987 B12 suspension feedback

Over the holidays I overhauled the suspension in my new-to-me 987.2 using a B12 kit ( Bilstein B8 + Eibach springs ) and wanted to give some feedback after I had a chance to drive it for a bit… Positives: No more 4x4 look, overall ride is comparable if not better than stock (which is frankly not a high bar), doesn’t crash or bottom out and handles big bumps fairly well Negatives: Ride is ‘busy’ especially a slower speeds; best way to describe is it car follows the road; it’s not harsh but you can definitely feel every little road imperfection - in the interest of appearing ‘sporty’ I believe the valving is set pretty aggressively. I don’t like floaty cars, but at the same time I like the suspension do it its job in the background. For reference my benchmark for a good setup was SuperMiata XIDA coilovers in my old Miata’s (NB and especially the NC generation) that are single adjustable Tractive shocks that handle amazing yet have a supple and comfortable ride. I’ve heard people complain about the ride height being too low with the B12 kit especially in the front. As part of the suspension overhaul I’ve replaced the top mounts (front/rear), strut bearings and rubber spring seats (front/rear). In the front I’ve stacked the 6.5mm spring seat (P/N 996-343-511-01) along with the 3mm one (P/N 996-343-511-00) to raise the ride height slightly — helps to cut the thinner one so it fits around the thicker piece and once the spring is seated those two are not going anyway. This also potentially helps you to remove the added piece with the strut fully assembled. Hard to tell from the picture above but still have a ~1.5-2 finger gap between the wheel and fender so it’s not slammed but have to be careful with steep driveways and thinking about replacing the 3mm one with another 6.5mm spring seat to raise the ride height just a tad more. A few other things I discovered along the way… Both rear control arms had torn bushings (at 82k miles) giving a weird loose sensation at freeway speeds and replacement control arms fixed that feeling. Also the PO had replaced one of the rear top mounts at not-so-insignificant cost and the shop that did the work not only torn the ball joint boot during the process but they also used an non OE aftermarket mount that was very cheaply made and quality was nowhere near OE/OEM levels. Sigh.. That’s why I try to do as much as the work myself when I’m working on my cars. As for next steps… I’m kinda torn… While this is definitely liveable setup and a decent upgrade I’ve been spoiled with the aftermarket suspension setups on my previous cars and will likely look info alternate options in due time. As a quick DOE planning on putting back the original struts (which were still ok) in front with the Eibach springs + fresh bump stops and see how they feel — understand stock shocks are not meant for lowering spring but this an experiment to compare shock valving between stock and B8‘s and swapping front suspension is much easier than the rear so I feel it’s worthwhile for a few hours of work.

If you are a suspension guy, I would highly recommend Ohlin R&T Coilovers that you install. Then you can adjust the ride height to whatever is pleasant for your eye. I like a level car, your new rear springs are too high for my taste. With Ohlin's it's your choice. I like a lower center of gravity for less weight transfer. Then later if you want adjustable swaybars with down links, you can fiddle with the understeer, oversteer easily with adjustalbe swaybars. The down links then provide adjustment so a corner balance can be accomplished with driver weight included. What this does is give equal weight transfer turning left and right turnin.

Thanks. I definitely don’t want to go any lower in the rear, if anything would like to raise the front. My car is 99% street driven and don’t want to constantly watch out for driveways and bumps etc. I should have mentioned I had one of the first Ohlins that came out for 987’s when I had my gen1 a few years ago. Was not happy with them at all with the standard (70/80 N/m) springs rates; also tried lower spring rates (50/60 N/m) with stock 987 valving and, while the ride quality was better compared to the 7/8 setup it still wasn’t quite right. Not sure why as others including you seem happy with them but that whole experience left me with a sour taste. I see Arcflash now has an Ohlins “touring” setup with custom valving for an additional $1k but frankly the spring rates that they chose (60/70 N/m) worry me based on my past experience and I have not heard many reviews from end users either here or over on ********. That said, I have not contacted them to see if other spring rate options are available and get some additional details on their touring valving… As a side note between my 987.1 and 987.2 , I had a two cars that came Ohlins suspension ; an S2000 that had upgraded spring rates (12/10 kg vs. the standard 10/8) and an NC Miata and both were fairly decent and both were a good deal better than the setup I had with the Cayman in terms of ride comfort. All the rave reviews that I had read in S2ki many years ago is what actually got me interested in getting an Ohlins in first place for my 987.1 .

When you mention 'busy ride..' what are your current alignment specs?

Alignment is fine: -1.3F/-1.9R camber, slight toe in in rear etc. Low speed compliance or, rather lack there of, is a probably a better way of describing what I’m experiencing rather than ‘busy ride’. Mind you, it’s not terrible but I do think it can be better and I tend to be picky about suspension setups in my cars. Found a local who has a B4+ Cayman R setup and we’re trying to find a time so we can compare the two setup. I’ve also started discussions with ArcFlash about their Touring setup.

Ive been wondering is there much of a difference in the Cayman R setup and could it be applied to a 987.2 Boxster. I am acquiring one very shortly and want to refresh some suspension things.

I believe Cayman R and Spyder have the same setup so should also work with the Boxster as well. Carnewal sells that setup as a Spyder one. Please share your feedback once you get a chance to evaluate that setup.

I remember our converations about 4 years ago. Same story, where I took the 400 lbs/in f spring rate and 458 r as a middle of the road rate for R&T usage. Others who really get into the harmonics suggest a 300 lbs/in f and 515 lbs/in r set up. I think ARCFLASH has a setup close to this for his Ohlin Track setup. My Ohlin's have been servicing me well for the limited tracking, HPDE's, Autocross and Street, totaling almost 35000 miles. Mostly using 17 clicks from full stiff on the rebound/compression golden adjustment knob. No oil leaks or other issues. I run my car lower to the ground than many owners with the Ohlin's setup and 35 sidewall tires . The Ohlin give full range of spring, even with the lowering in place. The stiff spring rate helps keep the car off the road surface in very bumpy terrain. I also have a LN skid plate, but without any skid marks so far. These coilover's support the wheel carriers and are directly connected to the Tarett Cup Race LCA's with solid bearings. I tend to use minimum tire pressures on the street to help absorb the small bumps from uneven road surfaces. There is no float in my suspension though. I can feel each and every little hill/valley in the road surface. I just had an alignment done and was amazed on how far off some setting had wondered. Especially in the rear. Now back to normal with a little toe out in front and minimal toe in in the rear. The Solid red thrust pucks on the Tarett Cup LCA's keep the alignment where it should be and the solid monoball bearings also prevent axle movement both front and rear. Again, this after 30,000 on the Tarett Cup LCA's using a lot of camber -3.0 f and -2.5 r. Like I said above, I am backing down a little to -2.5 f and -2.4 r mainly to save some inner tire shoulder wear. I have a 2 year tire tread wear schedule then flipping the tires to run on the outside shoulders. Each owner should set their car up as they like it. Just seems that I have adapted to little lower and stiffer setup than OEM.

Yep, time flies… For sure everyone’s tolerance for ride comfort as well as intended usage is different. Last weekend I went for a test drive with another fellow Cayman owner who’s running Bilstein B4 struts (stock replacement) with the Cayman R springs . We drove both cars back to back on a stretch of road that is particularly rough and were able to compare the ride comfort between the two setups. Confirmed that the low speed damping on the B8’s is more aggressive (aka ‘sport’y valving) and combination of stock-ish damping of the B4’s + slightly higher ride height of the R springs looks to be the sweet spot for me. After exchanging a few emails with Gert from Carnewal I settled on Cayman R springs + Koni sports which will allow me to adjust rebound damping. As an added bonus that kit was ~500 euros cheaper than the Cayman R strut+spring setup and Carnewal ’s pricing for the Cayman R kit was lower than Suncoast to start with even including overseas shipping. It’ll be a few weeks before I get a chance to do the swap and but I get a chance to evaluate it will provide my thoughts. If anyone in Bay Area, CA is looking for a new suspension setup I am planning to sell the B12 kit at a good discount. It’s ~brand new with a few hundred miles and I can give prospective buyers a ride so you can actually get a feel before you commit. I still believe the B12’s are a decent upgrade over stock, I’m just an old geezer that‘s looking for a bit more comfort

@newold_m I did u actually end up selling the b12 kit or just marked it as "sold" due to no takers. I would Pm but Planet-9 still hasn't approved me for Pm yet for some reason 🤷🏼‍♂️

Yes, it was sold awhile ago.

So. how is the Koni Sport and Cayman R combo treating you? I like the way you think. I want that longer travel useful suspension, but also want that "once and settled" feeling with a bump, but no so harsh that they telegraph the color of the painted strips...

@Ric_in_RVA I’m still very happy with that combo.. Functional ride height and good composure over bumpy roads.

Gotcha, thank you !

I just ordered B16 PSS10, I like to do HPDE but also street drive car, I as also installing Tarret sway bars and drop links, with GT3 Lower Control arms all 4 corners.

Schell-show us the picture of your car with the mods. Thx

No problem, I will have it all installed probably next month sometime.

What are the alignments you want to achieve

I am about 27mm lower, Tarret sway bars gt3 control arms all 4 corners, Tarret drop links -3.5 and 2.6, Bilstein coilovers ,amazing at the track and a little punishing on the street,I am very happy with the results,I knew the ride would suffer on the street, did Mid Ohio a couple weeks ago,I love the difference.

Was great on track I have done Mid Ohio as well as Gratton.

@newold_m "For reference my benchmark for a good setup was SuperMiata XIDA coilovers in my old Miata’s (NB and especially the NC generation) that are single adjustable Tractive shocks that handle amazing yet have a supple and comfortable ride." I think I know how you are feeling my memory always drifts back to the 2000 Integra type R (DC2R). I went through multiple suspension iterations until I settled on the holy grail (in my opinion) - Spoon Sports N1 coil overs (16kF, 14kR), the version produced by Showa . To this day, I still remember that sweet sensation as the weight transitioned consistently and progressively ...1 and 2 and 3 and 4 and 5 .... and 10 to the edge of traction. How the car subtly rocked and remained level as it absorbed bumps in a hard corner, the detailed feedback coming back from all 4 wheels allowing you to read the road surface ........ even at this stiff spring rate, it was a velvet like ride on the street. With Japanese cars, you could swap out the suspension in 1.5hrs where as the CS would take you a full day. I've been through standard Bilstein PSS9, Uprated PSS9 to 70nm F, 80nm R and recently swapped to ohlins R&T 70nmF, 80nmR for shits and giggles. TBH, haven't been able to re-create the same feeling in the CS but it's a different car & product category. Tailored Race tuned specification vs a streetable track suspension system. I've accepted there's to many variables to chase this one or I'm going to have to go to a external reservoir system like JRZ pro or custom MCS/Ohlins to tune it the way I want. I now categorise my CS as a toy, so you never know if I'll get the itch but generally it's the higher cost for german cars that makes me think twice Not sure if this is your experience but the one thing I realised is that the CS may have a narrower sweetspot and needs to be driven at higher speeds to feel the same sensation

Wow, that's a beauty! I love the aesthetic ride height, would like to do similar to my 2012 Black Edition if the daily ride quality doesn't suffer too much. Thinking I may not have to go coilover since I won't track, but maybe AutoX? Considering the R Springs with Koni setup mentioned a few years back here would be a good compromise? What are the wheels you're running? Thx

Brother, Your roof rack is perfectly dialed in profile-wise. For the Cayman 987.1 and 987.2, rack fit is kinda hard to find. 996 rack fit, but can't open fastback to full open position. I'm working on a project for 987, 981 that will the low pro, low drag, low weight, functional yet aesthetic. Same as my ducktail project. Luckily I have 2 sons, college kids, in engineering who can make my dream a reality.