Red Headed Step Children!

I am not sure how it happened but I have ended up it seems, with 2 911's that no one seems to want/like! That said, I have a question on lowering the 996. Does anyone have any suggestions as far as lowering my car? I have included a picture of my 964 for reference as to how I would like the 996 to look when the work is complete.

Well, if you really dont want them, I'll take the 964. You can part out or scrap the 996 no one wants.

Yeah, I'll happily take the 964 off your hands.

Your 964 looks sweet. Many lowering options,ROWMO3O, PSS9s by Bilstein,KW etc.

If you just want to lower the car then you can get lowering springs that will work with your stock struts. If you want to improve your handling as well then a set of PSS9 or PSS10 Bilstein coilovers will do the trick. Pair those up with some H&R sway bars (or equivalent) and the car will be transformed. As far as bastard children go...the 964 has already made the jump to desirability and The 996's turn may come as well...some day. They both look great with the black wheels - especially the white car.

Thank you for the nice comments on the 964! But sell my 996 for scrap?! (OUCH!) I never said I didn't like it, I was just pointing out that I have had a lot of "ewwwww, you bought a 996 AND a first year 996!!!" comments. Has anyone here used the H&R spring kit? I saw a 996 that the owner said he had just installed one and it did not seem to have lowered the car much at all. I was trying to get it to mimic my 964's stance. Thanks again for the help.

You're going to need coilovers if you want the 996 to sit like the 964.

ewwww, you bought a 996 ......? Jokes aside, I've read that the first year is Jake Raby's favorite and in any case, I am envious of your collection. I don't agree on just replacing with lowered spring's though. They tend to have higher springs rates and your standard shocks/damper would not be adequate, especially if they've already got some miles in them. Plan on having the shocks replaced when you do the springs. Otherwise, ride would suffer more than necessary.

Nice cars! I like them both. Out of curiosity any anti 996 comments from non Porsche people? I think most people view them as "ahh nice porsche" rather than "ewwww 996". As for the 964. I think the Porsche community let it out of the corner a couple years ago. it isn't considered a red headed stepchild anymore...unless it is a C4 or Tip.

I like both your 911's! On the 996 lowering, I'll give an opinion going against the conventional wisdom mentioned above... I put H&R sport springs on my 996 C2 because I wanted to give them a shot at $300 before I started going down the road of $3,000 coil overs... Result? Couldn't be happier with both the looks and performance, both on the track and on the street. Profound difference in handling, it completely eliminated the floaty feeling the stock suspension had, and the cosmetics are great as well. More details on the H&R install here... 996 C2, stock struts, H&R sport springs. I've actually added 5mm spacers in the rear since these pictures were taken, filling out the rear rear wells perfectly. Before the spring swap... Silly stock US ride height. No changes other than the H&R sport springs (part #29513) and an alignment. I consider it to be a pretty significant change, but you can judge for yourself...

I have to agree with pfbz. I also have H&R springs and I love everything about them. The ride can be a bit bumpy on rough roads but the looks and handling makes up for it. Many others are happy with the M030 suspension but I don't think you will get the same stance. Here is another pic for reference. I've since added spacers to help fill out the wheel well. The black wheels on both cars looks fantastic!

Where did you guys get your spacers by the way...and what size are you running?

Running 7mm H&R spacers up front and rear are 13mm. Most guys use 15mm on the rears but I was worried about rubbing. Now I think I could have went 15mm for the rears. Bought used off someone on 6speed.

I'm running 5mm front and rear spacers, *but* I'm also running 997 wheels and 997 tire sizes which change things a bit. My rears are 10x18 ET 58, 7mm less positive offset than stock 996 C2 wheels (10x18 ET 65), so it's equivalent to running the stock wheels with 12mm spacers. I'm also running 997-sized rear tires, 265/40ZR18. These are on the narrow end of the spectrum for a narrow body 996, and also a bit taller than typical. I wasn't sure how well they were going to work out, or wether the increase in rear size would cause issues with either the PSM or ABS, but it turns out they are working great... Zero PSM/ABS issues, and the narrowish rears combined with the wider than normal fronts (see below) really balances the car out a bit and tunes out some of the natural understeer... It still has a touch of understeer if your not on the throttle, might try some tunable sway bars next. The front 997 wheels/tires has more positive offset and a slightly wider than stock tire (8.0x18 ET 57, 235/40R18) so with the 5mm spacer the wheels still 2mm farther in than the stock fronts, but it is also a 10mm wider than stock tire, so I'm net-net 3mm farther out. It could still go further... One of these days I'll pick up some wider front spacers and give them a try...

99.378% of people who are not Porsche owners can't tell the difference between a classic 1963, a 1985 930 model, a 1992 964 series, a 2003 996 series, or a 2012 997 GT3. So, who is saying "ewwwww, you bought a 996"? The only ones I can imaging saying that are either the group of Porschephiles who think Porsche died when the water-cooled engine was introduced, or snobs that think any version below the current model is beneath their dignity.

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Agreed. I remember when I was younger. I was into cars but really didn't really know Porsches at all. My head snapped every time I saw a Porsche on the road. I never went ewwww midyear.

I love your licence plate on the 964, Scotty. I bet that one was in high demand. You mention you have a first year 996..check out this thread, it helps me with the bullies in the school yard https://rennlist.com/forums/showthre...errerid=109860

Again, thank you for all the positive comments of my cars!. pfbz and Revn29k00 I really like the look of the stance on your cars and that is the way that I am going to go. The investment is relatively small and results are exactly what I was looking for, I ordered the springs this morning. Cuda 911, it does seem to be the "air cooled" crowd are the ones that I hear the most comments from, or those familiar with the problems of the early 996 engines. But the price/mileage/condition was right and the car a little unique, so I thought as a driver and DE car it fit the bill. I am still on the fence as far as the 964's value. Although the SC's and Carreras have taken a jump as the long hoods price and rarity have made them unabtanium the 964's are still trending lower. I have been low balled on my car when I was selling it more times than I can remember. Butthepenguin99, to your point I think they are becoming more accepted, just not more valuable. I will post pictures when the work is done. I just received confirmation my tech can do the work July 3rd.

Congrats on the new 996. Wow, those sport bucket seats are AWESOME!!! Can you give us more details on these seats? Were they an option on Canadian cars? BTW, also love your 964...

WOW sexy interior.

Actually I bought the car in NJ last August. They are GT3 Recaro seats from Porsche. I have the receipt in my files showing the order from the factory after the original owner took delivery of the car. He had them shipped in the matching Boxster Red leather.

I have mine lowered with H&R springs. I am running 235/35/19 with 7mm spacers on the front and 285/30/19 on 11" rims with 14mm spacers on the rear. Picture 168d.jpg

964's are definitely having a resurgence in popularity (or maybe it's a surge rather than a resurgence, since they weren't all that well liked when they first came out!). With decent 993's getting harder and more expensive to find and most SC's on their second engine and third paint job by now (or needing both), the 'The only Porsche is an oil cooled Porsche' crowd seems to be migrating towards the 964's. I'll take an unmolested 964 with about 80K on the clock, clean original interior and not perfect but decent paint in white or maritime blue for me please...

OK, small change of plans.......they are now both for sale. I will have the listings posted soon. I hope you guys are right and there is a market out there for my 964. Stay tuned!!

This thread changed quickly. What's next ? Good luck with the sale.

Not sure yet but a Cayman S and a 912 have been on my radar. That said, lets see what the marketplace tells me my cars are worth and if they sell great, if not, I still like them!

Personally, I would keep the 964. Unforunately your correct about the 996. While the 964 and 993 values soar, the 996 prices are now plummeting faster than an anvil at a cliff diving competition. I predict the 996 will soon become the "must own" and "pimp out" car of the ricer crowd. Younger owners are now starting to pay attention to and buy these bargain basement Porsche cars and will waste no time in making the most horrendous mods you can imagine. You know the absurd wheels and paint, the ricer mufflers, boom stereos, etc. Though many on here will vocally disagree (in posts), they know I am right about this and loathe this assured fate for the 996 as much as I do. I for one will refuse to molest mine, as I hope many on here will as well but rest assured, this fate for the 996 has already been determined by market value.

The "ricer" crowd - at least some of them - are driving 400WHP Integras and 800WHP Supras that would mop the floor with your sacred, unmolested 996. The M96 is expensive to mod, doesn't boost well, and is hard to work on. It takes 9 quarts of synthetic oil instead of 4 quarts of dino. The import tuner crowd - oh, sorry, "Ricer" crowd - won't give a damn about the 996 when there are 4-bangers that can be blown for hundreds instead of thousands and replacement engines can be found for $500 on Craigslist. Your ability to bemoan the plummeting value of your car and come across as a snob in the same post is impressive.

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Ridiculous posts from you and others about whether the 996 can make an 80 mile drive without exploding haven't helped much.

Well, my post has gotten a little dark That said I wanted to post the ads for both my cars and I got this: Scotty 79, you do not have permission to access this page. This could be due to one of several reasons: Your user account may not have sufficient privileges to access this page. Are you trying to edit someone else's post, access administrative features or some other privileged system? If you are trying to post, the administrator may have disabled your account, or it may be awaiting activation. May I ask for some help to figure out what I have to do to change my privileges?

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very true LOL, im 23 and would consider myself a younger owner. Many people don't even know what you can pick these cars up for anyways so they never bother looking. The car is unique in its own way. It is the goofy child now but will in my mind be a well sought after model. Rauh Welt did their thing and now all those generation of cars are popular. Yes, they were gaining popularity beforehand, but thats what caused me to even start looking into 911's. Tides will turn, maybe not now, and it probably hasn't hit rock bottom yet either, but soon.

Need to be a member to post classifieds maybe? It is like that on a lot of forums.

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And these are just a FEW of the things that I really really like about them

Lets see what the market brings! 996 listed on Pelican. Could not figure out how to list it here. I thought I was a member as I can post on line (obviously) and would really like to post here. Any suggestions would be appreciated.

Scotty 79 You can post on rennlist, you just have to update to a paying membership in order to do so.

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snap!

Thanks for the clearing that up ECS Tuning. I have been on this site long enough to justify the paying membership. Look for the postings on both cars soon!

490 views on my car and no interest yet!

The 996 looks to be well optioned - red full leather and all! Good luck with the sale!

Thanks Andy! I hope the color and the GT3 seats will set it apart.

Hey Guys, I would like to move this car, but as suspected I have had little interest in her. Could my ad be better with more pictures or a more in depth description of the car? Is it the price? Let me know what you think.

Link to ads?