991.1 GT3RS - good value - Page 2 - 911/Carrera GT - PistonHeads UK

Been looking at some 991.1 GT3RS they seem to offer some great value when compared to a 991.2 GT3RS. I could sell my 991.2 CS and get into one - what's the catch? is the 992.1 GT3 a better option? Thoughts

Engine issues not resolved, although that’s not to say any of them can’t succumb.

PRO5T said: Engine issues not resolved, although that s not to say any of them can t succumb. Does the Porsche warranty give peace of mind?

What's the issue with the engines? I thought it was the GT3 engines?

I had one they are absolutely awful cars.

Coxey said: What's the issue with the engines? I thought it was the GT3 engines? 991 was the first GT3 to use an engine derived from the “normal” engine, as opposed to the Mezger designed unit from 996/7. There have been a fair few reported failures and full replacements from Porsche. Apparently the latest revision - I want to say labelled G6 - is much more reliable and essentially contains all of the fixes that were included in the 991.2 GT3 engine.

bobthemonkey said: 991 was the first GT3 to use an engine derived from the normal engine, as opposed to the Mezger designed unit from 996/7. There have been a fair few reported failures and full replacements from Porsche. Apparently the latest revision - I want to say labelled G6 - is much more reliable and essentially contains all of the fixes that were included in the 991.2 GT3 engine. The g6 991.1gt3 might be more reliable (and it better be....) but it can't and won't contain 'all the fixes included in the .2gt3 engine'.

fridaypassion said: I had one they are absolutely awful cars. Oh…

These are the modifications made in the 991.1 GT3RS to 991.2RS engine transition ...

Coxey said: Oh A 718 GT4 is far superior you could also get an RS for the same money no brainer to me. Don't believe the hype with this generation RS they are slow and pretty boring to drive.

fridaypassion said: Coxey said: Oh A 718 GT4 is far superior you could also get an RS for the same money no brainer to me. Don't believe the hype with this generation RS they are slow and pretty boring to drive. Well, that is one person's opinion who is invested in a 718 GT4RS. I agree a great car, but certainly not an exclusively great car ... take a look at what the press have said (though the 981GT4 did just beat the 991.1 GT3RS in the 2015 ? ECOTY to second place ???) I could say that most Porsche owners would be very surprised to discover just how nice some Mclarens are to own ... and no more expensive now to run than Porsche. Ask Harry Metcalf what he thinks of his 650S ... Maybe it also depends upon usage. Yes you can tour in a GT4RS but would you choose to ?? It is what it is ... Porsche did not design it to be a GT3RS.

And that's a counter opinion from someone who is invested in a 991 3rs...

I remember when the 991 RS was launched and I would have ordered one (in that purple color with silver rims), had I not missed the call by the OPC while being in hospital after having crashed my car (my inclination to call back a few days later to order a new car was somewhat reduced at that time, slot would have been gone anyway). I think they look great, but have never driven one.

isaldiri said: And that's a counter opinion from someone who is invested in a 991 3rs... Yes it is ... but I didn't say that the GT3RS is a better car than the GT4RS and I didn't say that either was an absolutely awful car ... The original question was whether or not the 991.1 GT3RS is good value ? Is it ? Edited by ChrisW. on Sunday 3rd August 10:38

I think in regards to the posts above detailing engine upgrades on the .2 answer is no its not. 991GT3 & RS would worry me with there engine regardless if it had a Porsche warranty or not i just dont want the hassle.

Engines letting go are not unknown on GT4 RS and 992 RS either mind you, Porsche are getting better at hiding it though. I heard direct from one owner that if news of his engine implosion found its way onto social media or the forums he would be black listed from purchasing any more "halo" products.

PRO5T said: Engines letting go are not unknown on GT4 RS and 992 RS either mind you, Porsche are getting better at hiding it though. I heard direct from one owner that if news of his engine implosion found its way onto social media or the forums he would be black listed from purchasing any more "halo" products. Without doubt Porsche are masters at deceiving everyone one that there cars are built proof.

ChrisW. said: Well, that is one person's opinion who is invested in a 718 GT4RS. I agree a great car, but certainly not an exclusively great car ... take a look at what the press have said (though the 981GT4 did just beat the 991.1 GT3RS in the 2015 ? ECOTY to second place ???) I could say that most Porsche owners would be very surprised to discover just how nice some Mclarens are to own ... and no more expensive now to run than Porsche. Ask Harry Metcalf what he thinks of his 650S ... Maybe it also depends upon usage. Yes you can tour in a GT4RS but would you choose to ?? It is what it is ... Porsche did not design it to be a GT3RS. Hmmm I'm not really invested in any car to be honest and I have no ego about binning a car I bought and thought was pants like the 991RS. The GT4RS as we are all figuring out is a pretty deeply flawed car out of the box the suspension is pretty terrible but there is a halo car hiding in there somewhere. I have my DSC controller in now I'll add a post on the other thread. Press coverage around Porsches is weird. I think we all know Evo were on the payroll it was a running joke about them winning ECOTY they lavished praise on almost every car. They were definitely adept at handling journos back in the day. I view the 981 GT4 as a pretty dull car as well having had 2 albeit they passed through my business. Detailed run down on the 991RS for me and I am quite bitter about this as it was a poster car for me and cost me £150k and it was a really very poor car I thought. Its slow. Too tall gearing. It has about 300 BHP until you get to 7k and the 500BHP is inaccessible so you just have a slow show car for the road. Is it 90 in second or something? Rear steer - I HATED this it just made the car feel weird and doing overtakes would make the car feel unstable. Noise - rubbish inside the car sounds fab outside for everyone else though. The steering was good though which again because the press coverage around P cars is always weird this seemed to be an area they were allowed to criticise but was actually incredibly good for an electric setup. The 718 is even better still with Lotus rivalling feel (need to get them with PCCB) The ride quality was also very good but again an "allowed" area of comment for the press. Stupid fake gearbox clunky noises were a bit annoying after a time. I had it on track it was quick enough but just one of those cars that drives itself around really. At least we got to stretch the gearbox a bit. Re other cars I've had a 600LT it blows all of the Porsche stuff into the weeds its twice the car of the 991 RS and levels above the 4RS. I had 2.5 mega years in mine with no issues. I just dropped into the 4RS for something that was a bit cheaper to run and for the road it's not as license loosie as the McLaren and also attracts less unwanted attention. The Supercar thing is a box I've been privileged to tick but wouldn't be bothered about revisiting well maybe a 458. For balance I drove an F8 tributo and nearly fell asleep behind the wheel it was so dull. Drove an Aventador and almost gave myself a hernia laughing about just how utterly awful that car is on every level. I really wanted to like the 991 but I gave it 3 months and it had to go it just wasn't for me and I know these things can be subjective but for me theres way too much praise lumped onto Porsche cars generally although I massively respect a lot of peoples views including you ChrisW I do think there "they are a bit pants" side of the discussion is not heard often enough everyone just assumes they are awesome based on Evo's extremely biased reviews and of course you do get people e like with any car that buy the car and have it as a hill to die on that its the best thing ever. I'm really not like that I've had all sorts and I would say the best car of them all isn't even a supercar...it's the Lotus Exige S2.

Everyone has an opinion , after 30 k miles ( .2 ) it is a reliable comfortable car, only thing on track to get up to speed you need to be on an edge and certainly does not drive itself , far from it . Still enjoy it

I really enjoy the owner reviews and it's a sure thing that we are all different. One of the things I really admire Porsche for is (in general) the attention they pay to making them a reliable car to use on track ... and therefore almost bomb proof for those who use them on the road. Of course a naturally aspirated engine will be low on torque in the mid range where it's been tuned for maximum power and howl at high revs ... the mid range of the GT4 being easily tuneable to that of the GT3 but 50bhp short at the top of the rev range ... hence we rave about "that engine" For you the noise of the GT3 inside is a disappointment, for me the noise inside of the GT4RS could be a penance with my tinnitus (which most of the time I can ignore until reminded what an intrusion it can be). As for the RWS, there are times when I find it extremely useful. For example at Cadwell Park where coming through Hall Bends in the wet one is normally obliged to take the left hand side of the track for the right hand Hairpin that follows ... accepting the risk of the tail wagging the dog under braking. With RWS it's much easier to brake late and straight on the abs (ending up on the right hand side of the circuit), then hooking the car round Hairpin ... almost like Shelloils in the wet at Oulton Park. Thanks for taking the trouble to explain ... all good stuff !

Interesting comments, thank you. I have been to have a look at two one Lava Orange and one Ultra Violet. I suppose another question I am asking myself is where these will be value wise in the next five odd years.

ChrisW. said: I really enjoy the owner reviews and it's a sure thing that we are all different. One of the things I really admire Porsche for is (in general) the attention they pay to making them a reliable car to use on track ... and therefore almost bomb proof for those who use them on the road. Of course a naturally aspirated engine will be low on torque in the mid range where it's been tuned for maximum power and howl at high revs ... the mid range of the GT4 being easily tuneable to that of the GT3 but 50bhp short at the top of the rev range ... hence we rave about "that engine" For you the noise of the GT3 inside is a disappointment, for me the noise inside of the GT4RS could be a penance with my tinnitus (which most of the time I can ignore until reminded what an intrusion it can be). As for the RWS, there are times when I find it extremely useful. For example at Cadwell Park where coming through Hall Bends in the wet one is normally obliged to take the left hand side of the track for the right hand Hairpin that follows ... accepting the risk of the tail wagging the dog under braking. With RWS it's much easier to brake late and straight on the abs (ending up on the right hand side of the circuit), then hooking the car round Hairpin ... almost like Shelloils in the wet at Oulton Park. Thanks for taking the trouble to explain ... all good stuff ! Yeah the fact you can have the cars under full Porsche warranty and absolutely hammer them around the track if you like is one of the best things about them. The extended warranty is so cheap for what it is too.

Currently have a .1 RS coming from cars like Lotus and Mclaren 570s before and was debating between a 991.1 RS or a 600LT. For me the rs is just more enjoyable. The 570 was quicker in a line definitely but it did it so effortlessly it became not that exciting on the road. The extendend warranty being triple the price of the Porsches stung a little too. Both amazing cars but for smiles whilst on the road, ive found myself much more eager to do an evening run in the 911 than ever in the 570s.

Coxey said: Interesting comments, thank you. I have been to have a look at two one Lava Orange and one Ultra Violet. I suppose another question I am asking myself is where these will be value wise in the next five odd years. I had a new Lava Orange .1 RS, picked it up from Leipzig and they let me take it to a part of Halle airport and hoon it. Then drove it back to UK. I found it soulless and boring, almost too easy to drive. Much better option is the 991.2 GT3, engine is a peach and at same money no brainer to me. With regard to Lava, and the reason I sold the RS quickly, the colour! Looks amazing in a car showroom but out in the open a horrible tone, it’s a salmon look. UV at the time of ordering looked bland/flat to me, but having seen one with a gloss PPF on it looks amazing with Silver Wheels. If you are going .1 RS then take UV over Lava. 991.2 GT3 in either gearbox for me.

maura said: I had a new Lava Orange .1 RS, picked it up from Leipzig and they let me take it to a part of Halle airport and hoon it. Then drove it back to UK. I found it soulless and boring, almost too easy to drive. Much better option is the 991.2 GT3, engine is a peach and at same money no brainer to me. With regard to Lava, and the reason I sold the RS quickly, the colour! Looks amazing in a car showroom but out in the open a horrible tone, it s a salmon look. UV at the time of ordering looked bland/flat to me, but having seen one with a gloss PPF on it looks amazing with Silver Wheels. If you are going .1 RS then take UV over Lava. 991.2 GT3 in either gearbox for me. well on the .1rs it's barney or salmon for the launch colours......

maura said: Coxey said: Interesting comments, thank you. I have been to have a look at two one Lava Orange and one Ultra Violet. I suppose another question I am asking myself is where these will be value wise in the next five odd years. I had a new Lava Orange .1 RS, picked it up from Leipzig and they let me take it to a part of Halle airport and hoon it. Then drove it back to UK. I found it soulless and boring, almost too easy to drive. Much better option is the 991.2 GT3, engine is a peach and at same money no brainer to me. With regard to Lava, and the reason I sold the RS quickly, the colour! Looks amazing in a car showroom but out in the open a horrible tone, it s a salmon look. UV at the time of ordering looked bland/flat to me, but having seen one with a gloss PPF on it looks amazing with Silver Wheels. If you are going .1 RS then take UV over Lava. 991.2 GT3 in either gearbox for me. Thanks for this. I am actually now looking at a 991.2 GT3

I’ve had 2 x 991.1 RS and the reason I had 2 was because the first one I had was fantastic - let’s be honest, they all are as an RS is a very special car indeed. My 1st was specced by me and went UV with black wheels - looked epic - did a lot of trackdays including about 3 events at the Ring. I then bought a Mexico Blue one a few years later, which is such a cool colour and again a fantasctic drive on both the road and track. The exhaust needs fettling though - I had a Sharkwerks on both of them

It's a tricky one.. but for me the engine time bomb is too much to ignore.. so I would pick a 991.2 GT3 over a 991.1 3RS as much as I like the car. Of course if you can get one that has Extended warranty - you can fall back on that to take care of you up to 15th Year - its just then the inconvenience if there is a problem and who knows how quickly it would get resolved.

TDT said: It's a tricky one.. but for me the engine time bomb is too much to ignore.. so I would pick a 991.2 GT3 over a 991.1 3RS as much as I like the car. Of course if you can get one that has Extended warranty - you can fall back on that to take care of you up to 15th Year - its just then the inconvenience if there is a problem and who knows how quickly it would get resolved. Imo anyway, it's not even a tricky one. The engine issue (especially as I'd be using the car a bit on track which increases susceptibility) is one such that I would not consider any 991.1 personally. Yes the warranty and such will cover it but I just don't really want to face wondering if or rather when it'll throw a problem (had a bit too much of that with my old Mclaren in the end) and then face the down time while it's getting a new engine. Many moons ago I was idly considering a .1rs but a quiet word from a friend in Germany who had known about the .1rs still having issues but simply later on put paid to that idea.... Nothing really has changed since tbh.

They definitely go bang but I think it's one of those over hyped things on the internet with the RS imo. Ive heard of 991.2 and 992 engines going, non of these are indestructible especially when used heavily on track. They made a lot of changes to the RS including lower rev limiter and upping to 4.0. The engine in the .2 is undeniably better but is it worth 30/40k more? Takes the car to a whole new price bracket. Not sure how up to date this is but here is a registry from Rennlist that compares RS and GT3 https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1k_0jjgwrsg...

Mwn11 said: They definitely go bang but I think it's one of those over hyped things on the internet with the RS imo. Ive heard of 991.2 and 992 engines going, non of these are indestructible especially when used heavily on track. They made a lot of changes to the RS including lower rev limiter and upping to 4.0. The engine in the .2 is undeniably better but is it worth 30/40k more? Takes the car to a whole new price bracket. Very true… none of these engines are without their issues. I think the comparison is between 991.1 3RS and 991.2 GT3 as those will be close together in price. 991.2 3RS is still a bit more depending on mileage.

Mwn11 said: They definitely go bang but I think it's one of those over hyped things on the internet with the RS imo. Ive heard of 991.2 and 992 engines going, non of these are indestructible especially when used heavily on track. No engine is indestructible for sure. Even the faithful old mezger was not without it's issues at times for example but it's a question of probability for me and I'd not fancy those odds on the 991.1 gen personally. Others can and will and fair enough.

Mwn11 said: They definitely go bang but I think it's one of those over hyped things on the internet with the RS imo. Ive heard of 991.2 and 992 engines going, non of these are indestructible especially when used heavily on track. They made a lot of changes to the RS including lower rev limiter and upping to 4.0. The engine in the .2 is undeniably better but is it worth 30/40k more? Takes the car to a whole new price bracket. Not sure how up to date this is but here is a registry from Rennlist that compares RS and GT3 https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1k_0jjgwrsg... Very interesting information thanks ! ... including 991.1RS but no 991.2 ... is that just because such a list has not been started ?