GT2 vs Nissan GT-R

Found this interesting article and was wondering if anyone had seen some more recent independent comparisons? 2009 Nissan GTR vs 2009 Porsche 911 GT2 - Nurburgring Nordschleife Racetrack- Automobile Magazine

This appears to be a reprint of Chris Harris's original article in Driver's Republic: Driver's Republic - The Truth 030 The interactive features in the DR article are a very cool showcase of the potential of webzines.

Way better article than the one I found. Still interested to see when this will be settled once and for all.

You mean when the GT-R lightweight version with more horsepower comes out for $100k? The Turbo was the original GT-R benchmark, not the GT-2. I hope it is never settled. "Settled" is the opposite of "forcing Porsche's hand".:hilarious:

Nissan GT-R SpecV Something wicked this way... isn't coming. Road & Track Magazine - Nissan GT-R SpecV (1/2009)

Its looking better now, that's odd. In today's paper, Nissan reported 20,000 jobs are being cut and forecast a US$2.8 billion loss

no matter how fast it is, it's still not very attractive. And for $175K, I want gorgeous.

For 175K only a Porsche will do, and that's that!!

That's what happens when you sell a $140K car for $70K

I got to follow a GT-R on a 'spirited' drive this weekend. With the accelerator to the floor in the straights the GT-R would pull away from my Cayman S like I was anchored to the road! In the turns it was more of a contest but still that car was a beast! We did this for about 50 miles. I was thoroughly impressed by the GT-R's performance but not by it's size and appearance. I'll keep my Cayman but if a GT3 RS has the right numbers $$ maybe . . .

V-Spec is a joke. GT2 is likely faster than GT-R, but 2X the price. GT-R is a monster. No one knows the true story of the various 'Ring times. Who cares? Here's me in mine at THill:

I had no problem staying with a GT-R several weeks ago - a 2mile run -- He couldn't shake me and the pedal wasn't even all the way down... I wonder how I would have done in front?

Impressive video. I saw 1.3 G in de turns several times. At one time even 1.3 G during braking ! Stock GT-R ? I saw the GT-R in person few weeks ago. Looks much much nicer in person than on pic. Impressive car !

Both cars are fantastic in their own right, simple as that. They just appeal to different customers. (I know which one I would choose... ) I think the article by Chris Harris IS actually one of the more independent comparisons. GT2 is faster in many aspects, but the GT-R exited some of the corners at a higher speed than the GT2. Why would you even want to compare 2 cars that are this different? Because claming the fastest lap time on the ring matters for someone It's not always just the time that counts - it's also how you get around. Do you feel your are getting killed? Or are you killing?

The idea that a stock, or near stock Cayman S can stay with a Nissan GT-R anywhere, on any road or track, is ridiculous. But we should also ask the question: Can a normally aspirated Cayman S stay with a TPC Cayman? Absolutely not! With the TPC turbo and some other upgrades, I have found the Cayman S completely equal on several occasions versus two different GT-R's with good drivers, on two different tracks. I have not yet seen a GT-R be able to pass a TPC Cayman, and I haven't seen a TPC Cayman been able to pass a GT-R. This is with open passing, but normal SAFE conduct DE driving rules. Neither car seems to have the ability to pull away from the other in any way. Remember that the GT-R is a FORCED INDUCTION car. Most people forget this when they are debating these cars. Is the GT-R faster and better handling than a TPC Cayman S ,.. I think not. Is the GT-R as fast or quick or better cornering than a similarly forced induction Audi R8? I think not. Could a stock CaymanS beat a normally aspirated GT-R,.. maybe,.. maybe. And the CaymanS is MUCH more fun to drive! * I just got a Traqmate, and hopefully soon Ill be able to do some better quantifiable comparisons for these fun debates.

Having just driven a GT-R vs. my CS back to back, they're not even in the same league - the GT-R would slaughter the CS. You don't even need to have very good skills to haul *** in the GT-R, it's so easy to drive. But I agree w/ Bodhii that the CS is still more fun!

I was talking stock for stock. Forgot you and Peter had the TPC set-up. Did you ever get to Reno Fernley with your Turbo Croc? I have some Traqmate data from there if that helps your comparo (it was my first day on track with GT-R, so I am sure I didn't break any records). -Chris

GT-R is an automaton which produces the numbers, but gad what a weird looking car inside and out. And where is the passion? Somewhere in the ECU memory, I suspect.

When you take away launch control, which is what they are doing, it doesn't even produce the numbers with respect to acceleration. I'm sure Nissan will report some fast times with the non LC car when it comes out, but I won't trust the numbers until somebody pulls one off the show room floor and road tests it. At this point, I really have a hard time trusting any figures reported by Nissan.

IMO Nissan put a big size 14 in it's mouth with it's very suspect Nurburgring 'test' - everything about it didn't make sense..... tires ....the times......when & where. Nothing.

Like Carl Sagan said, extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof. If no one else can replicate Nissan's results under the conditions they claimed, you gotta figure they are leaving something out.

Yeah I was talking slalom, not lane change or not track cornering, granted slalom is more likely to be seen in an autocross course, but the Cayman S in stock form is about 1.5 mph faster through a slalom than the GTR, which as a mid engine car that weighs less I would expect it to be, but I think the results of the GTR in the slalom are damn impressive for a car of its size, in fact it may be the fastest slalom car of its size I don't know but I can't think of anything as heavy as it is with as fast of a slalom time as it has. My point was simply that even in stock form there are some performance tests where the Cayman S can beat the GTR, just as there are performance tests where the GTR clearly beats the Cayman S .

The motortrend tests were an attempt to de-compose the simple slalom test into its component parts. GT-R dominated almost every component. Not sure what it means. I would tend to agree that a Cayman would prob be a better Auto-X car-- but that is a pretty specialized situation. I think a road course (as the name implies) comes closer to real-world driving maneuvers you might encounter on the local twisties. I stress again that I really like the Cayman but, at least in my hands, I am much faster in the GT-R.

I got out of my CS and into the GT-R and knocked at least 10 seconds off my lap times at Fernley. My first time on the track in the GT-R. If you spend any time on tracks that should strike you as astounding. The added power of the car instantly throws off all your braking points. I am hitting 140 where I hit 120 before and I am having to adjust. Adjust. Adjust. Adjust. You can't just add power and run quicker times, yet I did. I am an intermediate level guy who leaves a little track left over on all sides for comfort. Earlier in my brother's driving "career" it took him at least a few track days to be faster in his 997TT (when stock) than he was in his 2.7 Cayman. (later my yellow menace on loan). I am sure a TPC cayman would be fun. I am also absolutely certain that it would have it's own special "features". All tuner cars do. For $1000 you can pump a GT-R up to what? 550HP on 100 octane? Turbocharging a Cayman is a fairly significant upgrade. Financially, etc.

In my current R&T(the list in the back) the GTR beats the Cayman S in the slalom and both braking tests. In fact it beats it in all performance measurements.

You are correct -- to get 550 BHP with our cars -- you would have to pay $ 13,000 for a TPC upgrade @ 93 octane -- having just driven a GT- R yesterday; I do not know why this car is even being compared to a Porsche --- People (anybody who has not already purchased one) should really get off of the numbers and just test drive this car --- its' not even close; -- night and day --- (American Power; Japanese style) -- just my opinion...

Good luck finding a GT-R ANYWHERE close to MSRP in the near future - kinda negates the "bargain" aspect of that vehicle, eh? Average of $7,000 over MSRP

Not sure about that anymore. On NAGTROC.ORG there have been references to a few sold at the "old" MSRP. I am sure some dealers are still holding out for premiums, but they will be gone fast in this market.

My local dealer has 4 on the lot at the new msrp.

I agree on all counts, absolutely. Subjectively, I can't get over the doodads and weird interior styling -

Agreed. I think it's very interesting that the Cayman S has even been mentioned in the same sentence. This being a Cayman sight I suppose it's not surprising. But I think it still shows something about the Cayman. The fact that on paper they aren't in the same class but in the real world they're competing for the same market and the Cayman doesn't look like it's gonna lose as much of it's market share as you'd expect.

I know we have a good number of owners on this site who gave up horsepower from their previous cars for the Cayman's balance. I don't see any reason for this to change just because a new car in the same price bracket has emerged. Saw my first GT-R in the flesh over the weekend, have a lot of respect for the car's capabilities and it really looks "mean" in person (better than I expected). But it was lacking the "it" factor that made me pull the trigger on the Cayman. Maybe I prefer the sexy curves of the Porsche or maybe its something else, but either way my experience has me in agreement that Porsche won't lose much market share.

I suspect the longer the GTR is around, the more clear the reason for the price difference will become. Either that, or you will see the GTR become more expensive for such things as an upgraded dual-clutch gear box to handle the torque. You get what you pay for.

Actually, the manuf gets what your pay, and in that price is a hefty gross profit margin for Porsche (much much much) fatter than is in the GT-R. When we buy Porsche, part of what we pay for is the brand/image and not the design and manufacturing costs. It is only by offering a much better VALUE that competitors can take some sales from Porsche. Nothing wrong with paying up for Porsche if it makes you feel good. Let's face it, we're not taking about $15K grocery getters in this class of car--- all cars over say $20K have a big component of non-utilitarian value content. Fact it, the GT-R simply MUST be better value for money or it wouldn't exist. And Porsche would be dumb to sell cars at breakeven. Buy what you want, but don't lose your objectivity. Going all the way back to the OP, I think the GT-R will be faster than GT2 in hands of most drivers. I would bet money that if I took 100 Cayman Club members with track experience (not racers, just DE guyss) but no 911 or GT-R experience and gave them 10 laps in each, 75%+ would be faster in GT-R. Car just inspires confidence and feels solid all the time.

GT-R is easy to drive - it does all the work for you. The fun work. The driving skill. GT-R: "The ultimate track appliance" "Relentless pursuit of sterility"

This is a common criticism, but it strikes me as silly. I assure you it is fun to drive and you can kill yourself in it if you are not careful. If we were purists, we'd all be driving Spec Miatas with the ABS fuse pulled and a non-synchro tranny.

At the end of the day, it is about *what is right for you* and what you prefer. All about the "@ss for every saddle" thing Personally, I prefer much more driver involvement and a more organized & 'teutonic' interior. Perhaps that is why I own & track a 514HP, 2650 lb 1982 Porsche 930 90% track car. I think the fact remains that the technology and sheer content of a GT-R is incredible given the price -

Yep, and that is where "driving satisfaction" happens. Like I said, a heck of a value, but...... The GT-R is a bit too much Mr. Roboto: Domo arigato, mr. roboto, Mata ah-oo hima de Domo arigato, mr. roboto, Himitsu wo shiri tai You're wondering who i am-machine or mannequin With parts made in japan, i am the modren man The time has come at last To throw away this mask Now everyone can see My true identity... I'm kilroy! kilroy! kilroy! kilroy!

Bit much time on the old hands, huh? At least you cleared up what the hell they were singing all that time!