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THIS DISCUSSION / SOURCE-DERIVED OVERVIEW
Discussion summary
YOUR RESEARCHIMS. Open seal bearing will flood the IMS
Leading reported evidence
Replace oem imsb
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Read evidence and context
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Replaced my oem imsb with the LN Retro then replaced it again last year with another LN retro.
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Suggestion
During development it was determined that the pressure force fed oil that provides bearing support, cooling and lubrication of the IMS Solution plain bearing would slowly fill the IMS tube.
Leading evidence: 'Replace oem imsb' (no explicit attributable resolution; this is a reported action or suggestion). Across 1 matching discussions, The most frequently discussed action is 'Fill ims tube' (1 discussions). For that action, 0 discussions report a resolution and 0 report an unsuccessful attempt. No action has an explicit, attributable resolution report under the current rules. These are forum reports and suggestions, not a confirmed diagnosis.
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Performed · outcome unconfirmed
Charlie�s not joking when he says the Solution has been thoroughly developed and tested for quite some time.
Use ims solution had modified ims shafts, i have one
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The first engines that used the IMS Solution had modified IMS shafts, I have one on my desk.
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Performed · outcome unconfirmed
They used a single-sku cylinder head to save money.
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Fill ims tube
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Suggestion
During development it was determined that the pressure force fed oil that provides bearing support, cooling and lubrication of the IMS Solution plain bearing would slowly fill the IMS tube.
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Rennlist: 1 discussions
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Hi ,
after all the thousand of pages read I still don�t understand
if you retrofit to ims solution the oil is flooding the whole IMS and where can this go after all ?
I understand why porsche put in a sealed version because they don�t want to have the IMS full of oil.
this old oil will never go out the shaft anymore right ?
please help me to understand.
The LN IMS Solution kit comes with a cap to prevent oil from filling the shaft. The plain bearing rides on a surface layer of oil as it has for years in the Mezger engine's oil-fed intermediate shaft bearings as well as the aircooled Porsche engines. All excess oil is returned to the sump.
It was a compromise. Porsche went with a cheap ball bearing to save money. This compromise was NOT done in the 996 GT2, GT3, or Turbo models of the 996; whereas, those models had oil-fed plain bearings to support BOTH ends of the intermediate shaft.
Lots of speculation, I don't think we will ever know why but then again realistically there were lots of odd design choices in the M96, probably due to financial pressure bearing [sic] down on the design engineers
Can we go back to the question please.
when you have open bearings the IMS will get full of oil and this will never go out again and might change to some really nasty old oil.
I get it why they put in a sealed bearing.
but when changing this to open bearings I am not sure if this is so great having the shaft full of oil.
I am on my 3rd IMSB in 21 years of ownership. Replaced my oem imsb with the LN Retro then replaced it again last year with another LN retro. The first LN Retro came out looking brand new. See picture below. The key to these engines is running fresh motor oil thru consistent oil changes. You can then test your oil to see what's in it which will tell you what's deteriorating. Bores, pistons, bearings, etc.
They used a single-sku cylinder head to save money. One head is cheaper than a specific left and right head. The cylinder head has only one oil passage to feed oil-fed bearings on one side. When you flip the head over, you can�t feed the bearing. So a roller bearing has to be used on that side.
Honestly, you're better off spending your time worrying about other things. The IMS Solution was developed by people that know more about these engines than you could learn in a lifetime. They've considered anything that you can come up with and settled on the design that they did. It's proven. My recommendation - buy the IMS Solution and enjoy your car.
Cheers
Charlie
Or email/call the vendor with your questions. They�ll totally geek out on you when you ask intelligent questions. Charlie�s not joking when he says the Solution has been thoroughly developed and tested for quite some time.
The reason the IMS Solution includes a plug to block off the inside of the IMS tube is simple. During development it was determined that the pressure force fed oil that provides bearing support, cooling and lubrication of the IMS Solution plain bearing would slowly fill the IMS tube. This oil would take an extended amount of time to drain from the IMS tube back into the oil sump. This was observed to be as much as 3 days, depending on ambient temperature, oil temperature and oil viscosity.
During this time the engine oil level would indicate a false low condition, despite the engine having the proper amount of oil filled. This oil was just inside the shaft, it was not in the oil sump for sampling.
Plugging the shaft eliminated this phenomenon and the associated variables.
It took years for Mr. Raby to invent and perfect this system, and based on what I have seen, he nailed every variable that could exist. Having studied the notes, the thousands of testing photos and etc, I remain astonished.
The idea of the open bearing is to let oil into (and out of) the bearing (and shaft). Anyone who�s opened the sealed bearing knows the the seals fail due to heat and let oil infiltrate the bearing which washes out the �permanent� grease that�s supposed to last for the life of the bearing�even with the sealed bearing the shaft fills with oil too�
I believe the recommendation is to only remove the sump side bearing seal, then I would guess not much will pass through to the inside of the IMS shaft.
That was also done. The first engines that used the IMS Solution had modified IMS shafts, I have one on my desk. This was the days before the IMS Solution was never planned to be offered outside of Performer series FSI engines.
Ha! Makes total sense.
So does the application. In my smart-azz response, I was imaging trying to poke a couple of holes in the shaft while it was still in the car: DeWalt cordless drill up through the sump style. I bit less elegant than your paperweight, I imagine. ;-)
This is a source reference. Confirm exact model applicability in the original material.
