993: If you had £5k for tweaks/upgrades.... - Page 4 - 911/Carrera GT - PistonHeads UK

Dare I say it, I think my 117k mile '94 C2 Cab might be an unexpected keeper (see here: http://www.pistonheads.com/xforums/topic.asp?h=0&a... Since she was bought about as cheap as they come from a dealer (thumb up for 911V as usual) with a recent full respray, new hood and an engine that seems to be soldiering on in rude form (jinxed it now ), I figure that it might be fun to invest a little money in her in the next 12 months to make her even more special.... ....what would you do (that wasn't cosmetic) assuming your car was totally standard? Currently she's got some Carnewal mufflers on her (best buy EVER) but that's it.

Personally unless some thing needs doing (shocks, rollbars or waxoyl etc) I would keep your money for when something needs doing. A cab isn't really a candidate for any RS type mods, so keep it standard and in good order and enjoy.

Depending what suspension you have that could be a good way to spend £2k. Get some B6 Bilstein and M033 factory springs to Lower the car. Get a good geo and it could transform the car. Other nice mods - Atiwe or Porsch 996 steering wheel £500 - Caliper refurb c£500 - Sports cat c£500-£600 - remap from Wayne c£600 - Short shift kit c£80 and goldern rod c£350

Magna said: Depending what suspension you have that could be a good way to spend £2k. Get some B6 Bilstein and M033 factory springs to Lower the car. Get a good geo and it could transform the car. Other nice mods - Atiwe or Porsch 996 steering wheel £500 - Caliper refurb c£500 - Sports cat c£500-£600 - remap from Wayne c£600 - Short shift kit c£80 and goldern rod c£350 As above, spot on, I wouldn't bother with the steering wheel. Also change all the anti-roll bushes, lower arm bushes. Solid billet Ali lower cam covers. Any money left spend on a European trip to the Italian lakes, taking in epic mountain passes, testing that new suspension.

It would also be a good idea to get the common issue of rear chassis leg rust sorted. I am not sure what this would cost as most owners do it themselves but I would have thought about 1k.

suspension - Chris remap - Wayne I nearly said type 53 relay for the rear wiper What wheels do you have?

Agreed, just get it good and right. Tip top suspension and bushes, rear chassis leg rust. If you have rsr then maybe just get the rs quick shift as it adds quite a lot imo for pennies. Then spend a few grand taking it round europe.

Thanks for the replies everyone, some good suggestions there I quite like the idea of the short shift mod and taking it to Chip Wizards was an idea I had about this time last year that never materialised due to me not being sure how long I would keep the car. I'll get my guy to check over the suspension and rust stuff properly when it goes in for a few minor bits in a couple of weeks, then might spend some money there. As for the road trip round Europe, I'm waaaaaay ahead of you already: have had 6 months booked off starting March since this time last year The last half of which is a 3 month road trip round Europe starting in June You can all hate me now Rough route.... http://goo.gl/Vh1yBx with ferry home from Bilbao It's not exact, but you get the idea

Now join ADAC breakdown. German breakdown company, 2nd largest behind AAA in US. Covers whole of Europe, for 98€, this covers my whole family, including my kids. RAC/AA will sting you for cover on a old car. If you call ADAC in UK, the AA arrive

rallyeman said: Now join ADAC breakdown. German breakdown company, 2nd largest behind AAA in US. Covers whole of Europe, for 98€, this covers my whole family, including my kids. RAC/AA will sting you for cover on a old car. If you call ADAC in UK, the AA arrive Very true already had their cover in the past AA quoted me £250 for the same thing I already have euro breakdown cover from another insurance policy, but will have a check to see what limitations/exclusions there are, ADAC might be a better quality cover

In terms of spending:- Refurb suspension Fit a strut brace (especially beneficial on a convertible) Fit Motorsound airbox Short shift kit HID headlights Get the chassis legs checked for corrosion Any other bits that are showing their age; callipers, head light lenses, foglights etc. Keep the rest of your money for when it's needed. You've caught the bug. Enjoy! pp

Pickled Piper said: Fit Motorsound airbox Is this worth it given that I already have Carnewal RSR mufflers? Good call on the strut brace, investigating now....

Mario149 said: Pickled Piper said: Fit Motorsound airbox Is this worth it given that I already have Carnewal RSR mufflers? Hell yes! The two work beautifully together. The Motorsound airbox gives you more intake noise when you have the throttle wide open. So it's not too intrusive. Plus it's an original Porsche part and has a shiny intake trumpet! What's not to like? pp

Pickled Piper said: Mario149 said: Pickled Piper said: Fit Motorsound airbox Is this worth it given that I already have Carnewal RSR mufflers? Hell yes! The two work beautifully together. The Motorsound airbox gives you more intake noise when you have the throttle wide open. So it's not too intrusive. Plus it's an original Porsche part and has a shiny intake trumpet! What's not to like? pp Haha! I think I'll forgo the shiny intake trumpet and DIY the original with a drill....not only will I save money but I'll get extra man points and a warm fuzzy feeling from doing something to the car myself ....

Orangecurry said: What wheels do you have? She's got the 18" jobbies on already which I quite like

Don't just check-over the suspension - get it just how you want it. What is on at the moment? If is OE on 117k then you should REALLY try something modern..... and new top mounts are critical, no matter what condition they appear to be in. Answer the question - what wheels do you have? Not how big are they. Reducing the weight makes a noticeable difference.

It's not jealousy but the european trip starting in June could be a long time stuck in traffic jams looking at your route. Perfect for May or October but difficult June/July/August. If that is your thing make spend some money on ensuring your AC works and perhaps the pre-trip service with a different grade oil for the hotter temperatures and also make sure you brake fluid is changed if your doing some mountain passes.

For mountain passes consider swapping to upgraded brake pads - RS brake ducts might be more useful than front foglights too

Orangecurry said: Don't just check-over the suspension - get it just how you want it. What is on at the moment? If is OE on 117k then you should REALLY try something modern..... and new top mounts are critical, no matter what condition they appear to be in. Answer the question - what wheels do you have? Not how big are they. Reducing the weight makes a noticeable difference. I've got inches of service history with it so will have a check, but I think it's had new/refurbed dampers in fairly recent history, will have to check. On track it felt okay to me, big surprise was that I don't get any understeer to speak of really which was a nice surprise compared to my old 6C4S. Worth a good checkover for condition and a trip to Centre Gravity nonetheless I guess As for wheels, they're the round ones with rubber on the outside Currently on some Falken winter rubber, not decided what will go on when it warms up.

Nobbles said: It's not jealousy but the european trip starting in June could be a long time stuck in traffic jams looking at your route. Perfect for May or October but difficult June/July/August. We should be okay, I've done a few extended trips round the continent in the past at that time of year so I'm not too worried. We won't be driving everyday so we can always leave early etc as necessary on a driving day Nobbles said: If that is your thing make spend some money on ensuring your AC works Air con? Air con?? I laugh in the face of heat! (The car does not have it ) Nobbles said: and perhaps the pre-trip service with a different grade oil for the hotter temperatures and also make sure you brake fluid is changed if your doing some mountain passes. Yeah, she'll be going in for a service before we leave

Interesting thread this - just considering some upgrades on my own 993. It already came with the Motorsport soundbox, and I had Porsche fit the short-shift kit. Gert fitted me out recently with HID's, RSR's and RS engine mounts. Thinking about shocks and bushes next. Do most people go for original shocks or something adjustable ?? I will not be using mine on the track but do use it all year round. Cheers 1/2p

halfpenny43 said: Thinking about shocks and bushes next. Do most people go for original shocks or something adjustable ?? I will not be using mine on the track but do use it all year round. Cheers 1/2p Ohh now you've done it. The general consensus is not to bother with original shocks unless you get them at a bargain price. Back in the old days when I got my 993, the standard advice was to fit Bilstein HDs. There are all manner of other options now and disagreements on the 'best" shocks have almost ended with trial by combat. pp

Mario149 said: I've got inches of service history with it so will have a check, but I think it's had new/refurbed dampers in fairly recent history, will have to check. On track it felt okay to me, big surprise was that I don't get any understeer to speak of really which was a nice surprise compared to my old 6C4S. Worth a good checkover for condition and a trip to Centre Gravity nonetheless I guess As for wheels, they're the round ones with rubber on the outside You'll have to start thinking about what to fit before you visit COG. Any refresh will be noticeable, but everyone wants something different from suspension. Mine is low and hard and I'm sure wouldn't suit most drivers. Tech-Art springs and Bilstein HD. Jackal went through most set-ups, but he's changed the front a great deal as well to better-than RS. I think many people overlook the importance of the springs, and concentrate on new shocks only. A long conversation with Chris, and well-before taking the car to him (so you can source parts) would be my advice. Also, if those are solidspoke OE wheels, I would find something lighter. Yawn add lightness especially on the wheels yawn but I really noticed the difference between 18" solidspokes and any other lighter OE wheel I've tried (and I've tried most ). 17s are without doubt the best option, not just due to less weight, but also the narrower front tyre makes the steering almost telepathic. The so-called Cup2s suit the 993 really well, but the lightweight 18" MY02 wheel is a good option if the narrow 7J front 17" wheel doesn't fill the arch enough for you. Edited by Orangecurry on Monday 6th January 23:37

Orangecurry said: wheel suggestions I just checked, I have hollow spokes! It's only 9am and I've already saved myself some money Did get a funny look from a lady on her way to the train station as she saw me feeling up car wheels in my dressing gown though....

Mario149 said: Orangecurry said: wheel suggestions Did get a funny look from a lady on her way to the train station as she saw me feeling up car wheels in my dressing gown though.... You sound like a wheel perv!

Pickled Piper said: halfpenny43 said: Thinking about shocks and bushes next. Do most people go for original shocks or something adjustable ?? I will not be using mine on the track but do use it all year round. Cheers 1/2p Ohh now you've done it. The general consensus is not to bother with original shocks unless you get them at a bargain price. Back in the old days when I got my 993, the standard advice was to fit Bilstein HDs. There are all manner of other options now and disagreements on the 'best" shocks have almost ended with trial by combat. pp LOLOL - thanks for the advice - I think what your saying in summary is shop around and see what the best deal is for me

g7jhp said: Mario149 said: Orangecurry said: wheel suggestions Did get a funny look from a lady on her way to the train station as she saw me feeling up car wheels in my dressing gown though.... You sound like a wheel perv! Most of us are? OP - I thought you wanted us to help spend 5k? A man needs at least two sets of wheels for his car - stop spoiling things And (I always hate asking this) when you felt-up your spokes, they were completely flat on the back-face, from top to bottom, yes?

Orangecurry said: And (I always hate asking this) when you felt-up your spokes, they were completely flat on the back-face, from top to bottom, yes? Yup, was going off this pic (albeit for 996s): Even checked all four in case they weren't all the same

Yes - same for Turbo1 wheel as it is for Turbo2 wheel.

Mario, You didn't mention if you have carried out the HID upgrade to your headlights. The standard headlights are woefully inadequate on dipped beam. An HID upgrade brings them up to date and makes the car far more useable in the dark. pp

Pickled Piper said: Mario, You didn't mention if you have carried out the HID upgrade to your headlights. The standard headlights are woefully inadequate on dipped beam. An HID upgrade brings them up to date and makes the car far more useable in the dark. pp I haven't....yet. Had the conversion done on my F355 and it was amazing so I will be doing it to the 993. Maybe I should put them on the Mini too since she's in for a stage 1 and a few bits at the mo anyway! Am now making a spreadsheet of stuff to do based on people's suggestions....very exciting

Mario149 said: Orangecurry said: And (I always hate asking this) when you felt-up your spokes, they were completely flat on the back-face, from top to bottom, yes? Yup, was going off this pic (albeit for 996s): Even checked all four in case they weren't all the same Are your wheels definitely genuine items, with the rim width and offset cast in to the front face either side of the valve? If not then you probably have very heavy replicas.

Mario149 said: Pickled Piper said: Mario, You didn't mention if you have carried out the HID upgrade to your headlights. The standard headlights are woefully inadequate on dipped beam. An HID upgrade brings them up to date and makes the car far more useable in the dark. pp I haven't....yet. Had the conversion done on my F355 and it was amazing so I will be doing it to the 993. Maybe I should put them on the Mini too since she's in for a stage 1 and a few bits at the mo anyway! Am now making a spreadsheet of stuff to do based on people's suggestions....very exciting Your life sound terrible. How do you put up with it I didn't use it myself, but current consensus is that the best HID kit is supplied by a poster called TorreB who posts on 911UK. The kit is apparently plug and play and of good quality. Just google for his website. Carnewal is a great site, He's like a drug dealer for Porsche owners. Sounds like you have already got your exhausts from him. I got my strut brace from him, plus loads of other stuff. Have fun. pp

I'm running 18inch wheels but solidspoke. What would those that have tried a few out recommend? I should add nothing mad priced.

Sorry to butt in, but to those that have gone ahead with a significant 993 suspension upgrade, and (if its not too vague a question) just how good a car to drive can you get to ?? I had one a few years ago, a C4, and it felt at times slightly leaden footed and a bit creaky, but I have a long term aim to get another 993 and get it upgraded as much as required to ideally get to a tightly controlled but still nicely riding car.

thegoose said: Are your wheels definitely genuine items, with the rim width and offset cast in to the front face either side of the valve? If not then you probably have very heavy replicas. Turbo1 wheels do NOT have the width/offset 'cast' into the rim each side of the valve. It's one of the only genuine OE wheels that doesn't.

Orangecurry said: thegoose said: Are your wheels definitely genuine items, with the rim width and offset cast in to the front face either side of the valve? If not then you probably have very heavy replicas. Turbo1 wheels do NOT have the width/offset 'cast' into the rim each side of the valve. It's one of the only genuine OE wheels that doesn't. I must check mine then! I'm pretty sure I have replicas but now you've got me thinking....

Presuming Ed said: I'm running 18inch wheels but solidspoke. What would those that have tried a few out recommend? I should add nothing mad priced. So you want to reduce weight? What about size? 18s MY02s are very lightweight (same weight as near as to hollowspokes) and IMO look brilliant on the 993, and if you are patient you can source a set for a reasonable amount (unlike hollowspokes) Either a Boxster set or a 996 set both fit perfectly. 7.5J / 9J with 225/40 and 265/35 or 8J / 10J with the same tyres or 285/30 on the back (though that's probably too much grip). 17s Big choice here. Buying so-called Cup2s or Sport classics will never lose you money, so it's a no-brainer. Both very lightweight and with 205/50 or even 225/45 up-front will make you realise how good the steering really is on your car. Here is your bible http://www.944racing.de/wheelweights.php ....some photos? MY02 18 (shows just how small a 993 is ) SC 17s Boxster S FFS (yes the spoiler is up and I agree the wheels don't suit the 993)

Or even 16" rims for arguably the best steering feel?

Hi kids, as part of the suspension overhaul I think I'm going to go for the PSS10s as if I'm going to do it, I might as well do it properly. Does anyone know how much Centre Gravity would charge in labour to fit the parts and set the car up? I'm only after a rough figure, maybe from someone who's had it done themselves. I ask as I tried calling them, got voicemail, so sent an email and still haven't had any reply, so thought someone might be able to shed a bit of light until such time as they get in contact.

As a very rough number I would say it would be about £900.

Just to throw a spanner in the works, after two years of research, I've just ordered FSD Konis. I wanted firmness on the twisties in the Pyrenees when I go with the lads, and compliance on uk roads and when the wife's with me. Feedback seems to point to these doing the job very well. Though I'm updating the old girl and making her more sporty. She will never see a track with me, so I'm trying to update, yet not lose how she came out the factory. Saying that I've just bought a LWF and RS quick shift, hopefully both being fitted later this month Edited by Wozy68 on Sunday 12th January 10:14

Wozy68 said: Just to throw a spanner in the works, after two years of research Edited by Wozy68 on Sunday 12th January 10:14 Bloody hell I hope the wait is worth it. FSD's seem to have good comments and are similar in price to the std Billy HD's.

thegoose said: Are your wheels definitely genuine items, with the rim width and offset cast in to the front face either side of the valve? If not then you probably have very heavy replicas. Just seen this post mate, somehow missed it before. Is it 100% that if you don't have the offset cast into the face they're fake? Mine don't, but nor do the set on the 993 Carrera S parked in my car park either, and I thought that the Carrera Ss came with the hollow spoke Turbo rims as standard? Or have I got that wrong? Luckily, even if my turbo wheels aren't genuine it isn't a massive problem as I'm just about to get some Cup 2s delivered - I figure I can keep the winters on the (fake?) turbo wheels, and have nice summer rubber on the new ones!

Stop trying so hard guys! IMHO with 993s, the best ride, handling, precision/delicacy combination is to be found on original 16inch rims, combined with recently refreshed OE suspension. Only departure from OE suspension on mine(apart from renewing everything all round a few thou ago) is polybushes to the front, which give an (ever so slightly) firmer feel to the steering on the road. Or perhaps the 'Large wheel/trick suspension' Fanboys are more interested in how their cars look than how they drive?

Magna said: Wozy68 said: Just to throw a spanner in the works, after two years of research Edited by Wozy68 on Sunday 12th January 10:14 Bloody hell I hope the wait is worth it. FSD's seem to have good comments and are similar in price to the std Billy HD's. lol ........... should really have said, 2 years of being chicken and 2 years of saving

Boo152 said: Stop trying so hard guys! IMHO with 993s, the best ride, handling, precision/delicacy combination is to be found on original 16inch rims, combined with recently refreshed OE suspension. Only departure from OE suspension on mine(apart from renewing everything all round a few thou ago) is polybushes to the front, which give an (ever so slightly) firmer feel to the steering on the road. Or perhaps the 'Large wheel/trick suspension' Fanboys are more interested in how their cars look than how they drive? Hi Tom, Worse mistake I made ............ mine had the original 16s in her when I bought her, sold em for £100.00. Love the 17s, but it would have been nice to still have the originals ...... especially for winter tyres Re suspension ....... Mines in need, I wanted to keep original, but I just couldn't give Porsche £1500 for new M033 and old Monroes Edited by Wozy68 on Sunday 12th January 20:43

You missed my answer as well. Mario149 said: thegoose said: Are your wheels definitely genuine items, with the rim width and offset cast in to the front face either side of the valve? If not then you probably have very heavy replicas. Just seen this post mate, somehow missed it before. Is it 100% that if you don't have the offset cast into the face they're fake? Mine don't, but nor do the set on the 993 Carrera S parked in my car park either, and I thought that the Carrera Ss came with the hollow spoke Turbo rims as standard? Or have I got that wrong? Orangecurry said: thegoose said: Are your wheels definitely genuine items, with the rim width and offset cast in to the front face either side of the valve? If not then you probably have very heavy replicas. Turbo1 wheels do NOT have the width/offset 'cast' into the rim each side of the valve. It's one of the only genuine OE wheels that doesn't.

Orangecurry said: You missed my answer as well. Haha!

Boo152 said: Stop trying so hard guys! IMHO with 993s, the best ride, handling, precision/delicacy combination is to be found on original 16inch rims, combined with recently refreshed OE suspension. Only departure from OE suspension on mine(apart from renewing everything all round a few thou ago) is polybushes to the front, which give an (ever so slightly) firmer feel to the steering on the road. Or perhaps the 'Large wheel/trick suspension' Fanboys are more interested in how their cars look than how they drive? Makes sense - how many people now ruing decision to 'upgrade' 1960s/70s 911T/E/S etc to a more modern or better handling set-up? Issues of rapacious OPC parts prices or fundamentally poor design aside, leave it as it is. I belive Porsche does know what it's doing.

Bump! Update: Off to Centre Gravity tomorrow to have PSS10s and Eibach springs fitted List of stuff I decided to do in the end: Fit HIDs Fit strut brace Callipers refurbed and repainted red Replace fog/running lights with ducts/running lights Dial faces redone in white Fit motorsound airbox (arriving in a couple of days) to complement the Carnewal RSR. With any luck, in about 48 hours or so, I should have pretty much the sweetest handling and sounding 993 Cab in the country And then I have to go abroad and won't be able to drive it for ages as everything has taken rather longer than planned

Wozy68 said: Just to throw a spanner in the works, after two years of research, I've just ordered FSD Konis. I wanted firmness on the twisties in the Pyrenees when I go with the lads, and compliance on uk roads and when the wife's with me. Feedback seems to point to these doing the job very well. Though I'm updating the old girl and making her more sporty. She will never see a track with me, so I'm trying to update, yet not lose how she came out the factory. Saying that I've just bought a LWF and RS quick shift, hopefully both being fitted later this month Edited by Wozy68 on Sunday 12th January 10:14 Wozy, any news on the FSD purchase ...are they on the car yet ?

wfarrell said: Wozy, any news on the FSD purchase ...are they on the car yet ? They are sat in storage at work, I'm just about to order the M033 springs and then in a few weeks or so, buy new top mounts....... Budget constraints and all that The one other thing I'm seriously considering, is uprating the ARBs to the M030 spec from the standard setup. Basically I want to keep B road compliance, but firm up laterally on the twisties a bit. I actually agree with Boo. Standard was good, I just can't spend good money on something from OPC that should be a third the price it is, and to boot, twenty years old technology. I've had a wild thought of replacing the whole rear suspension arms etc as they are now twenty years old, so possibly even more expense. I'll update when its all/partially done. Oh, and then there's the RS LWF and clutch I have ready in the wings to be fitted. Damn. Edited by Wozy68 on Monday 24th February 21:41

Great updates, thanks.

Looks good, you must be very happy, 993 such a classic shape.

Looks good, you must be very happy, 993 such a classic shape.

Mario149 said: Can you explain about the Eibach springs paired with the PSS10 ? Presume the standard Bilstein spring is chucked but looks like the helper is retained ? What spec is the Eibach compared to the Billy one ? What are you trying to achieve and does it work ? What is the rate of the Eibach compared to standard Billy spring ? Is the ride better (maybe you can't say 'cos you never tried the stock billy spring) or is it supposed to be ? TIA

TB993tt said: Mario149 said: Can you explain about the Eibach springs paired with the PSS10 ? Presume the standard Bilstein spring is chucked but looks like the helper is retained ? What spec is the Eibach compared to the Billy one ? What are you trying to achieve and does it work ? What is the rate of the Eibach compared to standard Billy spring ? Is the ride better (maybe you can't say 'cos you never tried the stock billy spring) or is it supposed to be ? TIA Yup, the Bilstein spring is not used but the helper is retained. From memory the Bilstein ones are 50 N/mm and 70 N/mm and the Eibachs are 28% less, you can do the maths, too early for me! If my understanding was correct, when we were discussing options on the phone, Chris explained that given the fact it was a Cab we were working with there was going to be extra flex in the chassis that you wouldn't get with the standard C2. Lowering the spring rates means that the spring "gives" a little easier than the Bilsteins, transferring less instantaneous load into the chassis meaning it's less likely to flex and distort the geo. It wasn't that it was def going to cause a problem, but we decided that since I was making quite a sizeable financial commitment getting all this done, we might as well use his experience and not take the risk. I'd give Chris a quick call to confirm that I'm not talking tripe though just to make sure! I've never tried the stock Bilstein spring so can't do a comparison, but truth be told, living in London and having driven the car a little round town yesterday, I wouldn't want it any firmer. And when we were out for the test drive at the end of the chassis tuning, it felt very sweet. As an aside, normally Chris would send out PSS10s on a 993 with them set to 5 for the road, but because of the Eibachs, we have them set to 3 on the Cab as they don't have to work as hard against the spring. If I have a moment tomorrow, I'm going to have a play and dial them up to 5 and then may be further to see what happens and report back. Edited by Mario149 on Friday 28th February 08:12 Edited by Mario149 on Friday 28th February 08:13

Mario149 said: Bump! Update: Off to Centre Gravity tomorrow to have PSS10s and Eibach springs fitted List of stuff I decided to do in the end: Fit HIDs Fit strut brace Callipers refurbed and repainted red Replace fog/running lights with ducts/running lights Dial faces redone in white Fit motorsound airbox (arriving in a couple of days) to complement the Carnewal RSR. With any luck, in about 48 hours or so, I should have pretty much the sweetest handling and sounding 993 Cab in the country And then I have to go abroad and won't be able to drive it for ages as everything has taken rather longer than planned Just thought I'd post a few piccies of the above and source/cost - in case anyone is thinking of making some of the same changes it can be used as a ref, all prices include VAT and delivery where applicable, but exclude labour unless stated otherwise: Motorsound airbox - PorcheShop.co.uk - £101 Bilstein PSS10s with Eibach springs - Carnewal.com for the shocks, Center Gravity sourced the springs - £2010 for shocks, £300 for springs More info on suspension fitting/setup here Calliper strip down, refurb, repainted red, some new brake pipes and hose - Sid at porsche-torque.com - £480 inc labour Running lights/ducts - type911shop.co.uk, parts fitted by Sid at porsche-torque.com - £106 for parts, £120 painting and fitting HID light conversion (not visible ) - Sid at porsche-torque.com - £180 inc fitting OMP Strut brace - seller "strutbracer" on eBay - £151 Dials refaced in white - reapautomotivedesign.co.uk - c.£300 (excludes removing and refitting) I have to say although it was expensive, the decision to reface the dials is one I am exceptionally pleased with. They really seem to lift the blue leather interior and make the car feel much more special. During the day you get the lovely white that stands out, and at night they look black except where the light bleeds from the pointers where it then shines a little white again giving them a halo/aura effect. It's just really pretty and frankly actually slightly distracting on the motorway as a result I'm now toying with the idea of clear indicator lenses but I actually do like the amber retro look. I should really also complete the "performance package" by getting it remapped by Wayne who people have recommended, but I think that may have to wait a few months unless I can get one of my mates to run it to him while I'm away. Edited by Mario149 on Friday 28th February 08:21

Mario149 said: Yup, the Bilstein spring is not used but the helper is retained. From memory the Bilstein ones are 50 N/mm and 70 N/mm and the Eibachs are 28% less, you can do the maths, too early for me! If my understanding was correct, when we were discussing options on the phone, Chris explained that given the fact it was a Cab we were working with there was going to be extra flex in the chassis that you wouldn't get with the standard C2. Lowering the spring rates means that the spring "gives" a little easier than the Bilsteins, transferring less instantaneous load into the chassis meaning it's less likely to flex and distort the geo. It wasn't that it was def going to cause a problem, but we decided that since I was making quite a sizeable financial commitment getting all this done, we might as well use his experience and not take the risk. I'd give Chris a quick call to confirm that I'm not talking tripe though just to make sure! I've never tried the stock Bilstein spring so can't do a comparison, but truth be told, living in London and having driven the car a little round town yesterday, I wouldn't want it any firmer. And when we were out for the test drive at the end of the chassis tuning, it felt very sweet. As an aside, normally Chris would send out PSS10s on a 993 with them set to 5 for the road, but because of the Eibachs, we have them set to 3 on the Cab as they don't have to work as hard against the spring. If I have a moment tomorrow, I'm going to have a play and dial them up to 5 and then may be further to see what happens and report back. Very interesting, thanks for that.

Mario149 said: Yup, the Bilstein spring is not used but the helper is retained. From memory the Bilstein ones are 50 N/mm and 70 N/mm and the Eibachs are 28% less, you can do the maths, too early for me! If my understanding was correct, when we were discussing options on the phone, Chris explained that given the fact it was a Cab we were working with there was going to be extra flex in the chassis that you wouldn't get with the standard C2. Lowering the spring rates means that the spring "gives" a little easier than the Bilsteins, transferring less instantaneous load into the chassis meaning it's less likely to flex and distort the geo. It wasn't that it was def going to cause a problem, but we decided that since I was making quite a sizeable financial commitment getting all this done, we might as well use his experience and not take the risk. I'd give Chris a quick call to confirm that I'm not talking tripe though just to make sure! I've never tried the stock Bilstein spring so can't do a comparison, but truth be told, living in London and having driven the car a little round town yesterday, I wouldn't want it any firmer. And when we were out for the test drive at the end of the chassis tuning, it felt very sweet. As an aside, normally Chris would send out PSS10s on a 993 with them set to 5 for the road, but because of the Eibachs, we have them set to 3 on the Cab as they don't have to work as hard against the spring. If I have a moment tomorrow, I'm going to have a play and dial them up to 5 and then may be further to see what happens and report back. Edited by Mario149 on Friday 28th February 08:12 Edited by Mario149 on Friday 28th February 08:13 Looking good Did you replace your top mounts as well?

Wozy68 said: Looking good Did you replace your top mounts as well? Front ones were fine, there was wear on the rears. In an ideal world you'd replace the rears with new ones, but given that you can only source them from Porsche (or for full Porsche price, I forget which) for mega money and there weren't any available that day (I had to get in and out) we were a bit stymied. Chris managed to find some used ones he had knocking about that were in better condition than mine and he gave me them for free. He was happy with the performance they would give and said they would likely outlast the car itself, and frankly if he's happy I'm happy. It was also nice to save a little cash and keep the costs vaguely under control as I was in for about £500 of replacement wear and tear parts already. It kinda harks back to what I said earlier, frankly it's unbelievably impressive how long these 993 parts last bearing in mind that my car is a '94 one on nearly 120k miles and was on all original bits. Apparently they're on a whole other level to what came after.

Mario149 said: Front ones were fine, there was wear on the rears. In an ideal world you'd replace the rears with new ones, but given that you can only source them from Porsche (or for full Porsche price, I forget which) for mega money and there weren't any available that day (I had to get in and out) we were a bit stymied. Chris managed to find some used ones he had knocking about that were in better condition than mine and he gave me them for free. He was happy with the performance they would give and said they would likely outlast the car itself, and frankly if he's happy I'm happy. It was also nice to save a little cash and keep the costs vaguely under control as I was in for about £500 of replacement wear and tear parts already. It kinda harks back to what I said earlier, frankly it's unbelievably impressive how long these 993 parts last bearing in mind that my car is a '94 one on nearly 120k miles and was on all original bits. Apparently they're on a whole other level to what came after. I'm saving up for the mounts at the mo, best price I can get it seems is OPC. Mine is on original springs, mounts dampers etc at 122K, in my case its the front mounts that are kaput, and the rears that are okish but will need doing sooner rather than later, so I may as well have them done also. I'm going FSDs, new mounts new M033 springs. Outlay for the above will be around £1750.00 ex install or anything else that's found whilst installing. Which is enough for me, though I appreciate you can spend Ks with suspension.

Haven't the americans come up with a top-mount option yet? Like they have with the engine mounts?

Wozy68 said: I'm going FSDs, new mounts new M033 springs. Outlay for the above will be around £1750.00 ex install or anything else that's found whilst installing. Which is enough for me, though I appreciate you can spend Ks with suspension. It's the extras that are the nasty surprise. In order for it to make sense fitting the new shocks and doing the new setup, they had to replace: 1x lower V arm = £228 2x camber arm = £228 1x kine toe arm = £154 2x front wishbone bushes = £60 all inc VAT ....with the V arm being a particular raping as you can see. If your car is at similar mileage to mine, I'd budget £500-£750 extra for unexpected replacement bits and their labour on top of the top mounts cost just to be on the safe side. You could be lucky and not need (much) stuff, in which case happy days, but best to err on the side of caution. Would be horrible to turn up and have to make a big compromise on what should be a great day for the shiny pride and joy.

TB993tt said: Can you explain about the Eibach springs paired with the PSS10 ? Presume the standard Bilstein spring is chucked but looks like the helper is retained ? What spec is the Eibach compared to the Billy one ? What are you trying to achieve and does it work ? What is the rate of the Eibach compared to standard Billy spring ? Is the ride better (maybe you can't say 'cos you never tried the stock billy spring) or is it supposed to be ? TIA ...any chance you've got the springs from the PSS10 kit available ?

wfarrell said: ...any chance you've got the springs from the PSS10 kit available ? Yes