Speechless after Test Drive

Ok so I don't know if I am over-reacting or where to even begin, so here we go. About 4 months ago I put my car for sale just to see if I get any takers. This was pre-mod bug bite. I basically have been having so much fun modding the car that I forgot to take the car down off the website. I get a call the other day asking if this guy could take it for a test drive. I say sure. We meet today and he pulls up in his 1990 Carrera and it is very nice. He is trying to sell it as well. Anyways, he gets in the car, starts it up, and immediately takes off, almost stalling the car...it must be a VERY different clutch in his car because I would say it was like his first week of driving stick. We start to go on the highway, and he is EXTREMELY hard on the clutch i.e. downshifting and being brutal on the syncros...instead of RPM matching he is literally just dropping it. NOT GOOD. OVER AND OVER AGAIN. So after raping the car for a good 10 minutes on the HW we finally get to some off-HW driving and start having a conversation. He mentions that someone took his car for a test drive the other day and "didnt even drive it to it's fullest potential". I would call this being polite and respectful of other people's BEAUTIFUL and EXPENSIVE BELONGINGS. Maybe it is just me? I baby my car, do not track it, and just felt like I got out of a 6 months stay in prison once we got off the HW. Is this normal to do? Has anyone else experienced this before i.e. someone else just absolutely ruins 20 minutes of your time with your Porsche? Again, maybe this is normal but I am NOT used to it and certainly don't ever abuse it like he did. NOR would I ever abuse someone else's car! And I understand if you KNOW WHAT YOU ARE DOING then fine but instead he reminded me of a 16 yr old who just learned how to drive stick (barely) and though he was Johnny Nascar even though he AWEFUL. So for the finale, I just installed my front bumper and lip a few weeks ago. We ZOOM up to the parking spot and CRUNCH. He nails the curb. It is completely scraped underneath now and has some scratches on the front of it - not to mention 3 screws were stripped from it bending so much. This might not be fixable and I might have to now buy a whole new lip/paint match = a few hundred bucks!!!!! Am I just WAY too over-protective of my car or what? Needless to say, the car is NOT for sale anymore

I probably would have punched the *** in the side of his clueless head.

take my word for it...next time someone wants to take YOUR car for a test drive, you should be the test driver and the presepective buyer be on the passenger seat. Tell the IDIOT that he needs to pay for the repairs. Also never let anyone valet park your car...

I tried my best to keep my cool, but it wasn't easy...I was basically in shock I think.

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Point well taken.

Fortunately for him, I am not one to press charges, etc. I would rather just try and fix it myself...hopefully I can buff and paint touch up a bit and it will look fine. LESSON LEARNED and hopefully this thread will help other people with what not to do when looking to sell.

Also, I have NEVER hit the redline limit once since owning the car - he definitely did MORE than once. When pulling the test does it show what date and time the redline was hit? Probably not, but just curious. I just emailed him with pictures attached, told him I would try and fix it myself this weekend, and will follow up with him next week if it requires more work.

Honestly, I don't know how you avoid *** hole test drivers if you're going to sell your car quickly. Holding out for the buyer who will buy without driving could take awhile. Sorry about this situation. I read this thread thinking that you had just driven some super car, not that yours had been brutally raped (a vivid and probably accurate image!).

Lesson learned the hard way...

I don't understand how you didn't tell him to take it easy the minute he started driving aggressively. If you want to test the full potential of a car do it in your own car. When you're in someone else car you check to make sure everything is functioning and there are no problems. You're testing this example of the car to make sure it's okay for purchase, not testing the car to see what it can possibly do.

was he serious about buying? did he even warm the car up? He sounds like an A-hole... but FWIW, Porsche guys will try to at least feel the pull and handling of the car... but not actually beat on the car and hit the limiter... He might even be an aircooled high high horse type of guy...

How do drive pretty much any 911 that has a functioning engine and four inflated tires "to its fullest potential" on a public highway and not be thrown, not just in the jail, but completely under the jail? That guy's a complete idiot and I'm sorry he owns a P-car.

Wow. I think I might have asked him to pull over and swap seats the second I was uncomfortable. Send him a copy of the estimate for the repair.

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It warmed up for maybe 30 secs. Not good. I understand you want to test it to a certain extent, but no need to hit the limiter multiple times, especially in heavy traffic...I can't believe I made it out of there alive!

What was his reaction when he hit the curb? Did he seem interested in buying your car or was he just taking it for a joy ride? I'd be pissed as well, and I drive my car hard when the time is right. In my mind there is a big difference between driving a car "hard" and abusing it. If this guy was just slamming through the gears (and curbs) is seems that he either lacks the ability to drive or at a minimum lacks basic human decency buy showing such a lack of respect for your property. Of course it's hard to say how hard he was actually being or your car. I'm sure if a pro driver took me out for a ride in my car I might feel be a bit (lot) shocked at how much farther he could push it than I could. If I take a car out for a test drive, I first make sure that I'm serious about buying, not joy riding, not time wasting. That being said I would carefully, w/ the owners consent, test the reasonable limits of the car to make sure all seems to be in proper working order. The last car we sold privately was my wife's Acura Legend with a manual transmission. On the first test drive a potential buyer assured me he knew how to drive a stick. By the end of the first block of the drive he had made it perfectly clear that he didn't, and I made it clear that the test was finished. Regards, Aron

I would have asked to drive HIS car! Let's see how those valve guides work at high RPM's making a sweeping right turn! What a douche that guy is!

The guy was an ***. Being a sales person I've been on a few test drives and these aren't my personal cars. I've asked one person to pull over, pulled the keys and announced that the test drive was over. Probably what you should've done, but I understand being in shock. Most people are quite the opposite - I have to ask them to get on it and push the car. You don't get that sh*t eating grin w/out pushing it, but that's far from abuse. Sorry you had such a bad experience.

I've had a few people test drive my car this past summer. Nobody drove like you described, but a couple were spirited. I was white knuckled with all of them. I kept thinking, they need to see what it will do under stress, but it's still my car! If someone bashed the bumper into a curb I'd shove their face into the damage so they could see up close what they'd be paying to fix. Either that or go by the axiom you break it, you bought it.

I appreciate everyone's .02. I will gather an estimate for the part as well as the paint/install, but my guess is that I will have to eat this one. With some re-finish and touch up paint and a re-install it should be fine...but I will have that feeling of "I know where it is even though no one else knows it is there" and now my girlfriend will,once again, think I am crazy because "it looks fine and no one will notice it"...BUT I DO! Ah, the joys of owning a P-car I will send the estimate tomorrow and see what kind of response I get, my guess is it will be a good one.

My wife totally does not understand either

Man, I am really sorry to hear about that. I'd say you had a LOT more patience with the guy than I would have. I would have told him in no uncertain terms to back off, and I would've done it within seconds of realizing what he was attempting to do. There is no need to abuse someone's car like that. It's just wrong on so many levels. Also, is he a Rennlister or Pelican? If so, he should be outed.

Hey, you said his car is for sale? Maybe we need to send someone to ..uh... "test drive" it! I give you allot of credit, I would have went totally ape$h*t on the guy!

Wow, is all I have to say. If you see him the future, tell him you want to drive his car and do this. Take it up to redline in 3rd and put it back into 2nd gear and quickly let the clutch back out, his exhaust valves will be bent in a millisecond...........(see my sig) The thing is, it really works and he wont do that again to your car........of course his will not run just kidding

Wow, what a story! When I test drive I am SO careful. I can see how you got caught off guard. When someone is such a jerk my first reaction is disbelief and only later do I think of a better course of action. Kind of a shell-shocked reaction, I guess.

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His reaction was "that's not good" and he actually admitted to the damage when we looked at it outside. He then said that he like it but the wheels are too "blingy" for his taste (Porsche OEM SPORTS??!?!?) and that the exhaust was "too loud" - I have a QUIET Fabspeed!!! And driving the car like that is OBVIOUSLY going to be VERY loud

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Yeah...can you believe this Jon? I am still in trauma over it! Thanks for the email links BTW.

I cringe when I'm riding with other people in their own car, and they don't rev-match when downshifting - can't imagine some jack-*** doing that to my baby. He probably thinks he's a good driver, too.

That is a horrible story -- Im not sure I would not be able to restrain myself from punching that jerk. However, to make you feel a least a little better... its not just potential buyers you need to worry about. The other night I let a VERY close friend drive my car because I had just installed the B&M SSK and wanted him to try it out. He also owns an expensive sports car so I assumed the best... he drove very conservatively until the HW, then when he blipped to downshift - he'd blip to like 6, downshift and drop the clutch going WOT almost instantly. Over and over. When we got out of the car he said "hmmmmm, whats that smell??". LOL. I laughed about it - wanting him to have fun. But being in the passenger seat while your car gets abused is like seeing your girl get manhandled by some other guy right in front of you.

Best thing to do when selling your car, is to drive the car first with the potential customer as your passenger. Use that time to orient them to what the car is all about and set the parameters of how you expect them to drive by demonstrating it yourself. Always ask a few times if they are comfortable driving a 6-speed and if they've ever driven a 996 before and what, if any were their previous impressions of the car. If the customer balks at not letting him drive first, wants to go alone or with a buddy (NEVER!) or at not "trusting" him, then they're usually not serious buyers and just want to go for joyrides. It's not their car until money and tittle change hands so they have absolutely no rights to the vehicle. This is what we teach the dealers we train and they get much safer and satisfactory demo drives out of using these techniques.

Ouch! Yup, I think I would have ripped him a new one. I've always wondered how one should handled test drives on a private sale - I guess I just found out what not to do.

No more test drives. Buy as seen or go away. Jay

Wow, sorry to hear about your experience. However, I must admit that your story is pretty insightful for me. I'm contemplating the best way to sell my car, trade-in at the stealer, sell it through auction, or private sell. This thread is causing me to lean more towards options 1& 2.

I've only done one private sale in the past and it was such a hassle that I've always traded with the dealer since then. ...one person phrased it well - all sellers think their car is gold and all buyers think that the car they're looking at is crap.

Man this thread filled right up.... I had a lot of reading to do........ WHAT AN ***! I sold my old truck last summer and it was terrible too. I owned it for 14 years and treated it with respect. Had 175k miles, original clutch and motor never touched. I drove all but 10k miles as I bought it pre-owned. There was a nice man and his son that took it for a drive. Since the truck was too small for 3, I let them go alone....When that came back the truck was obviously ran hard...(I knew the truck too well not to notice the smell) Also the windshield had about 10 rock chips in it like they got behind a semi and just rode his *** while he dropped rocks on the truck, hood chipped, front chipped... I WAS PISSED but had no real proof... The good news is, a week later another guy came over, took one look.... knew I wasnt lieing about the truck, condition and such, bought it w/o even driving it.... though I insisted he take it to the back to get the money at least......... SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO maybe the next guy will be your buyer..... The last guy should be beaten and posted on the roadside for trick or treater to throw rotten apples at I agree with everyone above and feel your pain, GL with your next guy, you are good and good things will come to you Whew, long winded Ed

That really sucks. I would have had him pull over the second time he didn't shift properly. Hitting the curb is when I would lose it and would have laid him out in the street.

Thanks for all the support guys. You live and learn I guess - if anything came out of it, I now appreciate the car that much more and am deciding to keep it for a long time to come My dad, being an attorney in Chicago now for 45 years, absolutely cracked up at my story. He said good lesson learned and I should feel fortunate that I am not sitting in an ER with tubes in my body and a wrecked car that insurance probably wouldn't ultimately cover. Typical "worst case scenario" attorney talk and fatherly lecture. Gotta love it. Update: I am going to send him the estimate from the body shop tomorrow , copy my attorney, and see what happens. I am hoping he picks up the bill, as he should. He even admitted to doing it right when we looked at the front of the car. If he is NOT willing to pick it up, I will let the Porsche world know his name and the exact car he is trying to sell, as I figure that is what he deserves. I certainly wouldn't want to be the one buying his car after seeing the way he has treated it for all these years. Hopefully we can avoid all of it and he can man up to making the mistake and pay the damages

Very good.

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I find that, when I don't react when someone does some type of wrong doing to me, I then get upset at myself for a long time, increasing my chances of heart disease. You maybe a nice guy, but the war was already set by this guy, so now you should go to battle. I hope you will win. Either way, you should let us know who he is, so nobody here gets the same, or worse, someone gets hurt.

Man, you have a lot of patience with this guy, I also hope he will at least pick-up the tab for the front spoiler repair. Afterall that is the least he can do. Thanks for sharing your story, now most of us know what to do in such situations. For me if I decide to sale mine one day, big "IF" because I plan to keep it as long as I can, I may just consider selling it to a friend and family member or worst "trade-in" even at a lower price but at least I know my car will be better off and for me to avoid this kind of aggravations. Cheers,

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I agree with your dad, it could have been worse... and it could have gotten worse quick. I think letting us know of his name will aid your cause.

what my alter ego would have done.... grabbed the wheel and karate chopped him in the throat. As the asshat gasps for air, slow the car down with the e-brake. Reach over and open the door and shove him right out. Stop the car, hope over to the driver seat and go straight home to care for your poor car. I have been lucky enough that I have never had anyone be a complete *** during a test drive before. I do always state my ground rules. Once the car is warmed up it is ok to go WOT but I tell no funny stuff and spell it out. On a serious note. I had a dipstick kid come to test drive my M3 a few years back with his dad. Kid driving, dad in back seat. Was supposed to be a replacement for his M3 that was stolen, so I'm thinking at least he had the same car. Kid is lolly gagging along in 4th and goes to grab 5th and instead goes to 3rd. Starts to engage and quickly realizes his mistake as the car is jerking us all forward. I look turn to the dad in the back seat and state "that almost cost you some serious money". Dad looks at me and tells his boy that the test drive is now over.

You can always try Carmax. nothing to lose but 60min, and u might be surprised. At least u know the check is good when u leave!

Didn't read all of the posts, but one word comes to mind regarding the "testee"...... DOUCHEBAG. j

I am so sorry to hear about your experience. This dipsh*t sounds like he embraces the "drive it like you stole it" pholosophy.

Sounds like he's confused about the purpose of a test drive. They are to ascertain the car functions properly, the gears aren't crunching etc. They aren't to red line and powerslide someone elses car through corners. Guess its better to have that chat before hand? When I've sold I've done the driving, then once sale is agreed and they've got insurance I take the money and let them drive me in it so if they find a problem we can sort it out. He's got my car, I've got his money. Makes a difference...

When I go buy a car, I like to test drive a little aggressive too, but not beating it up. Drive it to the fullest potential doesn't mean dumping the clutch and scraping the lips. redridge, What does this mean "aircooled high high horse type of guy..."?

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That's true, given the premise that the guy is actually out to BUY the car and not some guy wanting a quick speed fix.

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What's that supposed to mean

Sorry to hear about your experience, but thanks for posting. I've been in similar situations where I say to myself "why was I so polite, I should have said something". Next time that you come across an idiot, remember this lesson and react.

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just a reference to the frequent infighting between 993 and earlier owners and 996 and later owners. Aren't you glad you asked?

1999 996C4, Is that guy here in Rennlist?? What an inconsiderate individual! Thats abusive/ trashy way of driving. I dont think you're over protective at all. Most of us here consider these cars as our dream cars, so we take care of them. Definitely can take spirited/high performance driving, but not that reckless/abusive way.

Mike, Thanks - not sure if this guy is on here or not. Haven't checked. I am going to send him an estimate tomorrow morning and if he does not give me the proper response I think I will let everyone know his name and exactly which car he is selling online. He sent me an email stating the fact that he would like multiple quotes and to take pictures of the car himself - not going to happen since the place I am getting it fixed at is the CHEAPEST place in town by far...already did my research when they painted and installed the bumpers and skirts...and if he thinks he is going to take pictures of the car he is out of his mind at this point. I am hoping to never see this guy again in person since I am so ticked off at this point. I will keep you all posted on the latest tomorrow - the good news is that he basically admitted guilt in his response email to me, so I am sending him the estimate, copying my attorney and hopefull he won't mess around and just pay up. It should only be around $3 or $400.

It's easy for me to say that if I had been in your position, when you witnessed him abusing your car, I would have demanded he pull over immediately and cease the test drive right then and there. Did you consider doing just that? But, my guess is that you were too much in shock to take that step. And in reality, I probably would have been, too. But, I would have been incredibly pissed off at this guy. Glad he admitted guilt, but getting the money may be another issue. Good luck and let us know. And yeah, post his name and the car he's selling on line if he doesn't come through.

Update: This guy wrote back, admitted to guilt, stated a scarcastic remark about me copying my attorney, and said he would send the check for the amount on the estimate. No 2nd and 3rd estimate needed and he didn't want to come "take his own pictures". Sounds too good to be true, but hopefully I will post my last comment once the check comes in and clears

I wish you the best. I'm sure when the dust is all settled and clear and the drama is over, you'll feel ok (it's not likely that you'll feel great) about the outcome.

FWIW, one strategy for selling motorcycles is to take the interested party for a demo ride as a passenger. If they are serious, finish the transaction including your having the money or it in escrow pending their drive. Only once you are assured of the money can they ride/drive it. The assumtions are, they have bought it unless they identify a hidden flaw (which can be subject to negotiation); Any damage/abuse during their drive closes the deal. This dramatically reduces the people who use test drives as forms of recreation.

Well, the check came today and this guy actually paid for the damages - what a lesson learned. Just wanted to thank everyone - without this place I don't think I would have kept my sanity through this!!! Damages will be fixed next week and looking forward to having a healthy p-car once again.

whew! Congrat's!

So now that he's got a few hundred sunk into the car, and he knows that it performs well at the limit, he's buying it at your asking price, right?

Glad that you got your money. This thread taught me a lot about making rules for rest drives.

Interesting thread and you were very lucky the guy paid for the damage. He may be an A$$hole but at least not a complete one. I think it is fair to expect to be able to do test drive when buying a car. And running the rpm's up to close to redline is something I would want to do to make sure the power comes on smoothly. But you only need to do that once or twice as you accelerate on to a highway. There is no need in a test drive for any dramatic manuvers though. You just want to see how the car handles and how the suspension feels. I would not buy a car from someone if they refused to let me drive it. Generally in talking to someone you can tell if they are serious or not. As the seller you always have the right of refusal for a test ride if you don't feel comfortable. Just understand that you could be wrong and lose a potential sale, but it is your car and your right to go with your gut instinct.

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I agree. My rule is not to sell my 996!!!

+1. The 996 will remain in my garage for a very, very long time - I found out that I actually do NOT want to sell this machine anytime soon.

I'm glad you had a happy (or at least less unhappy) ending...... somehow I thought you would

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Hy LiveNupe--that bicycle looks dangerously close to your P-car . . .