Factory Collection - Confused

Looking forward to factory collection of my C4s first week August, and my local OPC says that I must travel back on transit plates. After speaking with my insurer, who don't understand the concept of insurance by chassis number, I was seriuosly thinking about changing to someone who does. By chance, I happened to pick up a copy of GT, which has a several page artical on three guys collecting their GT3RS's from the factory. Every picture however had an english plate on the cars, and on some you can make out the tax disc - So what's that all about then?

If you are collecting from the factory on the official collection programme, your UK insurance is not involved. Porsche cover you for the number of days you are having for your trip. The UK insurance only get involved after the UK plates are fitted to the car (in my case on the 10th day, upon going to the OPC for finalising the UK paperwork). You only need cover from your insurers from then. You are in effect acting as Porsche's delivery driver when you do factory collection, they cover you. One further thing, when we collected our car, we were told by Porsche UK that only ONE driver was covered, but on arrival at Porsche they told us we were both covered (so it is a good job we both took our licences). We did meet one UK couple who had been told "only one driver" and had left the other-halves licence at home. They found that if she had bought her licence she would have been covered. Things may have changed since then, but worth being prepared!

Excellent - Thanks v much for that. I had that kind of (I'm one of them for a few days) feeling when reading through the paper work to sign!!! I will now force the issue with my local OPC. I also think I will ommit the other piece of information for the wife as she has crunched 3 18" alloys on the bm in as many weeks... cheers Alex

OK, but bear in mind it's handy to have a back-up driver in case of emergencies... Good luck with the trip - you'll have a great time!

point taken!! we are planning on visiting a mate in munich, then heading back through lux(for some cheap petrol),belgium(for some cheap fags) then france(because we have to) over the course of a week

I have never picked up a Porsche, but two Mercedes, and I believe the principle is identical (Mercedes charge the standard factory delivery charge of about £500 to pick your car up from Sindelfingen, whereas Porsche charge about £1100, I believe. If you are collecting an AMG, this includes a trip to the AMG factory as well, and a blast round the test track!). As Mark says, you are taking advantage of the 'freedom of movement of goods within the EEC' act, and delivering the car on behalf of the importer. You are given some official looking documents to this effect, should you be stopped by Customs. In fact, the car is not legally yours yet, which is why you are not responsible for insuring it. Although what happens if the French stop you for speeding is not clear to me, given their recent propensity to confiscate vehicles! One of the more interesting aspects of such a trip is the way that British motorists treat you (in a car with German number plates) upon your return to the UK. It is extremely embarrasing to witness their behaviour to 'overseas visitors'. You find yourself pointing to the steering wheel - "LOOK, I'M BRITISH TOO!"

As someone shortly to embark upon an extended business and touring trip to France in my 996, I am just a tad alarmed to read in your email that the French police have taken to confiscating vehicles ( for speeding offences ? ). Can you please elaborate upon that, and can anyone else ? Steve

I am a regular visitor to France, and have been known to exceed the speed limit on occasions, and so I keep my ear to the ground about such things. French authorities claim that ten per cent of all motoring offences are committed by foreigners and are desperate to bring down the high levels of road fatalities and injuries - double those in the UK. While serious offenders are prosecuted through the courts, the majority of misdemeanours - like speeding - are dealt with by on the spot fines of up to £300. If you are stopped for speeding in France travelling over 150 kph, the police have the right to impound your vehicle together with a hefty fine and placing points on your licence (although this bit is unlikely). AND DO NOT FORGET - While the radar and laser detectors, which warn motorists of speed enforcement equipment in the vicinity, have been legal to own and use in the UK since 1999, many other European countries ban them and impose stringent sentences for having them fitted in the vehicle "" even when they are not operational. Punishment for carrying or using such a device can vary from possible imprisonment in Luxembourg and the Republic of Ireland, to the loss of licence and car and a fine of up to £1000 in France.

I did hear that the Merc factory is much fun to see...As for price I think it was a few quid short of 800, I'm not sure if this changes if you want them to organise a few stop off's or not?(Probably)

Mercedes did not (last year) charge any extra for you to collect the car (E, S or CLK Class, AMG) from Sindelfingen than the standard factory delivery charge, but this is for just one person. If the car is built in another factory (C Class, SLK, SL, ML), this may be different. If you take someone else, you must pay an additional business class fare to Stuttgart. The price includes a taxi from the airport, one night in the Ramada hotel in Sindelfingen, dinner, breakfast, a taxi to the factory, the factory tour, tickets to the Mercedes museum in Stuttgart (a must see,as cars #1 & #2 are there), a tank of fuel, five days insurance and a Eurotunnel ticket back to Folkestone. I assume the Porsche scheme is similar, if a little more expensive (but that may be for the Cayenne, which is Leipzig). I have done it a couple of times and it was very interesting, in a 'through the square window' Play School sort of way. Obviously, with both marques in the same city, you can visit the other, too! Also, you get most of the tedious running-in done on empty motorways and/or A-roads. Another interesting facet of factory collection is that the handover is about as thorough as you could possible want - you certainly will never need to read the owners manual afterwards! When recently picking up a friends E-Class, the hand-over guy noticed a small scratch on a rear side window. The car was apologetically whisked away to have the pane replaced and M-B paid for a full-on lunch for four of us in their very civilised silver-service restaurant, while we waited. Contrast this to the likely scenario at your local dealer! In fact, the only downside to such trips is taking the car back to your dealer for registration and PDI. I can see why the moneyed return their cars to the Porsche factory for maintenance! It is also interesting to visit the area and meet the people. After a few days you begin to understand why Porsches and M-B's are the finest cars. I would definitely recommend it, if you get the chance.

They say that they (the French) monitor motorway speed via the toll tickets, but have never seen this. Drink/driving is a problem there, along with deep roadside ditches, which accounts for some of the cars in ditches that you see in rural France (and the lack of cats eyes). Very few speed cameras (yet), and not too many police about, so, if you are not too silly, you should get away with it. Not many sports cars, so ours tend to stand out more.

Apart from Le Mans week, that is! It seems like half the French Gendarmerie are camped along Indianapolis on Mad Friday, although they do seem to only breathalise(?) the locals. APart from then, I do agree, though. I was not trying to put the willies up anyone, but it is a sobering thought to consider ones pride and joy being towed away in the middle of France!

You on that the French police have a right to impound your vehicle. Is this a measure they employ pending payment of any fine they may levey and if the driver is unable to pay when stopped ? Steve.

Not just the French Police.... I understand that if you go too far over the speed limit in the Netherlands, they can confiscate your vehicle and SELL IT before you have time to appeal...

I always thought a large roll of used notes could get you out of any situation!!

Jeeeeeeeeeez ! Are you winding us up ? Given that Holland is a country that spawned Pym Fortuyn, where it is mandatory (almost) to be gay, where the smoking of spliffs is not only permitted but encouraged, it seems kinda hard to believe that the filth can come down so hard on poor bloody speedsters ! But then, maybe their Transport Secretary/Minister of Roads or whatever he calls himself, is a bicyclist. owns shares in clog making factories, or is a canal ice skating champion..........or all three ! Steve.

French policeman is man with gun - tread carefully.

They can impound your vehicle and fine you. Don't know anyone yet who has suffered. Apart from me being fined £100.00 some years back. 'Grand Vitesse' !

French policeman with a gun ?..........to bloody true ! Does anyone remember reading about what happened to me when I refused to pay a French policeman a bribe a few years ago ? ( I reported it at length in the old 964 Chatgroup ). I got maced ( CS gas) for my troubles, and then whilst I was rolling around on the ground covered in snot and puke, I stopped his boot with my ribs several times. It was only when the copper started unfastening his pistol holster, that my then girlfriend, who was Irish and always (even when sober ! ) madder than a wet hen, clouted him one behind the ear with her shoulder bag. Luckily this bag contained 4 bottles of Guinness, so it stopped him in his tracks. Only the prompt arrival of two of his buddies prevented him from being massacred by Deirdre, who was mightily pissed off, not so much for me having the living s--t kicked out of me, but more because she had broken two bottles of the Black Stuff and completely f-----d her Prada handbag !!!!! Steve.

O, Man - that's nuffin' , when I get a moment I'll tell you about the grief I had a few years ago with Immigration Officials at San Francisco Airport ! And all because I got caught with a rather splendid Camberwell Carrot in me strides when Plod drug busted a party in Chelsea I was at way back in the 60's ! I wouldn't have minded so much were it not for the fact that half of West End Central's Drug Squad were at the party spliffed up to their eyebrows and so far out they were positively cosmic ! I know I was !! Ciao, Steve.

Adrian, forgot to say that I have been back to France many time since I got whacked by that f------g French motor cycle cop, and, generally speaking, apart from being water cannoned when sitting outside a bar in Lyon a couple of years ago ( I was innocent, Guv, I swear ! ), I have not had too many problems. However, when I go next month I shall be clutching in my hot and sweaty little paw a letter from Senator Hillary Clinton introducing me to the Colonel Arvis. K. Pluiter, the Military Attache at the American Embassy in Paris. So, in a way, I shall be attached to the Corp Diplomatique, and therefore have (maybe ! ) some immunity. All I can say, is that I run across that f-------g French motor cycle cop again, there'll definitily be a score to settle and then I'll certainly be putting my diplomatic immunity to the test.......not that having dual US-British nationality is likely to be of much help to me when in a country so anti Brit/Yank as France ! Au revoir, Steve.

Those of you who asked me to keep you up to speed on the developments with the problems I had with my local OPC ( the least of which was that they tried to throw me out of their premises and threatened to call the Police if I didn't leave ! ) will perhaps be pleased to learn of the following :- I have now received a full written apology and an offer to do the work that I required, but free of charge any charge. Moreover, they have said that it can be done at my house and, as a courtesy, have offered to do that. They are coming to do it tomorrow. Who says that it doesn't pay to complain ! Cheers, Steve.

I remember Steve (and you never did finish the tale of Sophie the niece) [ ] perhaps best not to repeat it on the club forum [ ]

Hello Paul, I am flattered that you should remember the saga of my niece, Sophie. That all seems like years ago now ! I often toyed with the idea of finishing that story, a part of which (you may remember) stated that Sophie had started dating a young man who was a Royal Marine Commando unarmed combat expert. Well, she has married him now, and given that even his shadow frightens the bejasus out of me, I dare not finish the saga for fear that he'll come crashing through my sitting room window, parachuting into my garden, paragliding through my office skylight, or abseiling down my bleeding' chimney ! Ciao, Steve.

You might find this info interesting.... This was sent to me by a friend but I can't establish the source of his information. EURO WARNING Tuesday 4th May Be aware of the conequences of committing motoring offences abroad. Leave your radar detector at home... The RAC Foundation is warning drivers that an increasing number of British motorists are being caught speeding in France. Over the Easter weekend, 110 UK motorists caught speeding on the A26 south of Calais incurred on the spot fines while seven Brits detected driving substantially in excess of the limit and two drink drivers were arrested and bailed to appear in court. According to reports, these drivers also had their licences and cars confiscated until their hearings! In the future, offending drivers may meet even more serious deterrents if proposed new legislation is adopted by the British Government. French authorities claim that ten per cent of all motoring offences are committed by foreigners and are desperate to bring down the high levels of road fatalities and injuries - double those in the UK. While serious offenders are prosecuted through the courts, the majority of misdemeanours - like speeding - are dealt with by on the spot fines of up to £200. But now the French want to get even tougher on British drivers who speed and flout the law and have approached the UK Government and other European neighbours to sign up to a convention which would extend the powers of punishment to include penalty points and potential disqualification when motorists return home. The Home Office is thought to be considering the plans sympathetically having already agreed to an Act stipulating that a British driver disqualified in a European country should also lose their licence here. It's not just drivers in France who should exercise caution on the roads this year either. In Spain, from July, that age-old motoring chivalry - warning on coming drivers of the presence of police ahead - could leave UK visitors in hot water too as it becomes an offence to do so then. It will also become compulsory to have a reflective vest in the car for use in emergencies. Radar Detectors The ban on speed detection devices, widespread throughout mainland Europe, also extends to Spain from the summer when the installation and use of a radar detector becomes an offence. Drivers with speed detection devices fitted to their cars can face a jail sentence, a driving ban, having their vehicle confiscated or paying a huge fine if they take them to many parts of Europe. While the radar and laser detectors, which warn motorists of speed enforcement equipment in the vicinity, have been legal to own and use in the UK since 1999, many other European countries ban them and impose stringent sentences for having them fitted in the vehicle - even when they are not operational. Punishment for carrying or using such a device can vary from possible imprisonment in Luxembourg and the Republic of Ireland, to the loss of licence and car and a fine of up to £1000 in France. * Definitive information on the legality/illegality of using the devices in individual European and Scandinavian countries is difficult to establish but France, Belgium, Greece, Austria, Turkey, Switzerland, Luxembourg, Ireland, and Norway all operate bans and will shortly be joined by Spain. * The harshest potential punishment is levied in Luxembourg where a custodial sentence of between eight days and three years is possible. The Republic of Ireland also deals harshly with offenders and a six month prison sentence is possible. * France, the country most likely to be visited by Brits, can deprive you of your car, licence and up to 1500 Euros if you are caught with a speed detection device. * Speed detection devices were illegal in the UK until 1999 when a decision by the High Court reversed the ruling, although the Government is proposing to make secondary legislation to ban their installation and use once again - creating an offence which would attract a maximum fine of £1000 and six penalty points. * Users tend to be high mileage drivers - typically business drivers who travel in excess of 22,000 miles a year, have high annual incomes, who live in rural or semi-rural areas and drive high performance vehicles. * 60 per cent of those who use speed detection devices say that they have become safer drivers since purchasing detectors and three quarters indicate that they are more aware of speed limits in the areas in which they are driving.

Steve That's the funniest story I have heard for ages! I don't wish to belittle the pain and anger you went through at the time, but you can put a story together!! Wonder what happened to Deidre? Cheers,

You may well ask, Peter, about what happened to Deidre, a girl I could rely upon to get me into as much trouble as she got me out off. Like all sensible girls she finally decided to blow me out and, being a good Catholic lass she finally settled down with a stalwart Paddy in County Cork. I often stay with them when I go sea trout fishing in Ballyspittle ( the fact that they own a pub has rather more to do with the reason why I go ! ). I barely got out of that relationship with my liver intact- what a family ! Her Dad was a dentist with practices in Limerick, Cork and Dublin. There wasn't a one of 'em ( parents and 7 grown up offspring ) who could start the day without a few pints of the Old Black Stuff. I could manage that, it was the whisky chasers that I couldn't hack !!!! Cheers, Steve.

Well - I have got my new toy. Rushed accross to factory last thursday, stopped in lux for the night on friday and then on home saturday. Am well chuffed with it albeit frightened of it too!!! I am seriously considering one of the driving courses where you bring along your own car - A quick blast with the salesman is waaaaaaaay different to living with one. Was very careful on way back to avoid all the horrors outlined above, although did get caught in a hale storm which worried me slightly as the conker sized balls of ice sounded like they were re-shaping the car... thanks for all the advice... cheers Alex