Should I even consider this???

New member here with questions. At age 65 I decided to have a weekend toy car to play around and a 2000 Porsche 911 Carrera Millennium Edition caught my eye. Mainly for being a Porsche and for being sale at $24,000 asking price. I find it too good to be true first but shortly after I realized that the price was due to car having a "REBUILD" title... So, a salvage was purchased and fixed. CarFax reports show this 2000 model 911 was purchased in 2000 (obviously) and then driven 32000 miles until 2015.. which I found extremely low average mileage. then in 2015 it had the accident and damaged front left end and totaled by the insurance. Then purchased by a body shop owner and fixed and got REBUILD Title issued in 2015 and then driven up to 44,000 mile (currently) and up for sale. I am aware of the IMS and RMS issues with these model and years involved... My question is, when Porsche issued this Recall or Service bulletin or whatever at the time has been made owners aware of this issue? I assume Porsche should became aware of this issue after during the 15 year following this 911 Millennium Edition, like other models of in that era 996 engines. So, since current seller is the 4th or 5th owner he does not know if IMS issue has been taken care of or not... How could I find it for sure? But also what are the chances a Porsche owner will disregard the recall if it was been issued between 2000 and 2015... Also, when this car totaled in 2015 with ~ 33,000 miles on it that means it was driven an average of less than 2,200 miles a year. Is that normal? Currently 44,000 miles mean still in 22+ years this car did not exceed an average of 2000 miles/year. Does all of these models suffer from IMS issue or only few or what? How can I be sure that IMS won't be an issue after me getting this car if I go ahead and purchase it? Thanks in advance,

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Quotes source post: 18668812

Just wanted to join you so you won't feel lonely !

I can't give you a complete answer but may have some useful observations..... I bought my first Porsche 5 years ago at age 70, after years of BMWs and other cars. Have found a new set of good friends in local PCA and great pleasure in driving. A salvage title will always affect value. A mitigating positive would be if the seller has maintained the car and kept thorough records including documentation of accident repair work. It's been 7-8 years since rebuild, sufficient time to build a good service history. If insufficient records, assume car has not been serviced and walk away. Have a thorough inspection by a Porsche or bodywork specialist. At this mileage, assume the IMSB is unchanged if no LN sticker or other record, As a 2000, it should have the more robust double row IMSB so less of a risk. Porsche NA might have a recall notice or record. With good records, low mileage and a clean title, it might be a 30-35k car. Millenium Edition wouldnt add much value. At 24k, with any deferred maintenance expense, you could be at 30k quickly. If you're going to keep the car for a while, the "salvage penalty" will diminish somewhat, but will still exist. If inspection and records are positive, then this could be a good bet and the price can be justified. If not, then this becomes a 20k dice roll. Keep us posted.

Quotes source post: 18668756

For what I have seen, insurance companies in US are easy on totaling a car. That means that, your car could have had a very sever damage or just an expensive damage, but not as severe, that could have been repair well. What I would do is, to hire on of those companies that are able to make a technical report of the car and how it is repaired (and if there is any damabe in the frame still, out of geometry, etc). I have seen some of those reports and they are very detailed, with pictures, etc. Sorry I dont remember the name of the company, but there are several that you can hire online. If the report comes out ok, and you are planing to keep the car (remember that the rebuild title will affect the car resale value), go for it. It can be a good opportunity to get in a 911 at a good price

With the additional mileage on the car I wouldn't worry about mechanical issues related to the accident or repairs, but that does not rule out cosmetics. Don't go crazy fretting about the IMSB. Get a PPI from a reputable shop. Offer $20K if the PPI comes back clean. A salvage title will always be a salvage title and will affect the car's value for at least the next decade if not longer.

Move on. You can get a clear title 996 for about the same or slightly more, certainly under $30K.

There is no way� under any circumstances that a salvage title 996 is �worth� $30-$35k. �Nuff said

Thank you for all the replies. As I understood there are 3 types of auto titles in the US: a) Clean - a vehicle with no remarkable accidents since day 1 will have... b) Salvage - a vehicle will be issued after insurance company considers not to fix the damage due to being either too extensive or expensive compared to car's value... c) Rebuilt - will be issued after a vehicle with a Salvage title is purchased by a person or entity and rebuild in its original shape and specs and after an inspection performed by Highway Patrol personnel OK the vehicle for safe operation. This vehicle have REBUILT title... As for the value issue ; I know many people are asking why am I even consider purchasing a 996 with a REBUILT title for $24,000 (or maybe a little less) while there are many of them out there with clean title for just about the same price or merely a thousand or more dollars. I don't know if those of you miss the car model I am talking about. I am considering this model 996 because ONLY because it is a 2000 Porsche 911 Carrera Millennium Edition... There was one with 24000 miles and clean title and she was sold last month at an auction for US$52,300 and currently another one is on the market with a clean title and similar mileage for US$47,500.... As I understood this limited edition Porsche models which was built only 911 of them worldwide has a different value than any other ordinary 2000 model standard 911 models. I don't want any regular or standard 996 with black interior even if it was at the same mileage and IMSB and RMS issues already taken care of etc that comes with black or grey interior and at their usual dash setup... I am aware that this car's value will be lower due to being issued a REBUILT title. That is the reason this 996 is listed for $24000 and not like the others are sold or selling for over $45k or $50k price tag... Unfortunately since I did not hit the Super Lotto jackpot as of this moment, I am not wealthy enough to fork out $47,500 to have a toy car to play around at weekends. The motorcycle in my garage cost me $28000. So if my toy car is under that amount I am ok with that. If anyone of you know a 2000 Millennium Edition 911 with Clean title around $28,000 that has less than 45k miles on it, please let me know; I will buy it today! Just please don't tell me any other typical 996 of that era are available for the same price or a little more. I saw them and I won't consider buying them even if they were $15,000 with a clean title. If I ever buy a toy weekend Porsche it will be the one called 2000 Millennium Edition ... Because of the dash design, interior color, exterior special paint color, being built in limited numbers worldwide etc., I want one of those at an affordable price for me! So if I could manage to buy this one for, let's say $22,000 and enjoy it for a year or two or three. I won't mind if I have to sell and only brings me $15,000... I know I am not going to make money on it as same as my motorcycle. My profit is the FUN I am planning to have with these vehicles! Nothing more, nothing less. But of course I don't want to end up with a $22,000 worth boat anchor or paper weight in my garage either. So, since I was never into Porsche models until now, I was wondering what is this IMSB or RMSB issues people talking about. In the past I owned BMW 745Li then 750Li and then MB SL550 but never heard or experienced bearings seizing or oil leakage problems in the years I drove them and not only as a weekend vehicle but as a commuter. So this Millennium Edition feels like a collectors item to me even if it wasn't revered by most of the Porsche owners who won't take a second look at this model. Again thanks for all the comments friends...

My main question is does this IMSB issue was ever a recall issued by Porsche ? Or was it like, " well we sold you a high performance car and the engine may mess up at anytime due to a questionable part quality or engineering issue and when it happens pay up and fix it you suckers" kind of issue... Because when a car or motorcycle manufacturer issues a recall no matter what's the current condition of those vehicles whether effected or non effected at that moment IMHO owners take it to the dealerships and get the necessary fix performed on them. Was this IMSB issue a " weeeell, if you feel like it do it otherwise, don't bother with it " kind of issue? And what is the ratio of the effected cars with this issue? 1% or 10% or 50% of the 996 models suffer? As owners what was your experience? Because if Porsche tells the owners this problem may occur at 5000 mile or 50000 mile or God knows when then if there was a recall is it for the lifetime of the vehicle? Some people reach 50000 mile in 2 years some drivers after 10 years don't have still 50000 showing on their odometers. Does Porsche offering owners roll the dice to see if they are lucky or SOL at some point during their ownership?

Quotes source post: 18669754

I dont feel like typing out a novel here, so long story short is I would dodge this like the plague. You should be able to find a pretty good 996 for 25-30k that has little to no stories.

The IMSB has been discussed to death on the forums but here is a quick answer to your question. There was never a recall. People that had failure that were covered under warranty had an engine replaced by Porsche and there is probably documentation somewhere. The vast majority of people that have addressed it did so proactively and via third party (Porsche did not provide a solution short of a new engine). Without a sticker, or documentation, that the bearing has been replaced - assume it has not. Period. If you don't want to worry about it - have the IMS Solution installed and never lose sleep again. Cheers Charlie

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^ This is the most sound advice you will get here. The end!

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Thank you Charlie. That was my question all along since some people were saying don't bother if you don't have metal shaving in your oil filter and drive it forever happily. Then some say if it's not being done you're screwed because your engine will seize at any moment maybe 1000 miles later or 10000 miles later but it is guaranteed to fail. That was confusing to me since this seems to be a major issue how in the world it could be addressed so vaguely by Porsche and why even a Porsche owner would skip this Free Fix while their vehicle is still under warranty? I was curious about that... But it seems like even though this car I was interested in looks good, it may not be my cup of tea... Most likely I'll skip it.... My thinking was if I can get it for $20,000-$22,000 range I'd be ok even at the end if I have to part it out... But I guess I was wrong!

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Even though you didn't want typing out a novel, you still did type more than needed. If you read my post, I mentioned clearly I won't consider buying any other "pretty good 996" for $25-30k even if they dropped their price to $15k for me .The only reason I considered this 996 for it is being the Millennium Edition setup. During my search for USED Porsche models this one was not the only car I've found as anyone can imagine. I came across 100s of that era 996 models at the same price range and there was a reason I didn't consider any of them at all. Now if I find another "pretty good" Millennium Edition for $25-30k with little or no story..... Well that is whole a lot of different story and I can write a novel about that finding!!

Quotes source post: 18669856

The "free fix" from Porsche was only offered if your engine hand grenaded within warranty or during the settlement period which was from a lawsuit. Your prospective car has other issues which would be too much for me. It's your money...

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Haha this was the best explanation of Porsche corporate culture. Thank you for making my day. I agree I'll look another brand weekend toy car a BMW or Mercedes etc...

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Ha! Good luck with that�

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I'm not saying a 996 is a bad weekend toy. It is a great weekend toy. You just need to find a good one, be aware of the car's needs and realize repairs/maintenance can be expensive. As far as Porsche corporate culture...no comment.

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Thank you!

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I agree but like I mentioned before I was not thinking to buy a Porsche specifically for a weekend/toy car. I am not fond of older Porsche models in general. But this Millennium Edition interior and dash setup/design with being produced in limited numbers kind of points caught my eye. So in my personal taste I think any other model 996 of that era looks like an ordinary car and interior is boring look to them. I am not planning racing. So I don't really need a "performance car". But of course I'd like a sporty looking car as a weekend toy and not a Toyota Corolla. A mustang GT, or an older Corvette or even a 2007 Mercedes SL500 or like the 2011 BMW Z4 I've found for $23k with 50k miles will satisfy my weekend toy car need. That's what I meant... There are plenty of cars out there with proven reliable engines and clean titles and also with newer model year other than a 20+ yr old 996... Still, if there was a 2000 millennium edition for sale with clean title, less than 50k mile, new clutch and IMS has been taken care of I'd fork out $30k today but the one for sale on this forums classifieds asking for $47,500 unfortunately. Oh well...

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I don't believe there are many differences between the ME cars and the rest of the 996s. But, if you want some exclusivity and special add-ons you should check out the 40th anniversary edition. That one came standard with more power. Honestly, the 996 and the other cars you're considering (SL500 and Z4) are totally different beasts. A well sorted and maintained 996 should hold it's value and even appreciate over time. The Z4 and Mercedes will most certainly depreciate. The Porsche is also more purpose built for tracking - but as you said that isn't something you're interested in (although I would HIGHLY recommend at least trying it if you get a Porsche). The Porsche also comes with the PCA which is presents great social events as well as track days (see earlier point). Ultimately you have to pick what is right for you. I previously had a 996 C4S and I absolutely loved the car. It's was a very well built car that gave me almost no issues outside of routine maintenance and a few wear items that needed to be replaced (it had > 100k miles on it).

Quotes source post: 18670275

I agree with you 100% they are very different beasts in many aspects. But when it comes to weekend fun factor issues I care about, then those differences becomes minimally important to me. I have to agree with you that I've heard lot of good things about PCA and their social activities. Like I said earlier let's see what will come out of this new endeavor of mine. It has been cold and rainy in CA since weeks and i am stuck at home bored to death and jumped into this field of search. No rush decision or action needed anyways... Thank you for your kind response. Appreciated!

BMW E86 (2006-2008) Z4 M Coupe. Mid $30's will get you a stellar example. There were only every 1815 made for the North American market. They're severely underappreciated as collectibles, not to mention they're a superbly focused piece of M engineering with driver engagement being first and foremost. That said: I don't recommend that anyone buy a weekend/fun car with investment fairies dancing in their head.

Quotes source post: 18669856

I do not own a 996, but in the market, have done a ton or research and my first post here is below: https://rennlist.com/forums/996-foru...ity-check.html But I will give my thoughts�if you can get this 996 for the price range you mention, IMO it would be a good buy as long as you intend to keep it for years and not buying to flip in a year or two. It will never hold the same value as a non-salvage title but if you like it, it�s hard to go wrong at that price. You can have any variety of IMS repair done from $1k to $3k+, monitor the engine for any signs of bore scoring (google M96 bore scoring if you need some reading materials) more than likely enjoy years of service with the normal maintenance needs of a 20+ y/o car. I�ve owned rebuilt/branded titles and drive them until the wheel fall off. I had a �07 Volvo S40, branded title, bought for $6k owned it for 8 yrs, my kids put 80k miles on it and I maintained it well. I sold it in 2 hrs on FB marketplace last summer w/ full disclosure of the branded title for $2800.

Quotes source post: 18669908

you certainly summed up your expertise in that statement !

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what make you think they are better? They�re all German and that means extensive and expensive �maintenance�

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Well, I think the short answer is going to be "my personnel experience". Extensive and expensive doesn't bother me as long as it ends up being for a "reliable" product. I don't think I'd like to drive a car while feeling like as if I was walking on egg shells and worried about what may go wrong with my "expensive and extensive car" if I use it a lot and therefore limit my usage to a minimal level. Otherwise face a lot of problems with that vehicle. In the past I owned 745Li, 750Li, SL500 and SL550 and I never experienced or heard the possibility of seized bearing issues or oil leakage problems or clutch wearing out in abnormally in short periods of time even though I used those cars on a daily basis and not only on weekends to go to car club meetings... On average I drove them a little over 15000-18000 miles a year.. My 2007 SL500 had almost 70000 miles after a little over 3,5 years. I see most Porsches from 2000 era doesn't even come close to that mileage after 23 yrs of ownership. That tells me something. Of course I agree most Porsche owners do not use their cars for daily commute and since it is more "performance" oriented car it's like a boat in the marina. More Porsche models spend more days in the garages rather than on the roads in their lifetimes. That's understandable and it may be the reason behind being a rarely used vehicles compared to many other BMW or MB models. By the way I came across today reliability index for cars and they (MB-BMW & Porsche) got 2 stars out of 5. In a way, they may all suck at certain level and I was only talking about my personal experience from the past ownership with those other two brands of German engineering marvels. Again, I am not a car guy and I may be totally wrong. It won't be the first time in my 65 years!

Yes, that is why no doubt. But on the flip side, used 911s with low miles are often in super good shape compared to, let�s say BMW M cars that can be beat to death.

right here! https://rennlist.com/forums/market/1339849

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Of course... But it's in the case of, for example if I were looking both brands 2000 model vehicles. In my example the difference I was talking about between paying $47,500 for a really good and clean 2000 Millennium Edition 911 with 24000 miles or paying $41,000 for a 2013 model SL550 with 32000 miles... In uniqueness, I agree 2000 Millennium Edition comes on top but in real world you can't just skip the idea of owning a nice and 13 yrs newer MB SL550 for $6500 less if the goal is just to have weekend fun and drive around in a hardtop convertible. Of course as it was mentioned before they are both different type of animals but both fun in their own way of course.

Quotes source post: 18672771

That may be cool but for the love of God when I read the description of the vehicle is there anything that didn't need to be changed on that car? Sounds like almost 90% parts and pieces needed to be replaced... In any case my heart is captured by this one: https://rennlist.com/forums/market/1328882

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Capt, you may be missing the point. The owner did all of the right things to refresh a 23 year old car. That's what you want. Not a car that hasn't been refreshed and you will need to spend $15-20k after you buy it just to make sure the 23 year old rubber and plastic parts don't break.

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Oh no, I got the point. I was mentioning that for the owner's point of view. Even if he wanted to keep the car throughout its life that 911 needed all that issues to be fixed or replaced etc. Otherwise, of course the buyer of that vehicle will be happy to have many newer parts in his newly purchased used car. I agree on that.

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Like he said...

This thread is hilarious. I unsubbed once but keep coming back for the laughs.

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Hi Captain, I'm the seller and also a fellow military officer. I didn't have to change a lot of those parts, I did it because I like my car running and operating properly... I'm sure you can appreciate that. I wanted a sharp handling car, first and foremost. Some of the stuff just makes sense to change when you are doing other things, so it's kind of a rabbit hole. I also used to own a couple of franchise auto repair shops and I'm somewhat **** about preventative maintenance. Good luck with your search, the 996 is a great 911. P.S. if you ever want some advice on what to look for avoid, or just have questions on the 996 please feel free to PM me and I'd be happy to share with a fellow comrade. This doesn't have anything to do with the fact that I'm selling my car. I'm not trying to push it on anyone.

It's a good looking car. Cosmetics is worth a lot IMO. I would want to know exactly what was repaired. German auto makers suck and Porsche is the worst, but the cars are light, fairly powerful and great to drive. Unfortunately, you're stuck with Porsche if you want that feel. This car is a good color, has the right wheels and it has a rear wiper. I have wiper envy

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I appreciate your explanation and understand your position. I am 100% sure your car mechanically 1000% better than the ME I was looking at with Rebuilt title... If I were a Porsche enthusiast I'd possibly consider a car like yours with a well known history, service records and driven to be appreciated rather than being a garage queen. In my case I am 50% for the looks and 50% for the performance... All my cars and motorcycles, boats and even planes I owned were either White or dark navy/black kind of color. That ME interior color was also my SL500 and my 750Li Interior color too which I loved it.... I never owned any other color car or motorcycles even if they were offered for a great price. I know it's weird but these kind of vehicles need to satisfy my eyes first for me to consider it owning it. If tomorrow I win a Yellow colored 2023 Carrera GT from a raffle first thing I'll do is sell that thing and get a white or black or equivalently dark colored another car. In the process if I lose some equity or value so be it. I hope I can find a car which was loved and maintained like yours to serve my goal. I may take you on your offer and PM you with some advice on few issues. I appreciate the offer.

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Be careful, you may hurt some feelings here ! At certain issues all large corporations with products they target above a certain level clientele suck at customer service... Oh well...

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If you win a Yellow colored 2023 Carrera GT please pm me I would be happy to take it off your hands for a reasonable price...

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Have fun with the search! The Millenium Edition is very nice. I really like the color of those cars.

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Mostly the contrast of interior colors and design got my eye. If it was black or grey seats and dash I'll not give it a second look to be honest. Otherwise it's just another 996 and they are a lot of them out there. I am not into the idea of I have to have a Millennium Edition... If I find a 911 with same interior and dash colors and with 40-50k miles with IMS issues taken care of already; I'd consider it even if it is 2001 or 2003 or whatever... It doesn't't have to be a ME but exterior color has to be black or white !

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I am not greedy my friend if that happens you'll be the first person I'll contact !

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Let me be more clear....Porsche is an awful company. Their greed knows no bound. That said, you aren't forced to buy one. I wish Toyota would make a nicely styled 3000lb 400 hp, N/A, mid engine sports car....with 18 inch wheels

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That car would have an "unobtainable" price as the last Carrera GT was produced in 2006!😬 They are pretty cool cars though:

If you have interest in a non-salvage titled, BUT had prior accident a few owners past. My 996 is listed here and would consider offers in that price range. Mine is a fantastic daily that has been sorted.

This just gets better and better. Well done captain.

It's the Newmanium Millenium here

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Who can claim that Porsche ownership doesn't come with extra entertainment? See? Even on the forum, "fun" is included !!!

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There are also the owners who just can't stop themselves. . Most of what he did is decent preventative maintenance, But I see people doing like transmission pullouts at 25K.. Because they heard that 2nd gear might wear in a 996.2 trans.. One solid repetitive experience I have had is German brands can't make rubber parts to save their lives and most German cars need a ton of seals, trim and such replaced if they are not garaged when idle, and are getting past 10 years old. Based upon numerous VW/BMW/PORSCHE/Audi customer experiences for me.. All 4 marques need their entire cooling system replaced at about 80K if you follow their service recommendations.. Plastic radiators plastic pipes have a effective life span, 80K or 10 years.. when they break its almost always a engine destruction event..