only see the metal caught in the filter, some will be bypassed and will be effing up bearings. A stock dual row lasts longer which means it can be shedding metal longer before it fails completely. Of course many bearings are doing just fine and shedding nothing. In the short time I've been on this site there's been some complete failures. The ODDS are that your car will be fine. I chose to replace my bearing and even went to the extreme of shipping my car all the way to Jakes shop. I had no metal in anything but I'm planning on keeping the car many years regardless of how many miles I drive it and I just didn't want to have the issue on my mind.

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Thanks JD. I am in the hunt for a 2002 - 2004. I may look at 2005 997s as well. So - factoring in the cost of the replacement is on my mind. Thanks for the reply. The good news is hopefully a shop in Texas will get certified.

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This should be other members resolution too for all the worry warts on here as well. Hate to see elevated blood pressure levels, ulcers, migraines, etc . all over a car.

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LOL, I can safely say these are the "mechanics" that would least likely pass Jakes certification, let alone hand out sound advice.

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I think you mean Rake Jaby.

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Its a completely different design for the intermediate or layshaft. Not to mention one is a plain bearing. the ims solutions mimics this but the overall design is just different.

I see the same basic (incorrect) conclusions posted over and over and over again. While it is obviously true that the IMS issue is overblown, you guys who keep quoting "only X percent of cars have the issue" need to think that through. Only X percent of cars had the issue at a specific point in time. Time has now run forward. It's ridiculous to think that the numbers reflect current reality - so please quit it with the 2%, or 3.14%, or whatever other numbers you've cooked up in your head to convince yourself of whatever you wanted to believe. Everyone knows what happens if something goes south, so just decide if you're willing to stomach the risk - but the fictitious stats just have to go.

Yea, Porsche's accounting of failures is going to be low even if they aren't trying to downplay the figures. There is no way to know how many owners had a 996, engine was destroyed by IMSB failure out of warranty period, and all they know is their mechanic told them it was new engine time and they walked away from it without ever having their incident added to the tally.

Regardless of who said what, the number of failed somethings will continue to grow over time as long as there are >0 somethings still in use. The numbers people have dug up/made up are, at best, a snapshot of reality at a specific time in the past.

While it might be fun to psychoanalyze the posters here, it might be more productive to answer the questions. 1. Which of the "fixes" best emulates the 996 Turbo bearing lubrication design? LN? EPS? Others? 2. Which year/engines did the large single bearing come into service? 3. Which sealed bearing solution best matches or exceeds the factory OEM large bearing and can be fitted into cars with the small single bearings? I bring up the percentages of failures and non-failures because they do reflect that some designs were better than others, and solutions that do not change the basic design may offer no more security than the original bearings. While for the moment I am not changing my bearing, I see no reason not to continue investigating all the options that are available...and to explore more fully the explanations as to the source of failures. Oil contamination of the sealed bearing grease is one explanation. Low oil levels leading to low oil pressure at the cam chain gear is another. Bearing design size is another (based on which version fails the most). Saying "we already talked about it before, read the old threads" is not an answer that I find satisfactory. Those who don't like IMS threads know that they don't have to read them. Those who are curious and want to discuss it should not be intimidated by attempts at ridicule from forum members who think this is all below them.

Yep. The low number of double row failures has an empty echo at my house, where the failure rate is hovering right at 100%. My car was running perfectly with no rattle and I found metal in the filter (what now seems to be a small amount compared to some pictures I've seen). My pan was clean. My bearing was full of glitter, but spun "okay". Initially I hoped to install a new bearing and flush. It was that single line item from Jake "please use a competitors product" which caused me to suck it up and tear down the engine. Damn glad I did. My main and rod bearings were quite worn, my #6 rod bearing had taken at least one turn around the crank, two of my six oil spray nozzles were plugged solid, two barely worked. My chain ramps were quite tired. I've had the entire mess ultrasonically cleaned (again, on Jake's advice), had my crank polished and maganfluxed and started collecting the parts. My bearing carrier is back together and my crank spins and measures out beautifully. I have several hundred dollars worth of parts and tools on my christmas wish list. If santa doesn't come through I'll have some smoking plastic in my wallet by the new year.

That's a shame.

I agree with 5CHN3LL that the percentage numbers don't mean anything. They are always changing and they were probably never accurate anyway. The bottom line as he said is "are you willing to stomach the risk". I completely disagree that it's "obvious the IMS issue is overblown" but thats just my opinion amongst all the others. John Ireland most of the answers to your questions are not hard to find, but they are all just speculation. My personal opinion is the factory had some problems with the original double row bearing but they had many many more with the single row bearing. Its just speculation but many say the sealed bearings original grease dried up, some say it washed away. Jake thinks it needs to be not sealed on one side so that oil can get on it. I tend to go with what Jake thinks since he has devoted hundreds maybe thousands of hours to this problem. However if Jake thought his fix was as good as it could get he would not have developed the SOLUTION which is a plain bearing fed under pressure. Once again I agree with him and think that is the ultimate fix for the issue. Unfortunately the engines with the original double row bearing can not be fitted with that modification. It all really comes down to what you can stomach. Plenty of owners can stomach the thing without a fix with great results some wish they hadn't, back to square one.

The Rennlist 5-Step IMSB Program 1) A guy acquires a 996. 2) The guy posts a passel of "never-before-considered" IMS theory. Also, Earth is round, fire hot. 3) The guy: A) Retrofits bearing B) Says, "psh" at retrofit, but magically needs new clutch within months, "might as well, since it's apart anyway" 4) The guy thinks about other stuff for a while. 5) The guy bitches about n00bs creating new IMS threads.

Alternatively, there's the accelerated program for advanced students: 1) A guy acquires a 996. 2) The guy freaks out, disassembles and reassembles his 996 so obsessively that a tweaker would be impressed, and ultimately sells it after 200 miles and $10,000 worth of preventive maintenance. Pelican and other parts vendors high-five.

Another scenario. The guy buys a 996. The guy reads the threads and finds out about the issues. The guy says 92% or whatever have no problems, these guys are just crazy. His car blows up and he posts again about the price of rollers or other options. The guys from pelican parts still don't high five, they never have!

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Some of us ought to be getting Christmas fruit baskets from Pelican.

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Do you have a thread documenting your work? It would be nice to have something with pictures for future reference. Engine refresh/rebuild threads are very rare in this forum. Including mine, maybe there is a handfull more.

Here's an interesting read: http://truedelta.kinja.com/a-pin-les...man-1672108784 I saw the link from a recent thread here and thought some of you might want to check it out. It talks about the recent reported IMSB failures compared to those earlier reported.

I have no idea where that author came up with his statistics. He'll be getting a message soon asking for the data, and we'll be verifying that those two cases that had a retrofit bearing fail weren't already failing beforehand. I've had more IMSB failure calls this week than he claims in his entire "study". Maybe he should come answer our phones and emails for a week, and make the entries into the failure log.

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Jake, one of the 2014 failure reports is mine and we already know the circumstances: replacement of an already failing bearing, not a preventative action.

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Mike, thanks for that point and clarification. Looks like someone should consider amending an article to include further clarification.

The "study" doesn't purport to capture every 996, only a certain number and then tracked them. Extrapolating from that data would be like determining national death rates from one high school reunion attendance figures.

The hype over the IMSB is misleading . The Internet babble will delude buyers and owners into thinking the bearing is the only fatal flaw in the M96 they need to check . Rennlist students of the M96 experts know there are at least 29 other Modes of Failure. Ignoring those 29 and fixating on the IMSB is the biggest risk of all imho. Rennlist serves a great purpose in alerting prospective buyers and existing owners of those expensive risks.

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So you have had over 200 IMSB failure calls this week? b-man

That's not even close to a fair response to his comment.

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I'm simply trying to get a handle on the statistical information surrounding this issue without having to spend years researching it. As background, I'm a 996 owner with just over 230K miles on my car (original owner, second engine). b-man

The "study" identified a few failures. Jake is saying he's had more than a few failures this week; Jake isn't saying he has had over 200 failures this week. The simple answer is that the data is entirely too imperfect to draw any reliable conclusions from apart from the conclusion that you already know -- it sometimes happens.

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Yes, but it's on the hair dresser convertible forum. Sorry. You can shower after reading. http://986forum.com/forums/diy-proje...e-rebuild.html I haven't posted to it in a while because I've been in parts collection mode. I get the entire holiday week off so I'll likely do some updating then and show some progress. For anyone who does go read it, I used the term "rebuild" but it's really an IRAN (inspect and replace as necessary). I'd like to enjoy my car for a while and know it's not going to machine itself into a smoking pile without blowing a ton of cash. It will not be perfect or "rebuilt" as Jake defines it. In my world rebuild and overhaul are interchangeable and what Jake does would be called a "zero time remanufacture", with critical reliability mods. In other words much better than new. With apologies for the terminology - my car will be a used engine with fresh bearings, rings, seals and better rod bolts. It will have no quantity of unknown metal floating around inside. No assurance that I won't be back in it later, and if it breaks it certainly won't be the fault of any parts manufacturers or advice I received. I'm learning a ton that I'll be able to apply to my next engine. I'll definitely be attending Jake's class before I get to my second effort. I'm expecting some real face palm moments. RE: failure modes Of those 20-something failure modes I tend to discount ones like RMS, AOS, etc. They are failures of course, and an irritant to someone paying Gunter to keep the car on the road. But a dripping RMS doesn't cause your car to blow up unless you let it run out of oil, in which case the real failure was cranial. Porous castings, poorly done factory weld repairs - those are just pathetic manufacturing. I'd be pissed if, heaven forbid I ever own one, a Hyundai had that. And they probably don't. IMS, timing chain failure, rod bolt failure, D-chunk - those things all boat anchor an engine quicker than you can say "please pass the schnitzel". With the exception of timing chain failure (which, depending on mode of failure, could also be considered a manufacturing defect) are all design flaws. Those areas are where people like Jake and Charles deserve the most credit for engineering solutions to those flaws, and I definitely appreciate their efforts.

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Great thread you've got going. You and I are not that far apart in the same project. My engine is on the engine stand, all stripped down to the heads. I have the week off between Christmas and New Year and also planning to do nothing but work on it. Thanks for documenting, I'm updating my thread as I'm progressing too.

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Exactly why I decided to just invest in an extended warranty from a reputable carrier my credit union referred me to rather than drop $2.5-$3k for a bearing swap and still no promise that all will be well. I picked up a 4yr/48k ADDITIONAL mileage warranty for a little north of an IMSB job. The extended warranty also says if any factory parts are modified or changed for aftermarket ones, it may void coverage. So this persuaded me to just leave everything stock. There is no deductible. In the event of a blown block, they will cover up to the ACV of the vehicle, which today mine is near $28k...more than enough to have the dealer drop a new one in.