Classic Line UK Only Track Cover - Page 5 - 911/Carrera GT - PistonHeads UK

I have just been renewing CL insurance and happened to mention I was about to book some Spa track days and CL replied saying only UK days covered. I reverted asking to confirm Spa was now not covered, they replied: "Unfortunately not at this time, we are waiting for the underwriters to confirm if going forward we will be able to cover non-UK tracks, however we have been given no timescales." I am not sure whether this is from renewal and not affecting running policies but is this a re-run of Mannings underwriters withdrawing policies?

CL did cover all major European tracks but there was an additional premium, they've never been included in the allocated UK days. Is this a new 'no EU' track at all change?

Yes because you can't pay the c£250 a day for non-UK track cover. I have been with CL for 8 years so understand their product rules.

Balls! I renewed at the end of last year with a view to a couple of Spa and Zandvoort days this year!

s_mcneil said: Balls! I renewed at the end of last year with a view to a couple of Spa and Zandvoort days this year! I suspect (but did not ask) that the cover limit will apply to new policies like mine running from Feb 1 2025 and not to existing policies as happened with Mannings a few years ago when they stopped track cover - you should check.

Will get my euro trips done early then! Lol.

I wonder if this applies to all EU days, or just non-UK ATDO days...?

ATDO... Well, where to start? James

Spoke to classic line today as needed to change registration on my documents. Raised this subject and told all European cover has been withdrawn regardless of when the policy was taken out. I chose CL in December for this cover so very disappointed, they are looking for alternative arrangements and hopefully will have update end of February.

That's pretty awful unless they have written to all policyholders

gtsralph said: That's pretty awful unless they have written to all policyholders On the Porsche Club forum, a member has just posted: "Any EU track events are charged at £224.00 per day and are subject to individual referral to the underwriters. The charge still applies if the EU event is PCGB however this cover has been withdrawn by the underwriters as of this year so this will only apply up to the renewal date of your policy in March. After the March renewal date we will not be able to arrange any cover for EU track events" Best to get written confirmation of cover!

gtsralph said: On the Porsche Club forum, a member has just posted: "Any EU track events are charged at £224.00 per day and are subject to individual referral to the underwriters. The charge still applies if the EU event is PCGB however this cover has been withdrawn by the underwriters as of this year so this will only apply up to the renewal date of your policy in March. After the March renewal date we will not be able to arrange any cover for EU track events" Best to get written confirmation of cover! Interesting, I was hoping this would be the case as personally my present policy would run to mid December. But I was told it applies to my policy even though it was taken out last year. When challenged about why I wasn’t informed in writing of the change the answer was all track cover is supplied at the discretion of the underwriter and you need to inform us at least 48hrs to any event. Not a happy customer at the moment

FL Racing said: Spoke to classic line today as needed to change registration on my documents. Raised this subject and told all European cover has been withdrawn regardless of when the policy was taken out. I chose CL in December for this cover so very disappointed, they are looking for alternative arrangements and hopefully will have update end of February. That's what Manning said and I'm not aware that it has ever happened ?

ChrisW. said: That's what Manning said and I'm not aware that it has ever happened ? Yep they did and never got a solution, I expect this will go same way

Mannings have event by event standalone track cover but at the usual very high cost and they don’t always agree to offer cover

And PCCB track days ... with consumables ... are already expensive.

Just found out about this as I am CL covered. Its certainly narrowing down the pool of underwriters able to offer track cover abroad. I wonder with the increasing cost of these cars its getting to the point where they are uninsurable & you take your chances or dont bother tracking at all. I`m halfway through my policy so have a bit of time to see what shakes out but I wont hold my breath for another underwriter to step in and then I will have to make some hard decisions. The risk profile has clearly got to high that it outweighs any profit to be made.

I believe earlier in the thread it says that the removal of overseas trackday insurance has already been actioned, including on existing policies. It maybe worth checking ?? Part of the reason must be the substantially increased repair costs ... just compare the cost of metal panels by comparison to the hemp / carbon panel cost. And metal panels can be beaten and filled ... Edited by ChrisW. on Monday 13th January 11:11

ChrisW. said: Part of the reason must be the substantially increased repair costs ... just compare the cost of metal panels by comparison to the hemp / carbon panel cost. And metal panels can be beaten and filled ... You would hope then that removal would be discretional rather than blanket, based on actual make and model.

I’ve just spoken to them now to arrange my cover note for RS Day at Oulton Park. Underwriter has ceased on issuing cover for European tracks. So even if you are in an existing policy, they will not cover.

If your existing policy allows track day cover subject to advance notice and subject to any additional premium as is commonplace ( and equally assuming that said policy tells you in advance what tracks / counties will never be permitted ) then once the premium is paid you have entered into a contract with the Insurer and no terms can be changed unless both parties agree to this. As such Insurers cannot apply a blanket refusal on an existing policy but only on policies yet to incept. For them to do so would be in breach of TCF regulations ( treating customers fairly ). Obviously they can apply a high additional premium ( unless each policy states what the additional premium will always be in which case again they cannot just change the terms like that ) but they cannot refuse cover. At the very least I would query this or email their complaints dept.

EU trackdays was an additional paid for bolt on, per event. They are no longer offer in the option to pay to bolt these on, and it was at their discretion anyway. The main policy including UK trackdays remains in intact. I’m not sure there is any breach here.

TDT said: EU trackdays was an additional paid for bolt on, per event. They are no longer offer in the option to pay to bolt these on, and it was at their discretion anyway. The main policy including UK trackdays remains in intact. I’m not sure there is any breach here. The fact that they were previously included as an option is as my prior post said the key part. They cannot simply delete said option because they have decided to amend their underwriting strategy. I'm sure one of the reasons you renewed with them was the fact that the option was there -subject as I said earlier to some obvious exclusions - and so they are breaking the contract you made. This is a breach of TCF in my opinion. At the very least asking their complaints dept to review this is just one email.

alscar said: TDT said: EU trackdays was an additional paid for bolt on, per event. They are no longer offer in the option to pay to bolt these on, and it was at their discretion anyway. The main policy including UK trackdays remains in intact. I’m not sure there is any breach here. The fact that they were previously included as an option is as my prior post said the key part. They cannot simply delete said option because they have decided to amend their underwriting strategy. I'm sure one of the reasons you renewed with them was the fact that the option was there -subject as I said earlier to some obvious exclusions - and so they are breaking the contract you made. This is a breach of TCF in my opinion. At the very least asking their complaints dept to review this is just one email. CL are a broker.. if the underwriters pull the offering what are they supposed to do if no other will take up the business? I renewed with them to have UK trackdays and the option to pay cover for approved EU trackdays. But the EU trackdays cover was not priced into the premium. They speak to the underwriters everytime you call for a trackday cover note. The terms also say that trackdays cover needs to be approved by them. Which by definition means they reserve the right to not approve. Now, if I had paid higher full premium upfront which gave me EU trackdays included… then I’d have a problem. As that is a change in product/service. And you should be entitled to some recompense or replacement. Edited by TDT on Monday 13th January 12:42

TDT said: alscar said: TDT said: EU trackdays was an additional paid for bolt on, per event. They are no longer offer in the option to pay to bolt these on, and it was at their discretion anyway. The main policy including UK trackdays remains in intact. I’m not sure there is any breach here. The fact that they were previously included as an option is as my prior post said the key part. They cannot simply delete said option because they have decided to amend their underwriting strategy. I'm sure one of the reasons you renewed with them was the fact that the option was there -subject as I said earlier to some obvious exclusions - and so they are breaking the contract you made. This is a breach of TCF in my opinion. At the very least asking their complaints dept to review this is just one email. CL are a broker.. if the underwriters pull the offering what are they supposed to do if no other will take up the business? Yes I know - but they are your broker and as such they need to negotiate back with whomever your Insurer is. You could just email their complaints dept directly ? Underwriters cannot pull offerings mid policy term. I renewed with them to have UK trackdays and the option to pay cover for approved EU trackdays. But the EU trackdays cover was not priced into the premium. Yes I know but they were subject to additional underwriting -a blanket no is not allowed as it in effect says the option was never going to be agreed at any price ! They speak to the underwriters everytime you call for a trackday cover note. Indeed but thats my point as above. The terms also say that trackdays cover needs to be approved by them. Which by definition means they reserve the right to not approve. There is a big difference between saying they need to be approved and may not be versus approval at a price to be agreed though. Obviously I don t have their specific terms and conditions in sight. Now, if I had paid higher full premium upfront which gave me EU trackdays included… then I’d have a problem. As that is a change in product/service. And you should be entitled to some recompense or replacement. Edited by TDT on Monday 13th January 12:42 I've annotated above as easier to reply -apologies in advance for lack of formatting. All I am saying is that for the sake of one email you may find you have some wriggle room. Your alternative is to find another Insurer which kind of lets them off the hook including I might add the broker.

My insurance policy says the insurer can cancel the policy where “there is a valid reason for doing so”…it then goes on to state some likely reasons. I have no professional knowledge of this stuff but I imagine that’s a pretty standard clause. Chances of a complaint getting anywhere are very small I would think

Cheib said: My insurance policy says the insurer can cancel the policy where “there is a valid reason for doing so”…it then goes on to state some likely reasons. I have no professional knowledge of this stuff but I imagine that’s a pretty standard clause. Chances of a complaint getting anywhere are very small I would think Cancellation clauses are obviously standard but that's not in question here. Amending policy terms mid contract is definitely not standard and is not within any agreed Insurance contract unless its on very esoteric Insurance coverage such as Trade credit . Personal Lines coverage is pretty simple stuff in the scheme of Insurance and all I'm saying is that amending policy terms mid term ( if that is what indeed is the case ) is against TCF or whatever the new replacement clause is. I'm not saying a complaint would succeed but without even trying seems quick to give up on especially given nothing to lose !

Well this just got weird as I rang them up to query it and ended up fully covered for Spa in May and duly paid my £224. My GT3 is not an RS though.

Hmm, very odd… I will call again then. Would be interesting if it is down to what car you have… classified by potential repair costs due to panels. Edited by TDT on Monday 13th January 16:50

Far Cough said: Well this just got weird as I rang them up to query it and ended up fully covered for Spa in May and duly paid my £224. My GT3 is not an RS though. And this is the issue they are giving different info to different clients. I was told no more EU cover others been told ok till policy end, CL need to sort their stance out!

TDT said: Hmm, very odd… I will call again then. Would be interesting if it is down to what car you have… classified by potential repair costs due to panels. Edited by TDT on Monday 13th January 16:50 991.2 GT3 refused any EU cover, policy runs out December 2025

I was put on hold whilst it was referred to the underwriter with a positive outcome so they must still have cover available from at least one underwriter

Read this thread and called CL to see what Spa in March would cost me - £224 (997.1 GT3)

I had my renewal through from classicline a couple of weeks ago for my RS and it stated on the renewal that gt3rs cars are no longer covered on any track days. I rang and spoke to them to which they confirmed this is the case. They have a meeting in feb to see if they can add the gt3rs back on cover for track days. Very disappointing

Random question but are your cars all in a garage or storage unit or driveway? I phoned them today about insuring a 992.1 GT3 and they said (after putting me on hold to get a quote) they can't unless the car is in a garage. They even said the same about GT4s. I'm based in central London and basically they can't insure me at my address (residential parking).

my policy states my car must be kept inside a “locked building” between 2200-0700 if at home or within half mile of home

egzplicit said: Random question but are your cars all in a garage or storage unit or driveway? I phoned them today about insuring a 992.1 GT3 and they said (after putting me on hold to get a quote) they can't unless the car is in a garage. They even said the same about GT4s. I'm based in central London and basically they can't insure me at my address (residential parking). I would think that most are garaged when not in use or at the very least , kept out the way either in storage or behind gates out of prying eyes. Given the cost of repairing simple panal damage or a PTS scratch I dont blame the insurance companies backing away from a car left on the street.

But in many cities cars have to be left out on the street ... maybe that's a reason not to buy an expensive car but I'm sure that's not what the expensive car manufacturers would wish to read ?? When Landrover had a problem with car theft they invested in a solution and organised their own insurance ... via LR ??

On my street there's a McLaren, a Cayenne Turbo E-Hybrid, an Aston DBX, all parked on the street (one way very quiet one but still). Admiral seems to be happy to insure a 992 GT3 and funny enough at a cheaper price compared to a BMW G82 M4 for some reason..

I think the factor here is that we are talking ClassicLine. It has always been their policy that the car is garaged. Plus other restrictions such as maximum 5k pa mileage. And no commuting. But their policy also doesn’t require or use any no claims bonus. It’s quite a specialised policy compared to the regular insurers.

Again different experiences, I have always had the garage endorsement, always have had track day cover subject to approval. I have had and was recently quoted for 7.5k miles and last year with commuting, happily now retired again. Their staff do not all seem to be trained to the same product knowledge.

A bunch of us had CL cover for tf at the 'ring years ago which got pulled unfortunately.

egzplicit said: Admiral seems to be happy to insure a 992 GT3 and funny enough at a cheaper price compared to a BMW G82 M4 for some reason.. It’s a view on how well the owner of a 992 GT3 will look after their car. I’ve got a classic 911 that is insured for a healthy sum….has locks that can be picked in a few seconds and no tracker but is a lot cheaper to insure than a modern car of the same value.

Cheib said: egzplicit said: Admiral seems to be happy to insure a 992 GT3 and funny enough at a cheaper price compared to a BMW G82 M4 for some reason.. It’s a view on how well the owner of a 992 GT3 will look after their car. I’ve got a classic 911 that is insured for a healthy sum….has locks that can be picked in a few seconds and no tracker but is a lot cheaper to insure than a modern car of the same value. Who are you insuring with if you don’t mind as my classic Porsche has no tracker and similar locks to yours….

Coxey said: Who are you insuring with if you don’t mind as my classic Porsche has no tracker and similar locks to yours…. Chubb. Policy also includes Agreed Value, Diminution, Track Day’s (subject to prior approval) and Roadside recovery.

Speaking of roadside recovery, I got caught out last year. It used to be included with Classicline policies but they removed this benefit the year previously from what I can gather. So if you want roadside you have to specifically mention on renewal, else you’ll be on the phone one day signing up with green flag…

Hmm let me check that later. I think it’s home start that’s been taken off policies not roadside… had a flat battery at home and they wouldn’t send someone out

Cheib said: It’s a view on how well the owner of a 992 GT3 will look after their car. I’ve got a classic 911 that is insured for a healthy sum….has locks that can be picked in a few seconds and no tracker but is a lot cheaper to insure than a modern car of the same value. Indeed - a view also shared and then driven by the actuarial derived computer assisted rating models based on the Insurers experience.

egzplicit said: Admiral seems to be happy to insure a 992 GT3 and funny enough at a cheaper price compared to a BMW G82 M4 for some reason.. It’s a view on how well the owner of a 992 GT3 will look after their car. I’ve got a classic 911 that is insured for a healthy sum….has locks that can be picked in a few seconds and no tracker but is a lot cheaper to insure than a modern car of the same value.

Anyone had any updates on this recently? Or had Euro cover denied/approved?

I got cover for Spa at normal £224 extra premium and then booked the day. Back story, I called up on Feb 7 to see what the latest situation was and after checking with underwriters they offered cover which I happily took. It was explained that ‘my’ underwriters were offering cover but then there was a story about my policy start date (Feb 1st 2025) and how on renewal European cover would not be offered. Just keep calling, you never know what the ‘latest’ is.

jackwood said: Anyone had any updates on this recently? Or had Euro cover denied/approved? Yes CL have 4 underwriters that supply TD cover on policy 1 of which has pulled their cover. If your policy is with one of the other underwriters your ok business as normal. If your underwriter is ????? Red Star no Europe TD cover and restrictions on and additional cost on Uk cover. I’ve ended up being one of the lucky ones and paid the Normal £224 for Spa about a month ago

Just made the call to CL as renewal due in a month....... They only have 2 underwriters to cover trackdays Trackdays in the UK are now chargeable at £165 each. Max of 6 Trackdays in the EU - can only do 2 and remain at £224 Cover afforded is only upto £100k - With the XS this means effectively £85k Not much use to me to pay more and get less. MY GT3 is probably worth £165k. Looks like I am being priced out of the car. Sad times. Footman James have a track cover limit of £100k aswell Anyone found anyone else ?? Edited by Far Cough on Friday 23 May 11:24

Given that the broken value could be quite high ... what is the real value of this insurance ? £30k for a GT3 engine ? A few panels £10k ? Seats £6k ? Brakes £5k ... £85k - £50k = £35k insured for what cost ?

Far Cough said: Just made the call to CL as renewal due in a month....... They only have 2 underwriters to cover trackdays Trackdays in the UK are now chargeable at £165 each. Max of 6 Trackdays in the EU - can only do 2 and remain at £224 Cover afforded is only upto £100k - With the XS this means effectively £85k Not much use to me to pay more and get less. MY GT3 is probably worth £165k. Looks like I am being priced out of the car. Sad times. Footman James have a track cover limit of £100k aswell Anyone found anyone else ?? Edited by Far Cough on Friday 23 May 11:24 If a car has a value of £150k for CL road cover but has the £100k track limit, does the insurance pay only 2/3rds of damage as would be the case with normal underinsured value situations?

Locktons insurance policy will cover up to £150k for UK track days and full value if it’s a PCGB organised day. But their premium is higher than CL, but they give you more too.

terryb said: Locktons insurance policy will cover up to £150k for UK track days and full value if it’s a PCGB organised day. But their premium is higher than CL, but they give you more too. I thought they only covered PCGB track days or has that changed?

gtsralph said: terryb said: Locktons insurance policy will cover up to £150k for UK track days and full value if it s a PCGB organised day. But their premium is higher than CL, but they give you more too. I thought they only covered PCGB track days or has that changed? They told me that they will cover other days, but that they shouldn’t be taken for granted - so could be a risk and still a limited number - 6 or 8 from memory - buy the sum assured figured above are definitely what they told me. No Euro tracks unfortunately.

gtsralph said: terryb said: Locktons insurance policy will cover up to £150k for UK track days and full value if it s a PCGB organised day. But their premium is higher than CL, but they give you more too. I thought they only covered PCGB track days or has that changed? They told me that they will cover other days, but that they shouldn’t be taken for granted - so could be a risk and still a limited number - 6 or 8 from memory - buy the sum assured figured above are definitely what they told me. No Euro tracks unfortunately.

gtsralph said: If a car has a value of £150k for CL road cover but has the £100k track limit, does the insurance pay only 2/3rds of damage as would be the case with normal underinsured value situations? My car has a rough value of £165k. CL will only cover upto £100k on track and also claim an XS of 10% the value of the car. Assuming that the XS will be £10k and not £16.5k ( unless they want their cake and eat it !) then I am over exposed by a huge margin should the worse happen to the tune of £75k Locktons have said they will insure the full value of the car on track again with the 10% value of the car XS however their policy is ridiculously priced at £3,300 for only 5k miles AND each trackday is an extra charge. I did have a semblance of success with Footman James who used CHUBB as an underwriter and the value covered on track was upto £250k ! Yet again though , what they give with one hand , they take away with the other. No European days covered and they wanted two cars on the policy which would have meant getting the wife's car insurance with them and cancelling the existing policy etc etc Personally I think the days of owning an expensive track toy and expecting it to be fully covered on track are starting to dwindle as the main underwriters get nervous about the risk. I have therefore sold the car and downgraded to a different model for about 60% of the value which CL will insure no problem (as its under the £100k limit) and also be fully cover for the odd trackday here & there & 7.5k miles of wind in the hair motoring. Its a shame it has come to this but I was planning on getting out of the GT3 at the end of the year anyway so the insurance situation has just brought this forward. Shame , but there you go.

This is the consequence of the immense cost now of repairing even relatively small damage on the latest GT cars. It is also a consequence of their vast potential performance ... Porsche Stability Management can only do so much and when downforce comes into the equation at a level where an untidy car can quickly become an "off" car, it doesn't give insurers much confidence. And the numbers speak for themselves. For this reason the all metal GT4 is in a real sweet spot and plenty fast enough for most. The RS and GT3's may have moved the game on too far. For myself, I self insure my 991.2 GT3RS ... if the worst happened I would take the parts value and call it a day. As explained if you look at the cost of trackday insurance against the insurers potential loss given low maximum values / high excesses / and high write-off values at auction, who are they doing a favour ?

ChrisW. said: This is the consequence of the immense cost now of repairing even relatively small damage on the latest GT cars. It is also a consequence of their vast potential performance ... Porsche Stability Management can only do so much and when downforce comes into the equation at a level where an untidy car can quickly become an "off" car, it doesn't give insurers much confidence. And the numbers speak for themselves. For this reason the all metal GT4 is in a real sweet spot and plenty fast enough for most. The RS and GT3's may have moved the game on too far. For myself, I self insure my 991.2 GT3RS ... if the worst happened I would take the parts value and call it a day. As explained if you look at the cost of trackday insurance against the insurers potential loss given low maximum values / high excesses / and high write-off values at auction, who are they doing a favour ? Completely agree. I wont be the only one caught in this position so prepare for other cars to come to the market. I`ll have just as much fun in the Spyder and with all the advances in patching the PCM to get Android auto to work now , it takes the edge off of the older style tech inside. I actually think that pay per day as far as trackdays go is a benefit as when I had 6 thrown into my annual policy , I felt like I was missing out if I only managed 4 or 5 ! I wonder if the trackday market is dwindling as a result of the cars getting more and more expensive. Probably a topic for another thread and its not lost on me that I am still chucking alot of money round a track when a cheapo BMW 3 series will achieve the same thing albeit , not cruise roofless round the Alps in style & comfort AND still perform GT4 like on circuit.

The 992 GT3 RS repair video on Matt Armstrong's latest video is and entertaining watch, but in terms of the costs, sobering. And Matt, as he's at pains to point out, did not dot every "i" or cross every "t" that a Porsche approved shop could/should do. Some of the cost cuts are, IMHO fine and pragmatic, others you can see why 'approved' repairers cannot countenance the risks.

I had a quote from Classicline today on a GT3 RS. £3K premium. £100K max payout on track minus the £22K excess. UK trackdays charged at £134 each. Would be great to hear from anyone else if you have found a better policy on a GT3 RS or similar?

vxdave said: I had a quote from Classicline today on a GT3 RS. £3K premium. £100K max payout on track minus the £22K excess. UK trackdays charged at £134 each. Would be great to hear from anyone else if you have found a better policy on a GT3 RS or similar? For context, which GT3 RS? e.g 997, 991, 992

Digga said: For context, which GT3 RS? e.g 997, 991, 992 This was for a 992 GT3 RS

Digga said: The 992 GT3 RS repair video on Matt Armstrong's latest video is and entertaining watch, but in terms of the costs, sobering. And Matt, as he's at pains to point out, did not dot every "i" or cross every "t" that a Porsche approved shop could/should do. Some of the cost cuts are, IMHO fine and pragmatic, others you can see why 'approved' repairers cannot countenance the risks. Digga,i don’t normally watch all these internet folk,but that was interesting,thanks.

Yellow491 said: Digga,i don t normally watch all these internet folk,but that was interesting,thanks. It's a big win for PPF. I'm definitely doing doors next time. Matt Armstrong seems pretty much no-nonsense. He's a BMXer and so I reckon there's not too much ego there. Like all these channels, they have stuff to punt - sponsors, product endorsements - but that's part of the cost of doing business. You accept it to a degree on YouTube. The rest of the content is basically just what he wants to do and I like that. Edited by Digga on Friday 6th June 08:10

Digga said: Yellow491 said: Digga,i don t normally watch all these internet folk,but that was interesting,thanks. It's a big win for PPF. I'm definitely doing doors next time. Matt Armstrong seems pretty much no-nonsense. He's a BMXer and so I reckon there's not too much ego there. Like all these channels, they have stuff to punt - sponsors, product endorsements - but that's part of the cost of doing business. You accept it to a degree on YouTube. The rest of the content is basically just what he wants to do and I like that. Edited by Digga on Friday 6th June 08:10 Agree the odd add is fine and get the business,rarely do i watch something all the way through,good to see how these cars come apart and back again.Not a fan of the owner ,in the same group as smee

Yellow491 said: Agree the odd add is fine and get the business,rarely do i watch something all the way through,good to see how these cars come apart and back again.Not a fan of the owner ,in the same group as smee Most of us who'd paid to be on that DN day were a bit pissed off. There were 3 red flags including this one, all cars properly wrecked, also done were a very nice, track spec E46 M3 and a GT4 RS. On the one hand, people pushing is always a risk there and anyone can have an off. If you have not had 'something' go wring there you're extraordinarily lucky. Wanting to get faster is part of it. Pushing for specific times moves into a grey area though, doesn't it? Tough for the TDO to police, but in theory it can/may invalidate everyone's track day insurance if an event is deemed to be 'competitive'. In fairness to JWW, he says it was just practice for his sub 7 attempt. Personally, I prefer to use the video to look at times after the fact, but I do see that timers, especially the more detailed GPS ones like Garmin, can give you some excellent feedback and development knowledge. TDT was following me the other year and using his and it gives predicted lap times from best sectors, which is a handy trick and, I think, lets you be more patient with the traffic. Just doesn't give you an 'ego lap' to bung onto your social media or YouTube.

Digga said: Most of us who'd paid to be on that DN day were a bit pissed off. There were 3 red flags including this one, all cars properly wrecked, also done were a very nice, track spec E46 M3 and a GT4 RS. Bloody hell! Would there have been any insurance cover across those cars? Easily understandable why underwriters don't want to offer cover and why Classic Line have had to change their offering.

braddo said: Digga said: Most of us who'd paid to be on that DN day were a bit pissed off. There were 3 red flags including this one, all cars properly wrecked, also done were a very nice, track spec E46 M3 and a GT4 RS. Bloody hell! Would there have been any insurance cover across those cars? Easily understandable why underwriters don't want to offer cover and why Classic Line have had to change their offering. Not sure, but any car over £100k May only be insured for limited amount. All drivers/passengers involved were okay, which is the main thing. The lad with the M3 (@jmecave on Instagram) is currently deciding whether to rebuild the car. Good video on there of it letting go - was an odd off. Rumours were that the GT4 RS was not insured, but I don’t know that is a fact. Don’t know if/how JWW’s car was insured, but as we’ve seen, it’s back on 4 wheels, so at least one’s saved.

Fyi: https://raceinc.de/en/home-english/

vxdave said: I had a quote from Classicline today on a GT3 RS. £3K premium. £100K max payout on track minus the £22K excess. UK trackdays charged at £134 each. Would be great to hear from anyone else if you have found a better policy on a GT3 RS or similar? Try Locktons…price will be about the same, but £150k cover and 100% cover on PCGB days

Just had this through from Classic Line, renewal is not until end of November: Following some challenging market conditions over the past two years we are writing to inform you that your present insurer Ageas (2) will only offer us renewal terms on your Porsche 911GT3RS if there are a number of other cars included on the policy. If you can look to add a number of cars to your policy before the current policy expires we can look to arrange for a bespoke multi vehicle policy with one of our key insurers. Please feel free to contact one of our team members when your other cars fall due for renewal so we can work with our insurer partners to create an insurance product to meet your need.

Had the same letter myself. Very disappointing. I just renewed my multi car policy with LV last month as well :-(

Amizade said: Fyi: https://raceinc.de/en/home-english/ Interesting, anyone had quotes?

PRO5T said: Interesting, anyone had quotes? I got this back and couldn't really make sense of it so didn't go further: thank you for your inquiry. The hull insurance is certainly around € 2T with € 10T Sb per day. Please find attached the link to the so-called participant liability insurance. Most of my customers take out this insurance in addition to their existing comprehensive insurance or as a “must have” for vehicles that cannot be registered and therefore do not have liability insurance. This insurance is valid for all trackdays, driver training courses and races for one year (with all the cars you drive) and is primarily valid for personal injury and property damage, including damage to other people's cars on the track. Crash barrier damage is also covered with 3,500 euros and 50 % excess. Otherwise, there is no excess in the contract. This is one of the most important types of insurance, as the damage can be significantly higher than the damage to your own car. You can take out daily or annual liability insurance directly online here. https://raceinc.de/versicherungen/teilnehmerhaftpf...

s_mcneil said: Just had this through from Classic Line, renewal is not until end of November: Following some challenging market conditions over the past two years we are writing to inform you that your present insurer Ageas (2) will only offer us renewal terms on your Porsche 911GT3RS if there are a number of other cars included on the policy. If you can look to add a number of cars to your policy before the current policy expires we can look to arrange for a bespoke multi vehicle policy with one of our key insurers. Please feel free to contact one of our team members when your other cars fall due for renewal so we can work with our insurer partners to create an insurance product to meet your need. Just had one of these myself this morning - what manner of nonsense is this! Classicline effectively forcing me to add additional cars to an insurance multi car account….or you won’t insure the Porsche on its own. Surely this is anti-competitive/against insurance law?….(probably not, right…..)

I called this morning as I also have an LV multicar policy ending shortly. CL said this policy was GT3RS specific so it won’t affect my SRS cover.

With track car SO expensive to repair or replace the underwriter probably wants to spread their risk to cover. Maybe not fair but probably within their rights.

If that is the cost of track-day insurance it seems like a good way of doing it ... when the alternative may be unaffordable premiums or no insurance for those who want it ...

Just had another email from Classicline stating that "Ageas" , my underwriter has now withdrawn any cover for European trackdays regardless of value ! So , I moved to a "cheaper" car to comply with the new thresholds and now they have moved the goalposts again mid term. I have yet to respond but am considering asking for a refund as the T&C`s have significantly changed NOT in my favour. Its probably time to go to a compare the market type road only policy and forget trackdays now.

Yes, I've had to go multicar for my new (to me) RS. Also looked at quotes for Nurburgring and it looks like I will have to self insure next year.

Interestingly I have just been on Compare The Market and gone for a regular road policy same miles and same xs etc etc ..... but not including the UK trackdays element and its over a thousand pounds cheaper which is bonkers. Even managed to put the missus on the policy which saved me another £100 !!! Dont tell her though So , binned off Classicline and refund incoming. A new years policy for a third of the CL price and just have to self insure should I bother to do any trackdays next year. The good times are coming to an end but with 2 major claims per week ( according to CL) I am not surprised the underwriters have withdrawn. £134 to get cover for one day that ends up in a total loss and payout of £85k is not sustainable business in anyones book.

Far Cough said: Interestingly I have just been on Compare The Market and gone for a regular road policy same miles and same xs etc etc ..... but not including the UK trackdays element and its over a thousand pounds cheaper which is bonkers. Even managed to put the missus on the policy which saved me another £100 !!! Dont tell her though So , binned off Classicline and refund incoming. A new years policy for a third of the CL price and just have to self insure should I bother to do any trackdays next year. The good times are coming to an end but with 2 major claims per week ( according to CL) I am not surprised the underwriters have withdrawn. £134 to get cover for one day that ends up in a total loss and payout of £85k is not sustainable business in anyones book. I thought CL didn’t do pro rata refunds?

jackwood said: I thought CL didn t do pro rata refunds? Definitely didn't for me when I sold my car a few weeks back.

I cancelled my policy with them 2 weeks ago as I sold my 991.1 and I am due a refund but they said it could take 60 days!!

I guess refund policy depends on the underwriter and the smallprint. Your home is at risk if you leave the gas on.

I'm sorry to say that the problem seems typically to be the "black 992.1 GT3RS" syndrome ... I was at Spa a few weeks ago and they were going absolutely mad ... in the braking zone from 150mph in my 991.2 GT3RS with passenger, and somebody one overtook through the apex of the first part of Les Combes ... then at the apex of Bruxelles 1 (Rivage 1) the second one came past ... both on the inside of the corner. Absolute nutters and an accident waiting to happen. They hide their numbers on the bonnet and behind the rear wing ...

jackwood said: I thought CL didn t do pro rata refunds? I didn't question it as the changes to the policy were not of my doing. She mentioned that she was having the same conversation with alot of customers who suddenly found themselves paying a premium rate for a service that was no longer an option.

Digga said: Yes, I've had to go multicar for my new (to me) RS. Also looked at quotes for Nurburgring and it looks like I will have to self insure next year. What happened to the van?

Far Cough said: Just had another email from Classicline stating that "Ageas" , my underwriter has now withdrawn any cover for European trackdays regardless of value ! So , I moved to a "cheaper" car to comply with the new thresholds and now they have moved the goalposts again mid term. I have yet to respond but am considering asking for a refund as the T&C`s have significantly changed NOT in my favour. Its probably time to go to a compare the market type road only policy and forget trackdays now. Had same email, long gone are the days of the Mannings UK policy that covered everything no additionals. Will also be looking at alternatives come renewal in December

Digga said: Yes, I've had to go multicar for my new (to me) RS. Also looked at quotes for Nurburgring and it looks like I will have to self insure next year. Done this for years..just stick to the speed limits 👍🏻

FL Racing said: Digga said: Yes, I've had to go multicar for my new (to me) RS. Also looked at quotes for Nurburgring and it looks like I will have to self insure next year. What happened to the van? Hyabusa engine.

Same here. CL have always offered affordable & competitive premiums for older high value classics plus the new stuff. Not so anymore - at renewal the rate jumped circa 100% with less cover/benefits

CL categorically refusing any stand alone GT3RS, regardless of age, got confirmed this last week on a call to them. Looking for other options now. Chubb and Lockton so far crossed off the potentials due to requirements and costs.

I've just renewed with CL, although I was annoyed the underwriter bumped my premium due to a NON-FAULT claim I had on a different policy with a different vehicle. They only increased the premium by £30 but it's the principle. Only PCGB trackdays included, all other UK TDs now £134 each, no euro TD cover at all. Def agree it feels like the good times are coming to an end, options for using these cars as intended in a relatively safe environment are vanishing, at least for now. I live in hope that things will change some day should the economy pick up or something

Digga said: FL Racing said: Digga said: Yes, I've had to go multicar for my new (to me) RS. Also looked at quotes for Nurburgring and it looks like I will have to self insure next year. What happened to the van? Hyabusa engine. Das ist gut... So is it green

rrroro said: Digga said: FL Racing said: Digga said: Yes, I've had to go multicar for my new (to me) RS. Also looked at quotes for Nurburgring and it looks like I will have to self insure next year. What happened to the van? Hyabusa engine. Das ist gut... So is it green Carlos Fandango superwide wheels too.

Digga said: rrroro said: Digga said: FL Racing said: Digga said: Yes, I've had to go multicar for my new (to me) RS. Also looked at quotes for Nurburgring and it looks like I will have to self insure next year. What happened to the van? Hyabusa engine. Das ist gut... So is it green Carlos Fandango superwide wheels too. This could be the start of a trend, I want one too now.

rrroro said: Digga said: rrroro said: Digga said: FL Racing said: Digga said: Yes, I've had to go multicar for my new (to me) RS. Also looked at quotes for Nurburgring and it looks like I will have to self insure next year. What happened to the van? Hyabusa engine. Das ist gut... So is it green Carlos Fandango superwide wheels too. This could be the start of a trend, I want one too now. Looks fun..

rrroro said: I've just renewed with CL, although I was annoyed the underwriter bumped my premium due to a NON-FAULT claim I had on a different policy with a different vehicle. They only increased the premium by £30 but it's the principle. Only PCGB trackdays included, all other UK TDs now £134 each, no euro TD cover at all. Def agree it feels like the good times are coming to an end, options for using these cars as intended in a relatively safe environment are vanishing, at least for now. I live in hope that things will change some day should the economy pick up or something Same deal for me although I have not renewed just yet. The other factor in play, apart from way too many cars facilitating what can be best described as a track day Arms race is the ludicrous price of parts for both the old and the new stuff. Porsche potentially self harming here as uninsurable track cars won’t suit a large part of the demographic.

I renewed with CL yesterday and got a slightly different answer to those above. The UK cover is value-based. For cars worth less than £50k, the cost is £94 (?) per day and for £50-£100k it's £134 per day. Max £100k value covered on a 10% compulsory excess basis. Max 6 days covered (I forgot to clarify if that was just "free" PCGB days or 6 days regardless). I was also offered cover for overseas TDs for £224. CL claimed that they had contacted policy holders to update on their changed charging model re TDs, but when pushed they confirmed it hadn't been sent to me ! All a bit unsatisfactory, but I'm not sure there's much of an alternative. Certainly in previous years none of the obvious competitors have been any cheaper regardless of TD cover or not. Both of my cars are fairly modified, so using a "high street" type provider is likely to be more of a fight than I can be bothered with.

Jamie Summers said: I renewed with CL yesterday and got a slightly different answer to those above. The UK cover is value-based. For cars worth less than £50k, the cost is £94 (?) per day and for £50-£100k it's £134 per day. Max £100k value covered on a 10% compulsory excess basis. Max 6 days covered (I forgot to clarify if that was just "free" PCGB days or 6 days regardless). I was also offered cover for overseas TDs for £224. CL claimed that they had contacted policy holders to update on their changed charging model re TDs, but when pushed they confirmed it hadn't been sent to me ! All a bit unsatisfactory, but I'm not sure there's much of an alternative. Certainly in previous years none of the obvious competitors have been any cheaper regardless of TD cover or not. Both of my cars are fairly modified, so using a "high street" type provider is likely to be more of a fight than I can be bothered with. On track cover, Spa for £224 looks a "better" deal than £134 for Castle Combe

They specifically said NO euro cover for me (996 GT3) , need to double check that. The six days are all PCGB is what I was told.

ttdan said: They specifically said NO euro cover for me (996 GT3) , need to double check that. The six days are all PCGB is what I was told. At least you got the renewal, blanket no for RS, of any year.

CL is no Euro trackday cover whatsoever regardless of vehicle value. UK trackdays are a pay as you go affair. Porsche club and TIPEC run days remain free. Couple of mates are with Footman James and they have had no such communication but I cannot believe they will not be affected too as its the underwriters driving this not the brokers. I tried a few others and Lockton were stupid expensive. Chubb wanted a multi car policy and again very expensive. CL did mention they only had one underwriter left covering trackdays but again , very expensive. I cannot remember the name of the underwriter she mentioned. Morris stand alone cover for one day on track was £1500 for my GT3. I think we are going to start seeing less and less premium cars on trackdays which will have a knock on effect for the TDO`s. I dont plan on doing anymore now, its easier to hop on the train and explore what great roads Europe has to offer.

Far Cough said: CL is no Euro trackday cover whatsoever regardless of vehicle value. UK trackdays are a pay as you go affair. Porsche club and TIPEC run days remain free. Couple of mates are with Footman James and they have had no such communication but I cannot believe they will not be affected too as its the underwriters driving this not the brokers. I tried a few others and Lockton were stupid expensive. Chubb wanted a multi car policy and again very expensive. CL did mention they only had one underwriter left covering trackdays but again , very expensive. I cannot remember the name of the underwriter she mentioned. Morris stand alone cover for one day on track was £1500 for my GT3. I think we are going to start seeing less and less premium cars on trackdays which will have a knock on effect for the TDO`s. I dont plan on doing anymore now, its easier to hop on the train and explore what great roads Europe has to offer. Which circuit and which GT3 variant, out of interest?

ttdan said: rrroro said: I've just renewed with CL, although I was annoyed the underwriter bumped my premium due to a NON-FAULT claim I had on a different policy with a different vehicle. They only increased the premium by £30 but it's the principle. Only PCGB trackdays included, all other UK TDs now £134 each, no euro TD cover at all. Def agree it feels like the good times are coming to an end, options for using these cars as intended in a relatively safe environment are vanishing, at least for now. I live in hope that things will change some day should the economy pick up or something Same deal for me although I have not renewed just yet. The other factor in play, apart from way too many cars facilitating what can be best described as a track day Arms race is the ludicrous price of parts for both the old and the new stuff. Porsche potentially self harming here as uninsurable track cars won t suit a large part of the demographic. Yeah, I'm still half shopping around as there is a 30 day cooling off on the policy subject to a cancellation fee, but will probably stick with it. Porsche are struggling and probably have been for a while, so it's no surprise they're not looking beyond their nose like most in that position. It is self defeating, price gouging doesn't help anyone

ttdan said: They specifically said NO euro cover for me (996 GT3) , need to double check that. The six days are all PCGB is what I was told. They were quite clear with me that Euro days were coverable, and given I also have a 996 GT3 that's even more weird !

CL have or had 4 under writers for their track / road policies, all of which have slightly different terms hence why you get people stating they have x while others are excluded on their policy. CL doesn’t seem to offer to change your under writer which is odd. Can only assume which ever uw is offering cover still , isn’t taking new clients

My policy is a multi-car, so maybe that is a different underwriter to single car policies ?

Digga said: Which circuit and which GT3 variant, out of interest? It was a while back but I think it was Zandvoort in a 992 GT3

According to their website, they have 6 different underwriters: https://www.classiclineinsurance.co.uk/your-docume... The best thing is to check the documents and not what the phone operator said as different underwriters will approach the risk differently

Far Cough said: Digga said: Which circuit and which GT3 variant, out of interest? It was a while back but I think it was Zandvoort in a 992 GT3 I have not used Moris personally but friends that have done and it always seems to be approx 1% of the insured (gross before excess) value

ttdan said: Far Cough said: Digga said: Which circuit and which GT3 variant, out of interest? It was a while back but I think it was Zandvoort in a 992 GT3 I have not used Moris personally but friends that have done and it always seems to be approx 1% of the insured (gross before excess) value Depends on value. I’ve been quoted around 1% excess on RS, but then you also pay 20% of any claim. That’s for £160k car on Nordschleife.

Digga said: ttdan said: Far Cough said: Digga said: Which circuit and which GT3 variant, out of interest? It was a while back but I think it was Zandvoort in a 992 GT3 I have not used Moris personally but friends that have done and it always seems to be approx 1% of the insured (gross before excess) value Depends on value. I ve been quoted around 1% excess on RS, but then you also pay 20% of any claim. That s for £160k car on Nordschleife. I meant that the daily cost of the insurance is approx 1% of the cars value. And yes a large excess.