Adventures in Porsche shopping...

So I've been looking for a 911 cab (see this thread ) and it really does get discouraging sometimes. Thanks to everyone who has contributed comments. I never did look at the green cab in the link above; the mileage was a little high for me and it's far enough away to make it inconvient to just go look at it. Especially when I didn't have a good vibe on it (as many posters to the thread also mentioned). So I spent Saturday morning at the dealer. Looked at a new '06 cab, marked down almost 10K off of sticker, but I just can't get over the 997 interior. It looks too much like a Chrysler, all those sharp angles and cheap feeling plastic. Looked at and test drove a 2003 cab, red/black, which my GF thought was too red and just screams mid-life crisis. It had 15K miles but the transmission was extremely stiff. Made me wonder if the PO was a bit ham-fisted. Paint and interior was good, above average. Friday I had looked at a '99 cab, only 20K but the interior looked too worn for that kind of mileage, the PO (a woman) must have had a dog or something, and that it looked like she dragged her heels on the door sill, console was all scratched up, seats worn (as if they were never cared for or cleaned). $40K for that jewel. So back to the '03, they wanted $64K with CPO, and we started negotiating. When the salesman came back with 62K and a load of B.S. about how they had to put on new rear tires and do the 15K service to get it CPO'd, I got ticked-off. Come on, any reputable dealer is going to do that before selling it, regardless of a CPO. Right? Gawd, I hate car salesmen. They're all nice and buddy-buddy, your newest, bestest friend, and then when you start to negotiate, they start lying and try to confuse and play all their games... argh! So I went and looked at a 2002 later that day from an individual. This car has 25K miles, seal grey with grey interior and black top, upgraded stereo, supple leather, memory, technic, windscreen, 18" wheels, CD changer, heated seats (gotta have my warm buns! ) and it is immacualte. Perfect. Very minor scratches in the hood from polishing (could only see them if the light was ever-so-perfect) but the seats, the carpet, the top, the paint, the trim, the interior plastics, everything was perfect. Wow. Drove like a dream too. Owner is a car collector, never drives the 911 so he's selling. But he's not giving it away, and it's so expensive that I'm embarrassed to list it here. But I think I'm going to buy it, it is such a nice car. And CPO warrantied, so that's worth a few bills to me. And I like the colors. Sunday I get a call from a guy that I had called Saturday morning, he's back in town, if I want to come look at the car. He doesn't want me to come to his house, so we meet in a parking lot. Triple black 2002 cab, looks nice, the paint is shiny but not quite as "deep" as a really nice black Porsche can be, if you know what I mean. With 28K the interior is showing some wear, but not bad. The guy is talking, yak, yak, yak, and I can barely get a word in edge-wise. "Why are you selling it?" I ask. Something about he's out of work for a year, bought a beach house, a plane, a Hummer and a Jeep. "So sell the Jeep" I say. "Ha, ha, no I've got this plane and I should have been working in March but now it's looking like September..." his story just isn't adding up. And he reminds me that he also bought a plane. I'm starting to dislike him. So he gets in the car and puts the top down, mouth running a mile a minute, and I say "let's take it for a spin" so he motions to the door and says "get in". I want to drive, I say. "No, no, can't do that, insurance you know." I'm puzzled. "Well, there's not much point..." I start to say and he throws it in gear and takes off, yelling at me "sorry to waste your time." WTF? I'm just standing there, in the parking lot, dumbfounded! You've got to be kidding me! We could discuss it, maybe? How about, if you're serious about buying it, and we agree on a price and you have the car checked out and financing arranged, then you can drive it? Or maybe, we talk a bit more and I get a feel for you and then maybe you can drive it? Or, or... heck, anything! I've bought and sold a lot of cars, and you get a feel for people and there are some (like 19 year old kids) that don't get to drive the car under any circumstances, and then there are the guys who drive the car and buy it before they turn the key off. But you don't act like that, not if you're a normal person. Something fishy was up with that guy, I think. So, I'm really leaning toward the incredibly expensive 2002 seal grey cab. Michael

Tough story... can you talk the P dealer down a little to the high fifities (which is what I paid for my CPO`ed 2003 cab). Good luck, don't get frustrated... the perfect car is sitting somewhere out there waiting for you! PS where in NC do you live... I'm in CLT

Come on Michael, what is the 02 priced at?

I wouldn't buy the last gallon of gas in the world from that jerk-off.

IMO, if you're going to pay what you feel is too much for the Seal Grey Cab, you might as well just purchase a CPO'd Cab from a dealership. Why not do a National Pre-Owned Search on the Porsche website?

OK, I'll answer all the questions... I'm in Cary. The price is 55K for the 02 cab. With all options and mileage, KBB says 57,300 retail, 50,795 private party. And I don't see any advantage to buying the car from the dealership versus a CPO car from an individual who bought it from the dealership a year ago. The only "protection" I get from the dealer is if it turns out to be a flood vehicle or something like that undisclosed on the title. Which I really don't think it is, it's just too nice. Regardless, a PPI will be forthcoming. I'm calling the dealership in a few minutes to get service history on it. Michael

Micheal, where are you going to get your PPI done? European Performance?

I tried that last week, the web site wasn't working. But based on the range of conditions of cars that I saw this weekend, CPO cars at that, I'm now not even going to consider a car that's not local. CPO means mechanical inspections, it's got nothing to do with cosmetics or how "tight" the car feels. I think you guys know what I mean. Some cars just feel better than others. Can I get an amen? Michael

I figured the dealership would be adequate. European performance... ah, I've heard good and bad about them. Do you have first-hand experience with them? Michael

I was just quoted $56k for an 03, CPO coupe with 22k miles. Another price point for you.

I haven't heard any bad and nothing but good. I deal with a guy name Tolga. I haven't done much with them but another guy here on the board uses them EXCLUSIVELY for his cars (997TT, 996GT3, 996Cup Car) and he has nothing but great things to say about them. It who I will use for everything as well.

i live in wake forest and was at that dealership last week..i think i know the car..tolga is very good at european performance..i also think you can get the car for less..maybe much less..they seem to want to sell cars there..j

If you think the price is much too high, I say wait it out until you find a car that comes close to everything you're looking for. I've been shopping for a 996 since June and it feels like it's been a while. I know it'll be worth it soon though.

I don't think the car he is interested in is one of the cars at European Perf but rather he might take it there for the PPI.

Well, I called the service guy and got the history on the car. It had the RMS replaced summer of '05 (I can't decide if that's a good thing or a bad thing) and no other significant repairs, just little stuff. However, he could not find a record that it was covered under the CPO warranty, so something is up with that. I don't think the seller was lying to me, I think someone screwed-up somewhere, so I'll let him know. But it's a moot point. I've decided that it's just too expensive. A super-nice car, the nicest I've seen, but I just can't justify the money. So the search will continue. Maybe something along the lines of a 964,so I can tinker with it. Constantly. Oh - my salesman called me back yesterday too. Wanted to know when I was coming to buy the car. I told him it wasn't going to happen. And - when I left him Saturday, I told him that he needed to get the price down, and he said, and I quote: "I'll work on it". So I asked him Monday what he had gotten the price down to. "What do you care?" he asked, "you're buying the other one." "True," I replied, "but I'm just curious." He said, "oh, well I didn't even try." So much for his word. Thanks all for the advice and kind words. Michael

What an @ss! You hadn't made a deal with ANYBODY at that point and the right number from him might have swayed you back to his car. Who was it that you were dealing with at the dealer? Was it at Leith? I haven't bought here in NC so it would be nice to know who NOT to work with Be patient, you WILL find the perfect car for you.

Frankly, an 02 cab with every option imaginable and low miles for 55k ain't bad. Check out the original MSRP and work from a percentage basis. It sounds like this car has a lot more options than a lot of the other cars out their and if it's in PERFECT condition, than that's a premium I'll pay...particularly from a private owner, who you talked to in detail and seems to have loved and cared for the car.

Man, I'd already talked myself out of this car, and here you go talking me back into it!!! Thanks for the comments though. Maybe if the CPO situation gets straightened out and I make a bundle in the market and he lowers the price and... and... Michael

Yes, it was Leith in Cary. I've bought several cars (BMW, Jag, Acura) from their dealerships and they are greedy *****. Otherwise they've been pretty straight with me, no games (other than their ridiculous and greedy $395 "doc fee") but they are greedy, greedy, greedy, give me more money, I want more money, money, money, I want more money. Not that there's anything wrong with that. Michael

Hmmm. Guess what happened? No, I didn't make any money in the market. But he did call me back with a lower price, and got the CPO mess straightened out. So I'm picking it up tomorrow! Gotta change my handle. And my signature. I know I can't change my username, but how do I change the sig? I cannot find a link on any of the CP pages. Michael

Michael, you need to be a paid Rennlist Member to have a sig.

I must be "grandfathered in" because I have a sig, I just can't change it. One of these days I will become a member. Right now, for obvious reasons, I don't have the money. Michael

I don't see a sig in your posts. What are you referring to? If it is the North Carolina thing that is in your profile not sig.

[Image-only post; no author-written text. Original image references:] https://rennlist.com/forums/graemlins/banghead.gif

Nah, I can see the sig when I preview my posts, but now I see that it doesn't show up in the thread. I know the difference between the profile and sig, thanks. Not a biggee. Not sure what nycebo is beating his head over. Michael --------------------------------------- 996 on the way 993 gone but not forgotten 964 gone and forgotten

Forgot to take his meds

Don't worry Dell, by 6p I'll be having my 'liquid' meds.

[Image-only post; no author-written text. Original image references:] https://rennlist.com/forums/graemlins/drink.gif

Try the site again, it worked the day I posted originally.. My search began with months of looking on autotrader. Then one day I decided to try a dealership. I went to the Porsche.com site and found one that was about 2k more than I wanted to spend. They hadn't even posted a pict yet. When they did I sent one of my Ohio friends to go check it out. And the Dealership CPo'd it and gave me the 2k off. I guess I got lucky.

MJBird: Glad you're getting the car you really want. Too many people put price above anything else. It's like they are shopping for a deal or a bargain and the actual car becomes secondary. As you know, a truly good car in every regard is difficult to come by and when finally found you need to often move rather quickly or somone else will buy it. Paying more for a good car only shows that you appreciate quality merchandise and know value. It seems like on every thread everyone has opinions as to how much a given year of car is worth when they have virtually no knowledge of its condition, history, equipment, geographical market or other factors that would influence its value. It's easy to down play the value when you are not looking at purchasing a like item or it's not in fromt of you to do a first hand appraisel. Another thing is that these cars are an emotional experience as far as the purchase rather than a necessity and how a particular car affects your emotions has to do with your preceived values. If you can afford it, you know if it's right for you. Congratulations!

Thanks Nick, and everyone else. Final note: the financing was my last hurdle. I found the best rate via BMW Financial Services. They now do a private party financing deal for us "upper tier" customers. 7.6% which was much better than anything else that I found. However, it was going to be a real PITA to get the paperwork processed, notarized bill of sale faxed to them before my check could be authorized, and the seller had the car in his company name but wanted the check written to him... so I just used my home equity LOC and some cash and did it that way. Oh, and I was wrong, the car isn't seal gray, it's that other gray. Basalt? I forgot already. argh. The mind is the second thing to go, you know. Michael

Very well said Nick. I just bought an '02 C4S a couple of weeks ago (from a dealer) and just knew the first time I saw it, it was the right car. There was some back and forth, and in the end maybe I paid a little too much, but I have the the one that "spoke" to me. Cliff

You should at least be able to deduct the interest going through your home equity LOC. Nice looking car.

Congrat's on the new car. It took me over 10 months to get what I was looking for, but I smile every day I drive it! I see you are in Cary, do you ever make it to the local PCA stuff. Every Saturday morning we have coffee at the Caribou at Briar Creek (non-PCA members welcome).