IMS save ! - ONE GREAT STORY !!

OK I am starting this because I am so fricken happy !! the story goes a 97' Boxster in for service at the dealer, clutch. The dealer pulls the tranny and all, then notices a leak on the IMS seal so the proceed to pull the outter section off - WHAM.... the IMS is toast, the bearing is visably deformed and there is metal shavings everywhere - they stop and offer the owner 2 options: 1: $20K for a replacement motor (she told us thats what the quote was for) 2: they will buy her car for $2500 as is Well, she did some research and somehow ran across LNE's website, got interested and found my indy (an Authorized Dealer/installer) and called up. The car was flat bed trucked over with out a tranny and all the stuff open (blocks of wood holding the motor up) My indy pulls open the IMS and is scared what he sees... the retaining ring is coated in metal flakes, and the bearing is nearly in 2 pieces (mind you this was drive into the dealer for a normal clutch job and service!!!) so the bearing is out and everyone is amazed how close this motor came to seeing an end AND how happy we are to offer this lady an alternative to the dealers 2 options!!! I will be getting some docs/pics and other data together on this car and show you (sorry no camera today) what was found - It is the best success story I have seen on an IMS and proof to me that the warning signs dont exsist... its clearly just luck that the dealer thought to replace the seal - and that she caught this at such a late stage of degrade!! YIPPY !!! one for the little people, I will get some pics up just as soon as I can and again some better stats on the car (miles ect) What a great day !!

AWESOME!! This is the car that Jason from Chris' shop was emailing me about! Glad to see that he was able save it and make that dealership look like a bunch of retards! This story reminds me of a Boxster story I was told by a client earlier who had an IMS bearing failure recently, but the service manager told him that he could not have had an IMS bearing failure, because his engine didn't have an IMS!! Its a '99 Boxtser, of course it has an IMS! It looks like Jason's trip here to my "M96 101" Engine Assembly class is paying dividends for those in the Seattle area! Jason impressed me a lot, he is continuing to! Every day that we keep money in the pockets of the car owner is a very, very good day!

Ok, so who thinks they should wait to do an IMS upgrade?

Me, i mean they could have gottten $2500 for their car! who could pass that up? lol

OK so who is the dealer?

thats the car... there is still clean up efforts to remove shavings, and the road to recovery is still a challenge. Jason is really sharp... I feel lucky to have him so close to my home even though I dont have an M96 motor anymore, there is still great things to learn and to teach people about how to save themselves. I agree - what a great day to have seen this has inspired me - I am hoping to get the bearing to my work and get some good pics under magnification. You are the one who started this

My god ! this is an amazing story ! I can't wait to hear the mileage and other details on the car, but what a save. I am glad I got my extended warranty ! this was keeping up at night before that... It really sucks that such a small piece of nothing is causing so much trouble !

I had a customer with aan '02 996 drive to my shop from Louisiana for an IMSR back in February.. When we extracted the bearing it was starting to fall apart just like the one in this story.. He told me heard a new noise for the first time while climbing up my 1/4 mile long driveway... That noise was the IMS bearing! You guys are lucky to have Jason in the region.. I have been looking for one exceptional individual from each region to help get to the next level, Jason is definitely the one for the Seattle area!

So $20,000 for an engine for a 97 Boxster. You can buy a 97 for $10,000 or so all day long. For that matter you can get a 996 for less than $20,000.

yea, crazy!! I "pre-guessed" the number to be $13-15k installed and when I heard $20 I couldnt believe my ears. The car is worth $8-12k like you said, so I dont understand why they offered to buy it for $2500 either???? - there is a wrecked Boxster around here (someone took a bat to it and beat every panel pretty bad) so maybe there is an option.... swap the motor into it (seems that car was listed at $5-6k IIRC) just plain crazy... I hope to get the parts this weekend and have some pics come Monday. It truely is a great feeling to see a "save"

Dealer service departments ... bleh!

I would buy a Boxster roller($5-6K) and drop a used 3.4L with the bearing upgrade ($6-7K) + $3k installation all day.

trust me I almost bought that Boxster... one day they dropped the price to $3999 and I called but it was a typo....still I was just going to drive it as is at the track here is one http://seattle.craigslist.org/see/ctd/1792595968.html runs and drives from what I understand

^ nice. Think of all the parts available in that car.. Seriously! If you can pick up a used 3.4L engine at a decent price and install the LN bearing. Do all the maintenance on the engine before installing, you can get a serious car for about $15K. Need suspension of course..

I know of a Boxster with a Cayman motor in it... that thing is wicked sounding. The guy did most of the work himself, but had to get the shop to work out a few electrical "bugs" story is he picked up a blown motor car and a wrecked Cayman....made a nice car out of the 2

Wow what a story! I had a close call with my 944 a few years ago. There is a plastic piece that holds up one of the cam chains. When I removed it, it crumbled in my hand. If that would have gone it would have required an entire top-end rebuild. I was so thankful I decided to repair it when I did!

How many miles on the Boxster?

I will gather the details asap and post them - its an early car so the miles could be anywhere... I checked the paperwork and it wasnt on there and with the car up in the air, I couldnt see the odometer - I have the day off so maybe I will get some info today (sure my wife wont mind )

Cost to finish the project ?

Some of the most expensive replacement engines from the factory are the 2.5s.. They are the oldest and the most odd parts wise..

OH - so I guess the dealer cannot retrofit a newer (cheaper, better) motor in per the big rule book. Strange, but very normal for any car dealer.

Nice to hear a happy ending for a change. Why do the dealers continue to have their heads in the sand regarding IMS failure and the ability to remedy a solution?

nice.... pics of the bearing? Glad we have options.... thanks for the sharing Ed! Its kinda hard to listen for grinding bearings over these PSE.

pics and a vid - the car is still in the air so no odometer yet. I will find out all that "stuff" on the rag is metal shavings and the filter opened up, you can see metal flakes... and the retainer ring coated in metal flakes. I suppose one could say that if the oil was changed and the filter opened up, you would see that stuff - not sure how typical this would be or the length of time between what is seen in the filter and a catistophic ending... minutes, days, weeks?? not sure please keep in mind this car was driven into the shop and had no reason to suspect this was about to fail. During a rutine clutch replacement the dealer stumbled into this while trying to fix a small oil leak on the IMS seal.

Ed, Amazing story with a happy ending! The bearing sounds really aweful in the clip. The wood support of the engine is a very nice trick!

the wood was to get the car from the dealer to my indy shop without a transmission... worked OK yea, I wish we had a data point on that filter, its tough to know everything but one thing is for sure....this is a saved motor the end cost??? not sure yet, I will try and find out. Clean up efforts include oil pan removal and really looking where metal might have gone. Nothing worse than saving it only to have some residual flakes cause a problem. We have agreed that there will be an oil change after 10/20 miles and another at ?500? so you are talking several hundred $ right there... it wont be the cheapest IMSR to date due to the additional cleanup, but it sure isnt going to be $20k either! Keep ya posted....

I am planning on a new cluth and RMS in the next few weeks, and would like to do the IMS since the car is apart. Anyone have an opinon on Phil's auto in Emmaus PA? They are listed on LNE website as the closest dealer who installs the part. I found one referal from a post in 2005 but thats all the info I've found online.

Thanks for the pics/vid Ed.... I cant believe this little bearing took 10 years to rears its ugly head.

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Once the oil pan is removed, is there a proceed to help remove other metal flakes found inside the motor? I was pondering how this could be done. You wouldn't want to use any solvents. Hell, you could probably put some mobil 1 0w-40 in some type of pressurized container and spray it up into the motor to free up addtional metal. Am I out in left field?

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As a dealership, they have limited options. Indy's have always been able to offer older cars more options than a factory dealership -- regardless of marque. Many owners have found that aftermarket options are not problem-free. While it's great she had other options, derision doesn't require a high IQ.

true James, the dealer represents the MFG and therefore can only install original parts, per MFG approved methods correct for the model and year.... nothing more. (with the exception of maybe wheels/tires and radios (which they outsource anyhow) That is the same for ALL dealers I believe.

Nice catch... Should be a very happy owner... Thank for the pics/vid...

You guys are so awsome...incredible amount of knowledge to be learned with these forums. Thank you.

It looks like a dual row bearing. Was the cage gone on the other side also? That might be what saved it. I'm sure the other bearings wern't real happy with all of that swarf in there.

what's the shop's name? I'm in Seattle and am always on the lookout for an indy that knows their stuff - selling my E46 M3 most likely to get a 996.. so a prepurchase inspection is in my future...

the shop is Chris's German Auto in Bellevue (no affiliation, just a happy, loyal and frequent visitor)

I took about 30 very detailed photos of this bearing... I am sending them to Jake via my Indy Shop - I hope to have additional data points on "good bearings" and hope to never see one this close again. Remember this drove in and while doing a clutch the tech noticed an oil drip and decided to change the IMS seal... saw the bearing in poor shape missing the seal ring and told the owner to shell out $$$$$$ - the car was towed and repaired and is now driving (it will be closely monitored for signs of debris due to the missing parts for the remainder of its life as long as the owner keeps comeing back for service... and my guess is she is quite happy... and will) here is a photo of the bearing ***** lateral slop of slightly over 1mm

dam... there was some destruction happening there! thats ugly!

Nice photos! I'm impressed that you can get that much enlargement and so much in focus at the same time.

James, we need to get yours done... i know you are busy flying (I hope) but when I get it, I will take some good shots and give you a full set... I think I know what causes the little notchy feeling - we need as much data as we can get. Ed

Why am I thinking the dealer wasn't going to replace the engine and just replace the bearing?

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come on, seriously....

I would image that very frequent oil changes and a magnetic drain plug are requirements for this car going forward. At least they would be for me......

yes, it had the oil changed (after a complete opening up, pan removal and flush) after 20 miles, again after 500 and will be on a strick "no metal" diet with mag drain plug to be sure