Talk me out of a 996

Hello everyone, I have a 2000 Boxster S as of right now and a 2003 Miata in storage across the country ( aka at the parents place ). I was posted out to the west coast and I could not take the Miata. Both of which I am now looking to sell. Anyway I have always loved Porsche's, especially the 911 in all of its forms. However, when I decided to buy one I could not find a decent one around me, and I didn't have a lot of time to look as I was doing stuff in the Military. I found a nice well kept Boxster S and pulled the trigger. I love the car and I maintain it very well, I opted to have a LN IMS installed, when I did the clutch a year or so ago. I REALLY REALLY want a 911 now, but my dream ones the 964 and 993 are so much $ right now that I cannot and will not be able to buy a decent one. So I started looking at older 911 SC's and holy crap I should have bought one 5 ears ago So now I am looking at 996's. Wow. Dirt Cheap compared to the others, and I know all the reasons why, IMS, non air cooled, Cylinder line issues, coolant issues etc. I'm thinking of buying one in the near future, dropping in a LN IMS, and putting some $ into the car. I have a daily Driver, and the Boxster is parked underground in a secure lot. Budget is at the most $40,000 CDN. I have noticed some turbos around the 50K mark which blows my mind when I think about it. So what should I do here? Wait for a crappy 964 or 993 to some how appear, or find a decent SC, or buy a 996. I like the body style of the 996 and the inside is basically my Boxster. I am pretty handy with cars, but I have no place to work except the parking stall which according to the condo people is a big no no. I have an Indy Mechanic who does all the work on the Boxster and he's great so I know he can help with the IMS fit, and getting the car up to speed. Thoughts? Thanks, Andrew

Talk you out of it? You've come to the wrong bar.

A. Welcome to rennlist. B. Thank you for your service to our country. C. Boxster plus Miata? BBBBAAAAAAAhhahhhahhahhahahhahhahaaa! (you stepped into that one) D. Yeah, if you want to hear about buying something other than a 996, maybe you want to go to the Ram truck forum, or the Skoda forum or something. Go drive a few. They are a real value now, and if you get a good one, I think you'll be happy with the driving. DIY maint is ok if you have another car to drive while you're waiting for parts or info. I have been shopping for about 4 years, I finally grabbed one up. Having a lot of fun with it so far.

You can buy a turbo 996 in Ontario for 40k easily and a well maintained one in excellent shape. I paid 28k for my C4s in Ontario granted it had 100k on it 117k now I love mine you won't find me a previous c6 owner talking anyone out of a 911.

<a href="https://imgflip.com/i/usqvs"><img src="https://i.imgflip.com/usqvs.jpg" title="made at imgflip.com"/></a> <p>Sorry, had to :P I got a 996 for around that price, but if I had to do it again I would have saved more and gotten a turbo.

Thanks for the feedback everyone. Yes I have heard all of the Miata/Boxster Jokes, the miata was my entry into the world of Auto X and Track days. There are a few nice ones in Ontario right now. Two 4S models and some others. I think the turbo might be to much of a car for me to deal with, and I don't know how much more of a pain in the butt they are to maintain. Turbos have always been out of my budget so I have not really even explored that option. The title was a bit of a joke. I don't expect anyone to say anything bad about the cars Also, I served in the Canadian Military. However, I did work with the US Military from time to time.

Turbos are cheaper to maintain. You're man card will be returned to you once you get rid of those and buy a 996.

If you can try and find a 2002-2004 C4S. There are some real bargains out there right now and I think the 4S may hold value a bit more. If you're going to replace the IMSB then maybe a car with the original bearing is slightly more desirable, when you remove it you will know exactly what you're working with.

Coolant issues? 996 is a great car. You get 90% of the turbo experience at 50% of the cost. I understand from other posts here that importing a 996 into Canada is no big deal, so you may want to broaden your search to US cars. Both this forum and the 996tt forum have active Craigslist finds threads, so check those regularly for some good deals.

Coolant issues. I thought I read somewhere that there were some issues with the coolant tank, or caps. I can't recall offhand. I am looking all over the place for a car. However my $ is at 75% or less then the US $. So buying a car from the states costs at least 25% more then the asking price. Also, I will pay a tax when I import it. 9% or more % of what the book value is, not what I paid for it. The car will need day time running lights, and child restraint system installed ( so a car seat can go in). My Boxster is an American car but I did not import it. I have spent the last few days looking over Flat 6 innovations. I have done all the prevent work to the Boxster, maybe I should just keep it instead of buying an unknown 996 and doing the work all over again. These cars scare the hell out of me sometimes haha.

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Early coolant caps leaked and coolant overflow reservoir tanks sometimes split or leaked, both are relatively easy and inexpensive DIY fixes. There are also water pump issues, mostly that if the water pump fails, it can leave pieces of the impeller blade sitting in the passages and partially block coolant flow, causing other issues. Again water pump replacement is a relatively easy DIY project, recommended as preventative maintenance at xx,000 mile intervals (30K-50K depending on who you ask). Turbo's had a nasty habit of blowing off their glued-on coolant pipes, especially during track days. A not-so-easy and not-so-cheap fix (typically requires dropping the engine) and makes IMS bearing replacement look cheap. Reading the Flat6 website before buying a 996 is like reading about salmonella Thanksgiving morning... Very low odds but likely going to ruin the experience anyway. Many of the folks on this forum are not overly concerned with the IMS bearing... Yes, it's a risk. Change the oil frequently, use good quality oil, swap the IMS bearing whenever the transmission is down for other work, and if your particularly paranoid, install a guardian detection system to give you early warning of an IMS failure. Plenty of 100K mile 996's still running track days and driving daily on the original bearing.

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ummm no. Go ask your dealer or indy how many hours to do a spark plug change on a turbo. Or to pin/weld the coolant pipes. Or to repair the rear spoiler transmission. Or repair a leaky front differential. All of which are pretty common Turbo issues... The Mezger engine is a great engine and avoids the IMS bearing issue as well as other M96 engine problems, but 'cheap to maintain', especially if you bring it to a shop, is not the Turbo's strong point.

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All of those are still cheaper to fix than ims, pinning the hoses isn't necessary unless you are tracking it. Coils/plugs and spoiler can all be fixed without involving an Indy. Ims isn't for the the average diyer

OP what's your location? There is a mint turbo for under 40k for sale in my town in Ontario.

$40k budget? I'd definitely stay away from NA 996 and go with a turbo. absolutely, 100%. lol or, if youre insane (or stupid) like me, go with NA 996 and build the motor to address all the known failing points. about the same price as a turbo.

Turbojamoe, where's this turbo for $40, I'm in Ontario (Toronto). I do regular searches and most of what I see at decent prices is high mileage cars.

At currency conversion rates that is a 30k turbo. Big mistake. That 30k would just be the start. You get what you pay for in a turbo. A no stories no heartache turbo is now running closer to 50k USD. Others may tell you differently but that is the market.

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Search autotrader for aurora. I was just through my email but must have deleted the sellers info. I was trying to sell my c4s to fund the turbo buy but couldn't make it all work. It's a mint silver one couple nice mods. Decent mileage.

Let's ask Dock...

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The market is all over the place and I find a lot of guys that own 996's don't know what they have. My c4s was bought at 100k in June from a local seller private guy. He was asking 35k he took 28k in the end plus he had a couple things fixed I complained about. He was lucky to get 25k out of the car. It has 8/10 paint on it a couple small marks nothing major. Full service records since new etc...deals are out there if you look hard.

Yeah, not going down this path again. However, since this is NOT the 996tt forum, and it is assumed people in here are actually interested in driving their cars . . . If "no stories, no heartache" means 25k or less miles, no paintwork whatsoever, no mods ever, bought from a dealer, then yes, you are shopping in the neighborhood, plus or minus, of $50,000. If, however, you will accept in a 12 to 15 year old used car, 2 or 3 of the following conditions: 80,000 miles, paintwork done to a high standard, minor fender bender repaired to a high standard, some quality mods, some rock chips on the hood and/or bumper, a rear spoiler that doesn't work, sold by an individual, driver's seat bolster showing wear, a minor maintenance issue or two (brake pads, rear tires, etc), then you can buy a nice 996tt in the mid $30k's easily. Asking prices will be $37k to $41k. Willing to accept all of those things? Well, that car is what we refer to as "junk" or "garbage" in the turbo forum. Your neighbors and friends and basically everyone other than Porsche snobs will think that it's an awesome car. That car you can find with an asking price around $35k and can be bought in the $30,000 to $33,000 range.

As long as the buyer understands the true cost of ownership, the points above have some merit. The point is ... Don't go swimming in the shallow end if you are not prepared for deeper water. The pool gets deep quickly. You better know how to swim.

Also, if you want something that the average person might actually consider junk, you can buy a 996tt in the $25k - $28k range. A car like that may have a salvage title or 150k+ miles or an engine or transmission with a mystery problem. It will still be a 996tt though. That car might cost you quite a bit in maintenance by the time you get it sorted out. But, the same can happen with the 20k mile garage queen from the dealer that you PPI to death. A few weeks after buying it, you could easily be looking at a $3,000 repair for either a spoiler or clutch slave/accumulator failure. Or both. Those failures happen to all of these cars - doesn't seem to matter how nice the coffee bar was where you bought it.

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Concur 100%.

You definitely have to broad your search to the US, find a low mile 996, 3 owners tops with maintenance history, do the IMS if that bring you piece of mind and enjoy your 996 and drive like a man again.

I live all the way out on Vancouver Island. However, I have family in Ontario. My brother runs a car dealership near Kitchener so if I needed to I could ask him to go look at a car for me. I honestly don't think I am going for a turbo. I want a decent 996 that has been taken care of and loved. I would like to stay away from any aftermarket mods unless it has something to do with the care of the car like say a magnetic drain plug or something. I hope people get what I am saying with that. I was into the "car" scene when I was a lot younger, tracking our cars and modding them. I know how people treat cars like that, mostly driven hard on a shoe string budget. Not saying people do this with these cars, but I'm sure some do. I am no rush to buy one, I am still happy with the Boxster for now so I will be looking for awhile. It's true the market is all over the place there are higher KM cars for under 20K CDN. Do I have 40K to spend on a car, yes. Do I really want to max my budget? Not really. I understand buy the nicest and newest you can afford, but at the same time I am sure there are "good" cars out there for less. I am not a snob when it comes to this stuff. Paint work and cosmetic things don't bother me all that much, however they can paint a picture as to how the car was cared for. As long as the car is strong mechanically I would be happy. I seem to have opened a can of worms regarding the turbo/ non turbo discussion. If possible can we please just assume that I will not be buying a turbo

I bought my 1st 911 inside a year ago. It is a 1999 996 C2 6 speed. I went through the same decision dilemma you are facing and considered all the options as I understood them to be. I found a really nice two owner car with 69k miles. This car recently had the IMSB, rear main seal, clutch and AOS done, which should buy me some no worry time. I'm going to doubledown and get a Flat6innovations Stage 1 rebuild as soon as I save a few more $$. For me, it seems to be the best long term decision.

Can I post links here? If so here is an autotrader Add. http://wwwa.autotrader.ca/a/Porsche/...&orup=16_15_32 I called these guys on Monday regarding this car. It was out at an Indy getting looked at because the dealer has no idea about P cars. I called the Indy asking about it, they stated the car was basically getting an inspection done and would not say much else since I didn't own the car. They also said they would do a PPI for $200 CDN. I asked the dealer if that was ok, he said no problem. Now I haven't done the PPI yet because this is still early in the process and the car is across the country from me.

I would get a detailed description and lots of pics from the dealer, then agree to a price based on the condition as described and subject to confirmation by a ppi. Once you agree to the price, then spend the money on the PPI. I'll shut up about the 996tt. I think the NA996 is a fantastic car - as said above, 90% of the 996tt at 50% of the cost. And 95% of the time you won't be using the 10% you're missing.

KC, Thank you. This is the type of advice I was looking for when I opened the topic. I will call them today and talk about the car. I hate to bring up the turbo part again, but I agree with not using the extra 10%. To be honest I don't like super amounts of power, hence why I bought a miata for track days. One thing that is nice is the simple fact that there are so many 996's for sale right now, and I am in no rush to get one. ( I kinda am, well my heart says so anyway )

For your budget why not a 997? There are lots of great deals in the GTA right now on these cars. http://www.kijiji.ca/v-cars-trucks/c...ationFlag=true http://www.kijiji.ca/v-cars-trucks/o...ationFlag=true

That is a way overpriced high mileage auction car. Don't even waste your time.

^ Well, when you convert the km to miles and the Canadian dollar to the US dollar, it looks a lot better. If my math is correct, that's about a 75k mile C4S for about $22,000 asking. If KK is correct about it being an auction car, figure about $3,000 to get it sorted out and establish a maintenance baseline. Assuming you can buy it for US $21k, that puts you at US$24k for a 75k mile C4S well sorted. Not a bad price point.

Andrew, For your budget you could get a much newer Cayman S. The 996 vs Cayman debate is well documented. For me ,two words settled the issue "snap oversteer" aka "lift-off oversteer" My excuse was that my wife would drive the car.In reality few of us (esp.me!) have the driving skills to correct this on public roads. The 4S and PSM address this problem but don't entirely solve it. Mid-engine location plus PSM seems better. Porsche Cayman S Sport: PSM at Work - YouTube

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Well said.

^^^ Read this carefully.

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The turbo also doesn't cost 2x of the NA cars. The issue that is easy to overlook is that a lot of Turbos out there have very few miles. NA cars with so few miles cost a pretty penny.

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I'm saying you pay 20-25k for NA 996 and spend another 15-20k making it reliable as hell. you'll be in the same price ballpark as a turbo.

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Well 40K is the top of my budget. If possible I would like to stay well below that, but if the right car comes around why not? What I am trying to say is, yes the money is there, but if I don't need to go that high that's good. I really had not looked at 997's thinking they would be beyond my budget. Time to look again. The silver one has been sold, or at least it was when I called on monday. KK thanks for your input regarding the blue one I posted a link for. The dealer was NOT super straight forward about where the car came from, so I am thinking it is an auction car. Red flag. For those cautioning about the $$$$ I can get myself into, I am well aware of that fact. The Boxster, although not a 996 opened my eyes to the cost to keep the cars running for the long haul. Not to mention a major issues basically kills the car from an engine stand point. If I get one I will be looking to keep it for the long haul, so dumping $ into it doesn't put me off. Even if I were to lose a motor I would most likely just send it to Flat 6 to deal with it. I have other mods of transportation, and the wife actually hates sports cars a lot , plus she cannot drive a stick so the car is for myself. Lets say I were to make an offer on that blue one, what would be a good starting point. Haggling has never been something I have been good at. If I can pay the amount I buy something, if not oh well I move on. I'm not going to put an offer on it, but just humor me if you could. As for the Caymen S, I would have the same feeling as I do with the Boxster. I love it but it's not a 911. Keep the replies coming

when I was pcar shopping I test drove a 06 cayman S and was really disappointed. I went right back to searching for 996's with a 3.6 it's isn't much of a horsepower boost but you can really feel the difference between the 2.

http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/201...-really-costs/

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YOAV IS BACK!!!

A doofus article about a doofus who can't navigate the basic world of basic used cars. He should re-lease his Corolla.

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Funny read. However, I hope I don't sound like the guy in the article

Ok so the deal fell through on this car. http://wwwa.autotrader.ca/a/Porsche/...&orup=15_15_22 It's a US Import, brought in 2006. 2 owners and they bought the car from Oakville Porsche because the P dealer said the Km's were to high to sell... They provided me with a car fax, clean title, however it has a "police' incident in 2011. Looks like a hit and run or something. Front end cosmetic damage, but no insurance claim to go with it? No IMS upgrade. Waiting to see if they have records for the car. Thoughts? 67592 miles. $21,669 USD as per my conversion calculation aka google.

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That's a nice car, if a PPI checked out and it has some sort of records it might be worth a look.

Be sure to check the quality of the repairs from whatever the police incident was. Assuming that it was repaired correctly, sounds like a winner. I would still consider the blue car though. I like the silver cars, but there are a lot of them. That midnight blue over black interior is a fantastic color combo.

http://wwwb.autotrader.ca/a/Porsche/...&orup=10_15_38 http://wwwb.autotrader.ca/a/Porsche/...&orup=12_15_38 I would be ALL over the silver turbo above if I was in the market. Heck wanna buy my c4s for 37k Haha

Those both look like a lot of car for the money. I f you don't get hung up on mileage and focus instead on condition, it is amazing what you can buy for around US$25,000 or less.

The yellow one either has some massive rear wheel spacers or the offset on those rims is way off for this car. The stance resembles that of a 1978 Trans Am with traction bars.

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Agree!

Once again thank you so much for the replies and opinions. I was looking at the turbo today while browsing. I can't believe they are that cheap. It almost seems to good to be true. Then again best case how long would that car last me? 200,000km? I don't know. If I buy something it's for a long period of time. No word back on the Silver CS4 as of right now. Going to see what they say about the repairs /records. How in the hell am I going to even consider buying these while being so far away? I will be in Ont next month, but I wont have long. My brother is nearby and he is car dealer, but not P cars. He knows the dealership that has the Silver Cs4 though, maybe he can pull some strings for me. He did help me buy a Yaris a few years ago for $100 over cost to the dealership. How about this idea? Buying a roller and having Flat 6 put in a motor for me? Pick one of their engine setups and go with that? I dunno just throwing things out there. Side note. A good friend of mine passed away today. I am only 30, he was 31. Really putting things into perspective for me. I keep thinking long term, with $ planning and saving, and moving things around, putting things off. I remember growing up with him, seems a lifetime ago now.

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^ Because this. BTW, it's C4S, not CS4. I think it would be much more cost effective to buy a car with a Raby engine already installed than to buy a roller. Plus, he has about a one year wait list. Most Porsche purchases will be long-distance transactions. Fly out - drive home is a great adventure. Be sure to take a friend/family member along and it will be a trip you'll remember for the rest of your lives.

Right C4S Wow one year, holy smokes. Good to know that most are long distance things. Well time to just see what the dealership has to say with regards to the records. Driving home might be an issue. Cross Canada in the winter is not something I would like to do with this car. I am looking at maybe shipping it here. $1400 CDN or so for the Shipping VIA train to Richmond on the Mainland near Vancouver. Who wants to buy a well kept 2000 Boxster S with an LN IMS installed?

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From Toronto, detour south to Atlanta to visit the new PCNA headquarters and drive on their track. Then head west to Las Vegas.Spend a couple of days there, head to Los Angeles. Drive north along the Pacific coastline to Vancouver. Trip of a lifetime. You're welcome.

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Wow! I am picturing that in my head right now. I can't believe I didn't think of going south. I am thinking far too much about engine problems as of right now haha. I want to buy the car just for an excuse to make that trip. Although Vegas doesn't do much for me.

I can't believe a lot more of our canadian cars are not going south right now with the current pricing and us exchange rate. I would have to think our 30k cars would be a screaming deal to our American friends? I guess maybe once you factor in the freight if shipping etc it might not be.

I live North of Toronto and I have a 2001 C2 I am contemplating selling. Following highlights - Two owners before me. Arizona and Georgia, imported by me in 2012 - 115,000 km total mileage - 15,000 km on Full Flat 6 Inovations "performer" 3.6L rebuild, including billet rods, with 272 Hp at rear wheels and about 340 at crankshaft. Stock is 240/300. - 997 GT 3 brakes, sway bars and JIC coilovers. - GT 3 Mark 1 Factory Body kit - 18 and 19" wheels - new Maxspeed sport , mufflers and X cats. - Speed Yellow with black interior. Excellent condition overall. - all records since new. $30k US, $40k CDN. All in cost for motor rebuild is in the high $20s in CDN dollars with today's exchange.

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Sounds like a good price for the car, however I could never buy a yellow one.

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I think it must have something to do with total number of cars. Lets say I was in the USA and wanted a 996. I could find LOTS close by, or maybe even a few states away. So I would just sit and wait until a nice one appeared in my area as opposed to factoring in the hassle of shipping, or flying cost to go pick up the car. Even for myself the thought of buying a car a great distance away from me is so odd. The dealer with that nice silver one called me back this AM. No Service records for the car, although the say the RMS and IMS have not been replaced. How could they know this without records? I know 100% you can't tell if an IMS has been done by just looking at the car. So after hearing that, and because I have no idea how this stuff works over long distance I said something along the lines of "ummmm I will get back to you" No service records = no buy at least for me.

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There was a silver one on autotrader with a GT2 body kit. It looked really good and the price was excellent. The owners manual even had all the dealer service stamps in it. Not sure its still around. Maybe spring will be a better time but likely higher prices. No Caymans eh? http://www.kijiji.ca/v-cars-trucks/c...ationFlag=true http://www.kijiji.ca/v-cars-trucks/m...ationFlag=true http://wwwb.autotrader.ca/a/Porsche/...howcpo=ShowCPO http://wwwb.autotrader.ca/a/Porsche/...orup=30_15_106 Few more This one in Richmond looks nice http://wwwb.autotrader.ca/a/Porsche/...orup=54_15_106

No Caymans The silver one looks nice and it has the IMS done already. However, its owned by a younger guy and it has aftermarket suspension on it. I'm a young guy and I know how a lot of people my age take care of their stuff, aka they don't. Also that car is about $5000 over what I would be willing to pay for it. IMS or not. I would consider the Richmond car if he had stock suspension parts, and he came down to under 30K The black one looks really nice, but it's a dealer car so most likely way over priced. 80,000 km is nice but not $10,000 more nicer ( if that makes sense ).

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All makes sense! I'm 33 and even though I'm great with my stuff I wouldn't want another 33 year olds car per say. But I'm also a commercial pilot that has learned to be mature with my equipment.

I just came across a very nice looking low mileage MK1 C2 for sale on the PCA-PNW region facebook page. The car is in the Seattle area, so only a couple of hours south of Vancouver. "2000 Carrera II, 44k original miles, local, 6 speed, beautiful ! $21,998.00 but offer me $20,998.98. if a Porsche Club member." You can see pics and contact info on FB: https://www.facebook.com/groups/pnwrpca/?fref=nf P.S. Good luck with the search. I spent over a year searching for my 996 and, while it isn't as much fun as driving it, the search is still great fun and a great learning experience.

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Thanks for the link! However, I will need the wife to login and let me look at the car I don't use FB anymore haha. Yes, it is close by. I'm not in a rush to buy one I will just take my time and see what I can find.

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I spent 18 months looking for my first 996 and 6 months searching for the second one. Just remember that right now it is a buyer's market. After the first of the year, that will begin to change. March through June is a seller's market and prices will be significantly higher.

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Lol, tokika THIS was the First thought that came to me also! IF you Really want somebody to talk you out of it go to the WATER side! GL

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You was probably talking about when you turn the AC on it Fogs the Bottom of the front windshield up!

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I assumed prices would jump up then. Well, I think before I do anything now I should try to sell the Boxster. I can't have both I don't have the room and it wouldn't make a lot of sense. However, I sell the Boxster I am committed to buying something to replace it. I don't even bother going to the Air Cooled section, my true love the 964 will always be beyond my reach

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Face, like KC said Right Now is a BUYERS Market, NOT a Sellers! Especially, a Sports Car. I Don't know if your Boxter is a Vert or not, but if it is right now is Definitely NOT the time to be trying to sell it! GL

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I had a 964 for 5 years. I loved it - fantastic car. It was my first Porsche, so was very special to me. But, both of the 996s I've owned were/are better. No doubt in my mind.

Sounds like you prefer to driving anyways... and that's why you shouldn't buy a 911.

Boxsters are convertibles. KC I think you are the only person who has said the 996 is better then a 964 I think the best thing for me to do is to find one local to me and take it for a drive. Spooln, really? Yeah silly me for asking and doing research before dropping 40K on a car. That may not be a lot of $ for you, but for me it is.

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If you like the body style of the 996, then IMO there is not much reason to consider any other model. To me, the 996 is my least favorite body style of the 911, but it is perhaps one of the best to drive. The 996 is lighter than the 993 and the 964 that preceded it, and MUCH lighter than the 997. My favorite 911's to drive are the pre-'73 cars because they are true lightweight sports cars. To me, the 996 feels a lot like those early cars because the combination of relatively light weight, a lot more power, and light steering makes them feel very tossable like the early cars, but with all the modern comforts of a current car. These comments are for my current 2000 C2 6-speed. I had a 2001 Carrera 4 996 with Tiptronic (back when they were new) that I didn't love all that much. The combination of automatic and more weight took the fun out of it for me, but my current 6-speed C2 is a hoot and I appreciate how special the driving experience is every time I get in the car.

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So, that's like - Boy Scouts? Right? FFA? Ski Patrol? j/k. You get credit no matter where.

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Haha I get that a lot when I travel outside of Canada it's all in good fun. Thanks for the kind words Still it's a very serious business, because of my service I will walk with a cane for the rest of my life. But that's all I am going to say about that. Anyway, the dealer with the blue C4S called me today wondering if I was still interested. They are now asking 28K CND. IMO that's not bad pending a decent PPI, they said it was owned by a mechanic at the local P dealer not an auction car but who knows.

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Man, that blue one seems like a very nice deal. US$21,000 for under 80,000 miles for a C4S. When groovzilla sold his silver C4S with 100k miles at $19,500, he had people fighting over it like it was Black Friday at Walmart. Oh, BTW, thank you for your service and your sacrifice. Somebody has got to protect our 51st state!

Once again thanks for the kind words Ok, well when the dealer takes the car back from the indy shop it is at I think i will pay for a PPI. Or should I haggle the price first pending a PPI? Lets say I offer even less, something like 26K pending a decent PPI? I think 26K is a great price for the car if I can get it. Is it ever worth it to buy a car without decent records?

Settle on the price before you do the PPI. Once you've invested money in the PPI, the dealer will know you really want it. But, insist that the offer is contingent on the car "passing" the PPI. Let him know that your understand there might be a few minor issues, but that you expect that the dealer will have disclosed any significant defects, so your offer is based on the dealer's description of the car. As for buying without records, well, that's why I like buying from an individual. But, it's not a deal killer if the PPI comes back positive.

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Well, no offense to the seller(s) but I don't trust anything they say. Lotta car for the bucks. That can be said about all 996s. The best thing of course is that it's not black, silver, gray, white. Not perfect like guards red, or anything but blue is acceptable.

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Yes one thing I have learned is "trust but verify" everything. It might be nice to own one car that isn't black. Although this one looks like it will be a pain to keep clean as well. Thanks for the advice everyone! I will keep you posted. One more thing. I cannot believe how far these cars have depreciated. I mean my Boxster is worth like 10% of what it was new, but these are 911s!

Just found this one... It looks really nice. IMS has been done as well, and it's just across the water from me. http://wwwa.autotrader.ca/a/Porsche/...O&orup=2_15_46

You are right. $28K is not a bad price for the blue C4S. Generally, prices are a little lower in Ontario than in the local market here but then you have the hassle of the long distance transaction and the cost of transporting the car. 128K kilometers is not what I'd call low mileage, so that and the time of year are probably dragging the price down somewhat. Overall, a decent price for a C4S providing the PPI turns out positive. Good Luck!

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Looks nice but over priced IMO. I think it should be priced at about $25K.

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Maybe let it age a few weeks. They usually drop the price after 10-20 days sitting. Not sure about that door graphic but if it's subtle I guess it can stay. What's the dealo with the red tick at 50KPH on the speedo? Have them open the frunk and grab up the options on the sticker inside. The clutch IMS job being done recent is worth a few thou to me. One less thing to futz with if you live in a condo/townhouse/apt/barracks. lol...

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Yeah I am going to wait them out a little bit. The price as others have mentioned is high, but it does have some things which could save me $$$. For one the IMS/Clutch would be about 3K with parts and labor. Also, a local car would save me $1400 in shipping costs if I was unable to drive it back, or take it south. I live in a Condo and working on cars in the parking area is a no no. Edit: WOW I missed that stupid Graphic on the side.... ugly IMO.

Face, just take your time! You'll KNOW when you see the one that's for you Believe Me, it's out there & it's waitin' just for you

^^^^^ S'truth. I was starting to relax my standards after not finding the car I want for > year. Suddenly, as I was headed out on vacation a red 99 aero with sport package came up for sale 70 miles away. I jumped on it and slammed the deal through from offshore with a little help from my locals. Don't relax your standards. If you want a C4S, get that. If you want a turbo, get that. I recommended up front driving a few and stick with it.

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That's part of the problem. I am trying to decide which one I want. I'm not set on the C4S, but the price is right. However, I think I would like a RWD car a little bit more. I am just going to keep looking until the right one jumps out at me and then I will go for it.