OPC P*** take estimate - Page 3 - Porsche General - PistonHeads UK

Wifes Boxster 981 needs a new battery so while I could do it (lazy) called newish local OPC. Estimate £950 !!!!! Asked what was involved and would only say "this is the booked Porsche time" Felt a little aggrieved so asked Porsche UK (AKA reading) for the same estimate. £650 - still mad but more sensible. Feel like I should poke the DP at the other OPC as this seems like a deliberate p*** take. I'm assuming that PUK would be the most reliable re "Porsche book time" Views? Will just get done at RPM for 200ish but dont like being mugged off. Also the newish OPC have been VERY good for other work/warranty on the 911 M PS Wifeys view is they dont want the work :-) I'm used to this with trades over pricing but not car dealers !

Jesus! trousers down, £200 please.....Ridiculous

I got pulled up for a non-OEM battery this week when my car was in the OPC for a service - recommended supply and fit Porsche branded battery was £760 for a 718 Cayman. Given the battery is about 350 from Porsche IIRC, 900 odd quid is an absolute piss take.

Personally I’d watch this handy YouTube video, do it myself, then spend the money saved on taking my wife to a nice restaurant. https://youtu.be/YVcVpHo-zao?si=WuzyBi9Rp5Rp-KnT ECP have a Bosch Stop/Start battery compatible with the 718 for 360 quid https://www.eurocarparts.com/p/bosch-s5a11-agm-sto... Edited by Shooter McGavin on Friday 14th March 11:49

I bought form West London Parts with PCGB discount, fitted it myself and then RPM checked it and recoded. Battery was vv expensive but approved. R

Shooter McGavin said: Personally I’d watch this handy YouTube video, do it myself, then spend the money saved on taking my wife to a nice restaurant. https://youtu.be/YVcVpHo-zao?si=WuzyBi9Rp5Rp-KnT ECP have a Bosch Stop/Start battery compatible with the 718 for 360 quid https://www.eurocarparts.com/p/bosch-s5a11-agm-sto... Edited by Shooter McGavin on Friday 14th March 11:49 For 360 i'd just get a Banner/Porsche one - the correct spec Bosch ones can usually be had for 150ish if you shop around.

I use Tayna for batteries ... as a matter of interest if the correct spec battery is fitted, what would that change on the car ? The last I heard batteries did not need to be coded in to work perfectly well ... though it does speed up the car identifying a new battery so that it can optimise charging ...

Was quoted more than £700 for new battery by OPC previously. They said they needed the car for two hours. I think they build in time for problems or coding issues

Buy the battery from your OPC and then fit and code it yourself if you have a diagnostic machine such as an ICarsoft or know someone who has one.

scrounger73 said: Buy the battery from your OPC and then fit and code it yourself if you have a diagnostic machine such as an ICarsoft or know someone who has one. Or just just don’t bother coding it and it will probably be fine.

High Wycombe, OP?

Maxym said: High Wycombe, OP? I couldn’t possibly comment

Looking at the OPs location, I have just had my pants pulled down by said place. 10 mins up the road I was pleased to see them open but I would advise caution for anyone booking work there and will be reverting back to the previous OPC I used.

ChrisW. said: I use Tayna for batteries ... as a matter of interest if the correct spec battery is fitted, what would that change on the car ? The last I heard batteries did not need to be coded in to work perfectly well ... though it does speed up the car identifying a new battery so that it can optimise charging ... I've been using Tayna for years (on my Caterham); excellent prices and service.

mikees said: Wifes Boxster 981 needs a new battery so while I could do it (lazy) called newish local OPC. Estimate £950 !!!!! Asked what was involved and would only say "this is the booked Porsche time" Felt a little aggrieved so asked Porsche UK (AKA reading) for the same estimate. £650 - still mad but more sensible. Feel like I should poke the DP at the other OPC as this seems like a deliberate p*** take. I'm assuming that PUK would be the most reliable re "Porsche book time" Views? Will just get done at RPM for 200ish but dont like being mugged off. Also the newish OPC have been VERY good for other work/warranty on the 911 M PS Wifeys view is they dont want the work :-) I'm used to this with trades over pricing but not car dealers ! Don't ever go to an OPC then. That's their stock and trade.

SkinnyPete said: scrounger73 said: Buy the battery from your OPC and then fit and code it yourself if you have a diagnostic machine such as an ICarsoft or know someone who has one. Or just just don’t bother coding it and it will probably be fine. Even if the battery life was shortened slightly by not recoding you could buy 6 batteries for the price of one fitted Porsche one. You could literally put a new one in every year and be no worse off and we all know the actual difference will be minimal if at all.

CanAm said: I've been using Tayna for years (on my Caterham); excellent prices and service. I've just checked their prices for a 987.2 battery. Their most expensive were Bosch and Varta, both under £105!

Johnson897210 said: You can ignore all the coding to the car BS imo, many will fight this but the new battery will learn automatically. How does an AGM battery learn anything, I am sure we would all like the opportunity to learn from you?

981Boxess said: Johnson897210 said: You can ignore all the coding to the car BS imo, many will fight this but the new battery will learn automatically. How does an AGM battery learn anything, I am sure we would all like the opportunity to learn from you? The BMS will learn the new battery such that it doesn’t need coding. You will get the usual naysayers though hence my suggestion of a cheap coding device if the op feels strongly.

Johnson897210 said: 981Boxess said: Johnson897210 said: You can ignore all the coding to the car BS imo, many will fight this but the new battery will learn automatically. How does an AGM battery learn anything, I am sure we would all like the opportunity to learn from you? The BMS will learn the new battery such that it doesn’t need coding. You will get the usual naysayers though hence my suggestion of a cheap coding device if the op feels strongly. BMS?

Had my original battery die during covid. No dealers open so just shipped a Porsche branded one and fitted myself. Despite not coding it has always worked fine and was a like for like swap, has lasted longer than the original now. Had warranty hence the decision to pay Porsche tax for their OEM one despite the non branded "Running Bull" one probably being exactly the same and vastly cheaper.

981Boxess said: BMS? Battery Management System Edited by CanAm on Saturday 15th March 12:07

CanAm said: 981Boxess said: BMS? Battery Management System Was rather hoping to find out how an AGM battery learns, still am?

Out of interest, I checked the handbook for my Cayman 987.2, which happily shows the owner how to replace a battery, with no mention of recoding (too old for that technology?) or entrusting the work to OPCs only. The existing battery is a Yuasa; are they on the Porsche approved list?

https://www.design911shop.com/p/99961108012-car-ba... If you need warranty get the proper one. But fit it yourself. It’s easy. You can ignore all the coding to the car BS imo, many will fight this but the BMS will learn the new battery automatically. Expect 101 posts telling me that is nonsense and you need a dealer or coding device. There’s probably a cheap one available if you feel strongly. No warranty then get a non oem one for at least half the price. Edited by Johnson897210 on Saturday 15th March 14:10

IMHO coding is really only necessary if changing from/to Lithium, AGM, or standard lead acid types (for those cars that support it). If replacing with the same tech, no coding should be required. The BMS (for those asking) is circuitry internal to the battery itself that monitors and ensures that it does not get below a certain voltage which would damage it. You occasionally hear stories about batteries shutting down and needing a voltage jolt to wake them up after they go into protection mode.

Sometimes the battery needs to be coded. There’s a name for it but it escapes me. It’s like a reset that only a shop with PIWIS can do. If you don’t have it coded and you have certain options, they won’t work, like heated seats for example. But it doesn’t have to go to Porsche, an Indy can do it.

Popolou said: The BMS (for those asking) is circuitry internal to the battery itself that monitors and ensures that it does not get below a certain voltage which would damage it. You occasionally hear stories about batteries shutting down and needing a voltage jolt to wake them up after they go into protection mode. That doesn’t apply to the 981, it is on later cars

981Boxess said: Popolou said: The BMS (for those asking) is circuitry internal to the battery itself that monitors and ensures that it does not get below a certain voltage which would damage it. You occasionally hear stories about batteries shutting down and needing a voltage jolt to wake them up after they go into protection mode. That doesn’t apply to the 981, it is on later cars The are still entries in the DME for the AH rating and battery type even for the 981. That is essentially the "coding" unless you came across something different?

If you change the battery for a different Ah rating then it needs to be coded so the alternator doesn't deliver too much charge if you've gone smaller. If a like for like then not required IMHO, although if you've got an OBD reader easy enough to do. BMS is usually only Lithium/Anti-gravity batteries where as mentioned they can go into a deep sleep when they get low to prevent total discharge and damage. If you want a 'shock' price up a Lithium car battery! In relation to the OP's quandry. I'd buy a battery (genuine if under warranty as they'll spot it at the next service) and fit it myself.

Armitage.Shanks said: BMS is usually only Lithium/Anti-gravity batteries where as mentioned they can go into a deep sleep when they get low to prevent total discharge and damage. If you want a 'shock' price up a Lithium car battery! Spot on with both.

Car BMS is what needs coding. https://rennlist.com/forums/991/1256464-icarsoft-a... Not necessary on 987.

CanAm said: ChrisW. said: I use Tayna for batteries ... as a matter of interest if the correct spec battery is fitted, what would that change on the car ? The last I heard batteries did not need to be coded in to work perfectly well ... though it does speed up the car identifying a new battery so that it can optimise charging ... I've been using Tayna for years (on my Caterham); excellent prices and service. I think this is one for a 981. £144 + delivery. https://www.tayna.co.uk/car-batteries/enduroline/1...

Irrespective of who thinks they know what about this I think the arrogance of OPCs in regard to supplying and fitting batteries is astounding. Instead of alientating their customers over something as small as a battery fitting they should charge sensible money and not make them look elswhere for that and other work. Some profit is always better than no profit and no customer likes to feel like they have been ripped off.

981Boxess said: Irrespective of who thinks they know what about this I think the arrogance of OPCs in regard to supplying and fitting batteries is astounding. Instead of alientating their customers over something as small as a battery fitting they should charge sensible money and not make them look elswhere for that and other work. Some profit is always better than no profit and no customer likes to feel like they have been ripped off. But you do get a lovely cup of coffee, and a little Belgian chocolate.

Armitage.Shanks said: If you change the battery for a different Ah rating then it needs to be coded so the alternator doesn't deliver too much charge if you've gone smaller. If a like for like then not required IMHO, although if you've got an OBD reader easy enough to do. BMS is usually only Lithium/Anti-gravity batteries where as mentioned they can go into a deep sleep when they get low to prevent total discharge and damage. If you want a 'shock' price up a Lithium car battery! In relation to the OP's quandry. I'd buy a battery (genuine if under warranty as they'll spot it at the next service) and fit it myself. First sensible post in what is becoming all too frequent drivel on PH.

CanAm said: But you do get a lovely cup of coffee, and a little Belgian chocolate. Excellent toilets too, and if you're really lucky, those super thick disposable paper towels to dry your hands on, which also ensures those pesky rainforests don't get to cover the face of the globe ...

981Boxess said: CanAm said: 981Boxess said: BMS? Battery Management System Was rather hoping to find out how an AGM battery learns, still am? It isn't the battery that learns, it is the car so it knows the battery has been replaced and can monitor its life. The car will monitor remaining capacity and total charges, from this it ensures the battery is charged correctly across cells to prevent uneven wear or overcharging.

SV_WDC said: 981Boxess said: CanAm said: 981Boxess said: BMS? Battery Management System Was rather hoping to find out how an AGM battery learns, still am? It isn't the battery that learns, it is the car so it knows the battery has been replaced and can monitor its life. The car will monitor remaining capacity and total charges, from this it ensures the battery is charged correctly across cells to prevent uneven wear or overcharging. Hence my question

SkinnyPete said: scrounger73 said: Buy the battery from your OPC and then fit and code it yourself if you have a diagnostic machine such as an ICarsoft or know someone who has one. Or just just don’t bother coding it and it will probably be fine. Not Porsche so not sure how relevant. My BMW M135i original battery lasted 4 years before stop/start stopped working (sure sign the battery is in the way out) followed by messages of low battery voltage. I replaced mine with a Bosch battery but couldn’t be arsed with coding it. So far it’s lasted 5 years and has been absolutely fine. I’m not convinced this battery coding stuff isn’t just another con dreamt up by car manufacturers to try and fleece customers of more money. Each to their own and only you can decide but I wouldn’t pay for coding a battery.

981Boxess said: SV_WDC said: 981Boxess said: CanAm said: 981Boxess said: BMS? Battery Management System Was rather hoping to find out how an AGM battery learns, still am? It isn't the battery that learns, it is the car so it knows the battery has been replaced and can monitor its life. The car will monitor remaining capacity and total charges, from this it ensures the battery is charged correctly across cells to prevent uneven wear or overcharging. Hence my question The car BMS learns the new battery. Coding unnecessary. I have updated my original post to remove any “confusion”. https://www.porscheclubgb.com/forum/threads/non-po... HTH but am doubtful.

maz8062 said: Sometimes the battery needs to be coded. There’s a name for it but it escapes me. It’s like a reset that only a shop with PIWIS can do. If you don’t have it coded and you have certain options, they won’t work, like heated seats for example. But it doesn’t have to go to Porsche, an Indy can do it. The reset is called a “handover.” This is normally performed when a new battery is installed at the dealer. Without it, certain functions, options like heated seats, may not work because the battery change puts it back to factory settings, so I'm guessing the dealer is charging for an hour’s labour to do it. Edited by maz8062 on Tuesday 18th March 06:53

Something I never understood about OPC prices. I mean sure pay a bit more because premises, training, etc are nicer than an Indy but there is paying a bit more and being taken advantage of. Maybe they think people with money to buy their cars brand new don’t care about spending. My experience is that a lot of people with that kind of money don’t like to be taken by a mug and don’t like to waste money just because they have it. It’s the eternal warranty worries that seems to affect everyone these days. Are the cars that unreliable/poorly made that you can’t run a standard boxster, 911, Macan out of warranty? Other brands seem to cope better…. IMO it’s all a con these so called high end/super car brands. But then JLR is the same if not worse. I would be very unhappy paying full price for a RR for it not to be reliable on an everyday use. It’s taking the piss…

maz8062 said: maz8062 said: Sometimes the battery needs to be coded. There’s a name for it but it escapes me. It’s like a reset that only a shop with PIWIS can do. If you don’t have it coded and you have certain options, they won’t work, like heated seats for example. But it doesn’t have to go to Porsche, an Indy can do it. The reset is called a “handover.” This is normally performed when a new battery is installed at the dealer. Without it, certain functions, options like heated seats, may not work because the battery change puts it back to factory settings, so I'm guessing the dealer is charging for an hour’s labour to do it. Edited by maz8062 on Tuesday 18th March 06:53 But it's easy to use a small charger the stop the car losing all power whilst the battery is changed .. hence no re-setting is required. Porsche do punch a date on one of the battery poles ... but whether anybody would notice if a (new) battery was not faulty ??

CrgT16 said: Something I never understood about OPC prices. I mean sure pay a bit more because premises, training, etc are nicer than an Indy but there is paying a bit more and being taken advantage of. Maybe they think people with money to buy their cars brand new don’t care about spending. My experience is that a lot of people with that kind of money don’t like to be taken by a mug and don’t like to waste money just because they have it. It’s the eternal warranty worries that seems to affect everyone these days. Are the cars that unreliable/poorly made that you can’t run a standard boxster, 911, Macan out of warranty? Other brands seem to cope better…. IMO it’s all a con these so called high end/super car brands. But then JLR is the same if not worse. I would be very unhappy paying full price for a RR for it not to be reliable on an everyday use. It’s taking the piss… In my case, it's about maintaining the warranty on my 911. There are a few known vulnerabilities (active engine mounts for example) that are very expensive to fix - so a service at Porsche every two years is, despite the cost, is worth doing. Once out of warranty, I will probably look at independents.

OPC labour rates have certainly reached taking-the-piss levels. Last time I took my Cayenne in, the rate at Reading was £301 per hour (including "the VAT"), which is even more than I pay at a Ferrari main dealer. They're also becoming more strict about warranty exclusions, so although the c. £1100 annual warranty cost is still very attractive, the dealers seem to be putting a lot more effort into avoiding claims, and then charging for investigation work for claims they decline. Combine the insane pricing with extended lead times to book in for service work; little chance of getting a loan car unless you can book 3 months in advance; and basic work taking several elapsed days to complete, it feels like Porsche are charging a premium price for a sub-par service. It's ens ttification in action.

pete said: OPC labour rates have certainly reached taking-the-piss levels. Last time I took my Cayenne in, the rate at Reading was £301 per hour (including "the VAT"), which is even more than I pay at a Ferrari main dealer. They're also becoming more strict about warranty exclusions, so although the c. £1100 annual warranty cost is still very attractive, the dealers seem to be putting a lot more effort into avoiding claims, and then charging for investigation work for claims they decline. Combine the insane pricing with extended lead times to book in for service work; little chance of getting a loan car unless you can book 3 months in advance; and basic work taking several elapsed days to complete, it feels like Porsche are charging a premium price for a sub-par service. It's ens ttification in action. All 100% accurate. It's taken 3 months to book mine in to look at a hand that has fallen off the chronograph - a £301 charge to 'investigate' which, if it's under warranty is refundable... it's the work of 1 minute to ascertain that the hand has fallen off.

Anyone moved from an AGM battery to lithium on say a regular Cayman? Is it possible to do? I know there's a weight benefit but would expect better longevity.

^ Antigravity do a couple that I think you can just swap in, tends to be popular for the weight saving on stuff like GT4s but there have been issues reported and it's not cheap. Unless tracking would think like for like AGM replacement will be far cheaper/easier. Think they have issues in colder temps, ok for only sunny use track cars but maybe not for a daily driver.

jimbo761 said: Anyone moved from an AGM battery to lithium on say a regular Cayman? Is it possible to do? I know there's a weight benefit but would expect better longevity. Not tried but heard on the Collecting Cars podcast a chap optioned one and was told on collection from the Dealer it means the car needs to be on charge constantly otherwise after a couple days the battery will be dead. So he got a normal battery fitted and was driving round with the lightweight lithium + AGM in his car

ChrisW. said: Porsche do punch a date on one of the battery poles ... but whether anybody would notice if a (new) battery was not faulty ?? We used to stamp every battery fitted and sold, it stopped people swapping the battery for an identical but faulty one (yes, it happened) - always the first thing we checked.

NDA said: pete said: OPC labour rates have certainly reached taking-the-piss levels. Last time I took my Cayenne in, the rate at Reading was £301 per hour (including "the VAT"), which is even more than I pay at a Ferrari main dealer. They're also becoming more strict about warranty exclusions, so although the c. £1100 annual warranty cost is still very attractive, the dealers seem to be putting a lot more effort into avoiding claims, and then charging for investigation work for claims they decline. Combine the insane pricing with extended lead times to book in for service work; little chance of getting a loan car unless you can book 3 months in advance; and basic work taking several elapsed days to complete, it feels like Porsche are charging a premium price for a sub-par service. It's ens ttification in action. All 100% accurate. It's taken 3 months to book mine in to look at a hand that has fallen off the chronograph - a £301 charge to 'investigate' which, if it's under warranty is refundable... it's the work of 1 minute to ascertain that the hand has fallen off. Wow that’s shocking, if the cars under warranty! Years ago that would have been a quick pop in the opc, show the customer service advisor who would have then said don’t panic we will order a new chronograph and give you a ring once it’s in to be fitted. The are becoming an expensive mass manufacture, yet the quality of product and appears to dropping as well as their quality of customer service.

Johnson897210 said: ^ Antigravity do a couple that I think you can just swap in, tends to be popular for the weight saving on stuff like GT4s but there have been issues reported and it's not cheap. Unless tracking would think like for like AGM replacement will be far cheaper/easier. Think they have issues in colder temps, ok for only sunny use track cars but maybe not for a daily driver. I have run an Antigravity for 8 years now no issues, it's been in my 987 for ages, then my 991.2 GT3 for 4 years, then in my 997 for another 2 years. Starts 1st time and with way more cranking power than a normal battery, my 991.2 lived outside for 4 years on the drive no issues in winter and I never coded any battery ever. Better for a daily imo. 1st mod to do to save weight on any car you want to save weight in. plus a lot of people fit a ti exhaust these days, so fitting an Antigravity re balances the oem weight split on a car. 15kg out of both ends, no cheaper way to get 30kg out a car.

When my 987 needed a new battery and to keep the warranty cover my local OPC (Perth) was the cheapest I could find, one thing to mention they said that newer cars than the 987 needed coding when replacing the battery the 987 dosen't.