997.2 gt3rs - Page 5 - 911/Carrera GT - PistonHeads UK

I'll start with an apology, as I'm sure this will be a duplicate, but I cannot see how to search the forums without just ending up out at google?! I'm trying to get hold of a 997.2 gt3rs and currently there seem to be just 2 in the market (JZM and RPM). Quite a gap in price between them, some of that seems obvious (owners, prep) but some of that is less so (mileage, spec, colour). Conscious history will be pretty key, is anybody on here able to offer any insight into these 2 cars? Edited by griggsy2 on Tuesday 2nd July 12:27

If you contact both you will usually get a pretty comprehensive file of invoices etc. When I spoke to JZM about a GT3 they emailed me a file of everything they had on the car. it was really detailed, all invoices they had, service book etc.

That is quite a spread... When new the standard colour options were: Grey Black with Red decals/highlights Grey black with Wiessgold decals/highlights Aqua Blue with Red decals/highlights Aqua Blue with Wiessgold decals/highlights Carrera White with Red decals/highlights Carrera White with Wiessgold decals/highlights All of the PTS cars were fitted with black decals/highlights

Re: Carrera White with Red decals/highlights This has IMHO received quite a 'bounce' from it being a very prominent colour scheme for the latest, 992 GT3 RS. Prior to that the Grey Back with Weiss Gold, a la 'Hebe' was considered the GOAT. White with black is one of the least shouty options. If you want a car with a shouty spoiler in non-shouty colour scheme...

Thanks all, that helps I'm not going to get too hung up on the colour of the car (grey with guards red my preferred), instead I want to make sure its a good car with a solid history. Given the community is pretty small, any first-hand knowledge of these two, or any others available, would be great.

I am pretty sure the white black one was up at Autostore for £160k before it appeared at JZM. Sorry, I don't know either of the cars in question

That's helpful to know, thanks!

Digga said: Re: Carrera White with Red decals/highlights This has IMHO received quite a 'bounce' from it being a very prominent colour scheme for the latest, 992 GT3 RS. Prior to that the Grey Back with Weiss Gold, a la 'Hebe' was considered the GOAT. White with black is one of the least shouty options. If you want a car with a shouty spoiler in non-shouty colour scheme... I'm all for 'speak softly and carry a big stick' but sometimes its good to swing the shillelagh...

Nurburgsingh said: That is quite a spread... When new the standard colour options were: Grey Black with Red decals/highlights Grey black with Wiessgold decals/highlights Aqua Blue with Red decals/highlights Aqua Blue with Wiessgold decals/highlights Carrera White with Red decals/highlights Carrera White with Wiessgold decals/highlights All of the PTS cars were fitted with black decals/highlights I've never known those were the standard offerings. Interesting, thanks!

Nurburgsingh said: I'm all for 'speak softly and carry a big stick' but sometimes its good to swing the shillelagh... That’ll do nicely. OP what are you looking for, track day car or road/show?

My present 992 RS and my old 997.2 RS for comparison ...........

both lovely in their own ways, but good to see the differences.

Probably not what you're after, but there's this: https://www.top555.co.uk/stock/details/Porsche-911... I find it incredibly sad that a car such as this is just sat, not even run in. Poor thing!

Jim1556 said: Probably not what you're after, but there's this: https://www.top555.co.uk/stock/details/Porsche-911... I find it incredibly sad that a car such as this is just sat, not even run in. Poor thing! In part, my question about tracking was because it does seem the 997.2 GT3 RS is 'the chosen one'. The values in the USA for even a bog standard 997.1 GT3 are way over what we're seeing here. The 997.2 GT3 RS has already been heavily hyped in the UK, with every journo and their dog having waxed lyrical about "Hebe", but even so, as much as any motor car has potential in the twilight of internal combustion car use, these seem to be the pick. Which brings it's own problems - anything north of £150k is very expensive to think about tracking and over £200k even more so. Excess and premiums at places like Spa or the Ring mean you have to consider having the means to self insure.

Jim1556 said: Probably not what you're after, but there's this: https://www.top555.co.uk/stock/details/Porsche-911... I find it incredibly sad that a car such as this is just sat, not even run in. Poor thing! That's how I'd have ordered a 4.0: White with black interior and PCCBs. Unfortunately I was too "sensible" getting one at the time. Ended up with a 3.8 in white/red which I got second hand when they hit bottom of the market. Some consolation to the fact that I'd have preferred a white or grey one with weissgold. From a driving perspective this car remains one of the real highlights

Dr S said: Ended up with a 3.8 in white/red which I got second hand when they hit bottom of the market. I remember a grey/red one for sale at Leeds OPC for £89;995 around 10 years ago, if they'd stayed around that value I'd be aiming for one. Sadly now, they're a lottery win away...

Jim1556 said: Dr S said: Ended up with a 3.8 in white/red which I got second hand when they hit bottom of the market. I remember a grey/red one for sale at Leeds OPC for £89;995 around 10 years ago, if they'd stayed around that value I'd be aiming for one. Sadly now, they're a lottery win away... Ditto. The gap between what I;d get for my 997.1 GT3 and what it'd cost to get into a 997.2 GT3 RS is over £100k. A mate who has a 4.0 says they're not (strictly) worth it. Easy for him to say.

Jim1556 said: Probably not what you're after, but there's this: https://www.top555.co.uk/stock/details/Porsche-911... I find it incredibly sad that a car such as this is just sat, not even run in. Poor thing! There is something about the painted splitter and side skirts that just makes that look like its had a crappy Techart/gemballa/etc... kit fitted

Nurburgsingh said: There is something about the painted splitter and side skirts that just makes that look like its had a crappy Techart/gemballa/etc... kit fitted Kind of where my head is at too, but in the scale of things, an easy matter to rectify.

Cheers all, and nice to see some of your cars! To answer your question Digga, mostly road/show but probably a couple of track days if I can. Not looking to win those, rather just to let it loose and see what that feels like. Not intending on big mileage, probably 1-2k/year which I feel cars need, so not really in the market for those with a premium because they've got delivery miles, I'll change that pretty quickly. Would like a 4.0 as a 'thing' but think the 3.8 is the one I've settled on as a 'thing I can use and enjoy'. If I can find a good one at a good price.

griggsy2 said: Cheers all, and nice to see some of your cars! To answer your question Digga, mostly road/show but probably a couple of track days if I can. Not looking to win those, rather just to let it loose and see what that feels like. Not intending on big mileage, probably 1-2k/year which I feel cars need, so not really in the market for those with a premium because they've got delivery miles, I'll change that pretty quickly. Would like a 4.0 as a 'thing' but think the 3.8 is the one I've settled on as a 'thing' I can use and enjoy. If I can find a good one at a good price. I think, for your use, it's almost the perfect choice. Not that a car should ever been seen as an 'investment'. They all have the capacity to generate bills and, with the present ICE situation, no long term future is certain, but I do think these cars will continue to stand above both 991 and 992 RS models, just because. Check out prices in USA.

griggsy2 said: If I can find a good one at a good price. Everything is for sale - it's just agreeing the price, right.

Indeed, but what that buys can vary and not always obvious. i.e pulled out a ditch, crash repaired, track vs road miles, poorly maintained, not warmed up/down, etc.

griggsy2 said: Indeed, but what that buys can vary and not always obvious. i.e pulled out a ditch, crash repaired, track vs road miles, poorly maintained, not warmed up/down, etc. Add Over revs to that list...

Yep, those I can at least get a report on to give some kind of visibility

LemonTart said: griggsy2 said: Indeed, but what that buys can vary and not always obvious. i.e pulled out a ditch, crash repaired, track vs road miles, poorly maintained, not warmed up/down, etc. Add Over revs to that list... The cynic in me says it's good to see some over-revs. Means it's not been wiped.

According to Vin Tra ex of Hoonigan, 997.2 GT3 RS are selling for $300k-$400k in USA, as they only ever got 500 odd of them.

Digga said: Jim1556 said: Dr S said: Ended up with a 3.8 in white/red which I got second hand when they hit bottom of the market. I remember a grey/red one for sale at Leeds OPC for £89;995 around 10 years ago, if they'd stayed around that value I'd be aiming for one. Sadly now, they're a lottery win away... Ditto. The gap between what I;d get for my 997.1 GT3 and what it'd cost to get into a 997.2 GT3 RS is over £100k. A mate who has a 4.0 says they're not (strictly) worth it. Easy for him to say. you also can choose for a 3.8 GT3 RS 997.2 those have 450hp and way cheaper then a 4.0 but not way slower, some come up for a good price, but hen go pretty fast, others say 30-40k more same-ish car same-ish km, those take longer to sell, but are still reasonable priced compared to almost or + double that 4.0 RS

It's amazing the price difference between the 997 generation RS', I was offered a reasonable (circa 45k) mileage one for under £100k before xmas last year (I should have bought it really), and my mates orange one is available for under £120k and that's about as mint as it came out of the factory. The bigger, torquier engines definitely offer more so I see the appeal in the 3.8 but I find the purer looks of the .1 more appealing and the money saved buys a lot of adventures. I can't quite imagine a world where the 997.1 RS is so undervalued for so long but then we've been waiting for the 996 GT3 to go up for years as well.

IMHO there’s just something so pure and perfect about the lines of a nice 996 GT3.

Here is mine. Had in from new.

Digga said: IMHO there’s just something so pure and perfect about the lines of a nice 996 GT3. Agreed, I've often argued the parallels between it and the 964 RS and not just the unloved status of both for so long. It's also comfortably the smallest of the GT3s but none of them are that big (Obviously not the purest of pure this example )

GTRene said: you also can choose for a 3.8 GT3 RS 997.2 those have 450hp and way cheaper then a 4.0 but not way slower, some come up for a good price, but hen go pretty fast, others say 30-40k more same-ish car same-ish km, those take longer to sell, but are still reasonable priced compared to almost or + double that 4.0 RS A gt2 is nothing like a gt3 and no 997 gt2 will ever really be a substitute if someone wants a 7.2rs whether 4.0 or 3.8. And easy to say or not, as digga as said above (and I can't think of which dimwit might have told him that ), the 4.0 'correct' worth over the 3.8 was probably far more accurately reflected by the difference in list prices at the time than what has subsequently come about. In today's world (and unfortunately for quite a while), it is the XXX/600 plate rather for any meaningful intrinsic mechanical improvement one is paying that more than slightly ludicrous premium......

isaldiri said: A gt2 is nothing like a gt3 and no 997 gt2 will ever really be a substitute if someone wants a 7.2rs whether 4.0 or 3.8. And easy to say or not, as digga as said above (and I can't think of which dimwit might have told him that ), the 4.0 'correct' worth over the 3.8 was probably far more accurately reflected by the difference in list prices at the time than what has subsequently come about. In today's world (and unfortunately for quite a while), it is the XXX/600 plate rather for any meaningful intrinsic mechanical improvement one is paying that more than slightly ludicrous premium...... Sorry I've had a drink watching the election-I don't mean to sound confrontational but what do you mean? A 4.0 is only worth x over a 3.8 v the +/- £? If so the same could be said v the 997.1 RS?

PRO5T said: Sorry I've had a drink watching the election-I don't mean to sound confrontational but what do you mean? A 4.0 is only worth x over a 3.8 v the +/- £? If so the same could be said v the 997.1 RS? Imo, the 7.1rs is the 'weakest' rs offering vs the gt3 out of any of them. The difference between 7.1 and 7.2rs is far more justified than 7.2rs to 4.0 for me anyway.

isaldiri said: PRO5T said: Sorry I've had a drink watching the election-I don't mean to sound confrontational but what do you mean? A 4.0 is only worth x over a 3.8 v the +/- £? If so the same could be said v the 997.1 RS? Imo, the 7.1rs is the 'weakest' rs offering vs the gt3 out of any of them. The difference between 7.1 and 7.2rs is far more justified than 7.2rs to 4.0 for me anyway. Ah got you and can see where you're coming from but respectfully disagree. I won't argue the 997.1 RS is the weakest RS of them all, all the others got more special bits above the standard GT3 but the 4.0 is special personified.

PRO5T said: Ah got you and can see where you're coming from but respectfully disagree. I won't argue the 997.1 RS is the weakest RS of them all, all the others got more special bits above the standard GT3 but the 4.0 is special personified. Mainly because of the numbered plate and the claim as being the last mezger.....

isaldiri said: PRO5T said: Ah got you and can see where you're coming from but respectfully disagree. I won't argue the 997.1 RS is the weakest RS of them all, all the others got more special bits above the standard GT3 but the 4.0 is special personified. Mainly because of the numbered plate and the claim as being the last mezger..... Cup car crank. Plus the torque of a 3.8 above a 3.6-then you make it 4.0... Big difference.

PRO5T said: isaldiri said: PRO5T said: Ah got you and can see where you're coming from but respectfully disagree. I won't argue the 997.1 RS is the weakest RS of them all, all the others got more special bits above the standard GT3 but the 4.0 is special personified. Mainly because of the numbered plate and the claim as being the last mezger..... Cup car crank. Plus the torque of a 3.8 above a 3.6-then you make it 4.0... Big difference. Little touches on the 4.0, like the entire front wings being made from carbon fibre by a small firm in the UK who usually build transatlantic racing yachts. There’s a lot of little things like that.

Digga said: ittle touches on the 4.0, like the entire front wings being made from carbon fibre by a small firm in the UK who usually build transatlantic racing yachts. There’s a lot of little things like that. You've heard what I think of cf body panels right.....? Cf monocoque - great. Panels not so good as they er break. Splitters are just idiotic....

isaldiri said: Digga said: ittle touches on the 4.0, like the entire front wings being made from carbon fibre by a small firm in the UK who usually build transatlantic racing yachts. There’s a lot of little things like that. You've heard what I think of cf body panels right.....? Cf monocoque - great. Panels not so good as they er break. Splitters are just idiotic.... Cool though 'because race car'. That aside, although the arc of 997 GT3 & RS cars, from the 7.1 to the 4.0 all share the same parts manual, there's some fairly meaty differences on both the 3.8 and 4.0 7.2 RS cars: ball-jointed rear suspension variocam no only on inlet, but also exhaust valves wider track front & rear dual intake airbox A lot of these things would be possible to retro-fit, but not the variocam and engine internals.

Black and white one has FSH but only paperwork from 1 in 2020, i.e. no ability to really go through and understand much. Major service apparently in 2022 but again, not much to see. Going to spend some time with the red and white one next week which is effectively 1 owner and will have RPM prep prior to sale. Feels chunky money for +20,000 miles but hard to guage market with only 2 cars out there.

https://collectingcars.com/buy?query=GT3%20RS&... Collecting Cars auction results, difficult to pin down any up to date numbers.

Digga said: Cool though 'because race car'. That aside, although the arc of 997 GT3 & RS cars, from the 7.1 to the 4.0 all share the same parts manual, there's some fairly meaty differences on both the 3.8 and 4.0 7.2 RS cars: ball-jointed rear suspension variocam no only on inlet, but also exhaust valves wider track front & rear dual intake airbox A lot of these things would be possible to retro-fit, but not the variocam and engine internals. The 4.0 does not have a wider track vs the 3.8rs. I’m rather certain about that. The partially rose jointed rear suspension and linear springs are easily retrofittable and I’d encourage most 7.2 gt3s of any stripe to try those changes as they, to a very large degree, are responsible for the supposed ‘better handling’ of the 4.0. The major difference is the engine as you say which would be a bit of a job to get a 3.8 to 4.0 capacity. Look the engine is pretty nice of course but the 3.8 is absolutely no slouch either. Again as I said the improvement in what the engine delivers is not the major factor in the 4.0 being that much more expensive and it is the numbered plate that is the main reason. And also similarly to other cars, the supposed factor that the 4.0 has over others seems to increase as a function of its pricing. Funny that….

isaldiri said: The 4.0 does not have a wider track vs the 3.8rs. I’m rather certain about that. More I was implying the 3.8 RS and 4.0 RS have wider track than any of the other 997 GT cars.

Here’s my engines dyno sheet from when Manthey sent it to get mapped-google translate below… Look at the torque figure! Now I understand some saying the big engines change what they love about the mezger but it still revs and wails like a banshee. And this is an engine still limited by the 996’s intake set up. An official Porsche fully homolgated 4.0 must be an utterly wonderful thing to grab by the scruff of the neck in a little 997. I can accept that a whole lot of value in the 4.0 is in the limited edition status but even if they’d made thousands and thousands of them it’d still command a premium. I’d love one-Chris Harris’ old one is semi local to me (well, we use the same OPC) and I do believe it’s driven and used regularly. To heck with putting it on a pedestal or locking it away in a bubble.

isaldiri said: Digga said: Cool though 'because race car'. That aside, although the arc of 997 GT3 & RS cars, from the 7.1 to the 4.0 all share the same parts manual, there's some fairly meaty differences on both the 3.8 and 4.0 7.2 RS cars: ball-jointed rear suspension variocam no only on inlet, but also exhaust valves wider track front & rear dual intake airbox A lot of these things would be possible to retro-fit, but not the variocam and engine internals. The 4.0 does not have a wider track vs the 3.8rs. I’m rather certain about that. The partially rose jointed rear suspension and linear springs are easily retrofittable and I’d encourage most 7.2 gt3s of any stripe to try those changes as they, to a very large degree, are responsible for the supposed ‘better handling’ of the 4.0. The major difference is the engine as you say which would be a bit of a job to get a 3.8 to 4.0 capacity. Look the engine is pretty nice of course but the 3.8 is absolutely no slouch either. Again as I said the improvement in what the engine delivers is not the major factor in the 4.0 being that much more expensive and it is the numbered plate that is the main reason. And also similarly to other cars, the supposed factor that the 4.0 has over others seems to increase as a function of its pricing. Funny that…. I would say as said its the numbered plate that creates the extra shilling,the 3.8 is the better car in value.I could not tell the difference between the 3.8 and 4.0,the steering feel was still the poor feedback as ever sadly.

PRO5T said: Here’s my engines dyno sheet from when Manthey sent it to get mapped-google translate below… Look at the torque figure! Now I understand some saying the big engines change what they love about the mezger but it still revs and wails like a banshee. And this is an engine still limited by the 996’s intake set up. An official Porsche fully homolgated 4.0 must be an utterly wonderful thing to grab by the scruff of the neck in a little 997. I can accept that a whole lot of value in the 4.0 is in the limited edition status but even if they’d made thousands and thousands of them it’d still command a premium. I’d love one-Chris Harris’ old one is semi local to me (well, we use the same OPC) and I do believe it’s driven and used regularly. To heck with putting it on a pedestal or locking it away in a bubble. Ansgar Wiesen is the man Did the mapping on my K440 conversion that Manthey built.

993rsr said: Ansgar Wiesen is the man Did the mapping on my K440 conversion that Manthey built. Nice! More info needed!

PRO5T said: 993rsr said: Ansgar Wiesen is the man Did the mapping on my K440 conversion that Manthey built. Nice! More info needed! Long gone sadly. Mk1 996 GT3 in Zanzibar red, Manthey 3.9, 996 cup tranmission with an 8:32 CW&P and shorter 5th and 6th, JRZ's etc. mega thing, pic going into Pouhon. Then went to a 4.1 motor which ended up (not well) with Slippydiff who put a 997 Cup motor in it, now SRance is the custodian. Edited by 993rsr on Friday 5th July 18:33 Edited by 993rsr on Friday 5th July 18:39

993rsr said: PRO5T said: 993rsr said: Ansgar Wiesen is the man Did the mapping on my K440 conversion that Manthey built. Nice! More info needed! Long gone sadly. Mk1 996 GT3 in Zanzibar red, Manthey 3.9, 996 cup tranmission with an 8:32 CW&P and shorter 5th and 6th, JRZ's etc. mega thing, pic going into Pouhon. Then went to a 4.1 motor which ended up (not well) with Slippydiff who put a 997 Cup motor in it, now SRance is the custodian. Edited by 993rsr on Friday 5th July 18:33 Edited by 993rsr on Friday 5th July 18:39 Ah, that car! Famous on YouTube if you're researching 3.9 Manthey cars Very similar spec to mine although when Manthey rebuilt the gearbox I'm pretty certain they stuck with the standard gear ratios-cup car diff and final drive though. Bloody love this engine.

I drove all four of the 997.2RS cars ... 3.6, 3.8, 4.0 and 2RS ... the step up from the 3.6 to the 3.8 was noticeable, the step up to the 4.0 was more ... and the 2RS was just amazing, so easy to steer on the throttle. All great cars in their own way ... but the .2 did bring in a lot of valuable changes, a shame about the centre-locks IMHO ! Edited by ChrisW. on Friday 5th July 22:03

PRO5T said: .... An official Porsche fully homolgated 4.0 must be an utterly wonderful thing to grab by the scruff of the neck in a little 997. I can accept that a whole lot of value in the 4.0 is in the limited edition status but even if they’d made thousands and thousands of them it’d still command a premium. Well..... it is a nice car for sure. I simply disagree that it's extra 'specialness' is in any way fairly or reasonably reflected by current pricing over the 3.8rs and the original difference between list prices was a much fairer reflection of how much better the 4.0 actually is. And if 'thousands and thousands' of the 4.0 were made and it never carries the cachet of a numbered car, the 3.8rs would be the one with a larger premium as it would have far less production numbers.

isaldiri said: You've heard what I think of cf body panels right.....? Cf monocoque - great. Panels not so good as they er break. Splitters are just idiotic.... I’ve got a spare 4.0 front wing somewhere in the garage - in case we end up needing it

The JZM white/black car is one I owned before. It was factory delivered in that colour scheme via some exclusive options. Notice it has a white cage which none of the standard trims which Nurburgsingh listed came with. It is a high spec car - PCCBs, dynamic lights, cgt seats, lift, etc. Doesn’t have stitched/alcantara dash but does have some white trim (inc vents and centre tunnel) that set off well against the other white bits. I believe it is the only factory white/black car. There was another in the UK but that was a post delivery job with a typical black or red cage - likely reverted to its original scheme now. I really liked the JZM car in how it drove. I had a grey/red one after it - lower mileage, folding buckets, etc - but that just didn’t drive as nicely as the white one. The JZM car was a good car whilst I had it - clean no stories, warranty etc. I didn’t understand the OPs point about limited history. I find it tempting to buy again…but alas, other priorities. Plus each time I look at these I get lost in a rabbit hole of comparing 997.2 991.1 991.2 GT3s and RSs all at similar ish prices with different track performance levels! Edited by LaSource on Saturday 6th July 07:48

LaSource said: The JZM white/black car is one I owned before. It was factory delivered in that colour scheme via some exclusive options. Notice it has a white cage which none of the standard trims which Nurburgsingh listed came with. It is a high spec car - PCCBs, dynamic lights, cgt seats, lift, etc. Doesn’t have stitched/alcantara dash but does have some white trim (inc vents and centre tunnel) that set off well against the other white bits. I believe it is the only factory white/black car. There was another in the UK but that was a post delivery job with a typical black or red cage - likely reverted to its original scheme now. I really liked the JZM car in how it drove. I had a grey/red one after it - lower mileage, folding buckets, etc - but that just didn’t drive as nicely as the white one. The JZM car was a good car whilst I had it - clean no stories, warranty etc. I didn’t understand the OPs point about limited history. I find it tempting to buy again…but alas, other priorities. Plus each time I look at these I get lost in a rabbit hole of comparing 997.2 991.1 991.2 GT3s and RSs all at similar ish prices with different track performance levels! Edited by LaSource on Saturday 6th July 07:48 I did know it was yours before but I didn’t want to ‘out’ you on here. It’s interesting what you say about the difference between the two, and then also what Yellow 491 always says about his 3.8 disappointing slightly. I bet a 3.8 on a decent set of KW’s or Ohlins might be the answer I am looking for.

993rsr said: PRO5T said: 993rsr said: Ansgar Wiesen is the man Did the mapping on my K440 conversion that Manthey built. Nice! More info needed! Long gone sadly. Mk1 996 GT3 in Zanzibar red, Manthey 3.9, 996 cup tranmission with an 8:32 CW&P and shorter 5th and 6th, JRZ's etc. mega thing, pic going into Pouhon. Then went to a 4.1 motor which ended up (not well) with Slippydiff who put a 997 Cup motor in it, now SRance is the custodian. Edited by 993rsr on Friday 5th July 18:33 Edited by 993rsr on Friday 5th July 18:39 That bean can was one of the best cars i have ever just jumped into and drove when we were on that lemans track day,steering and feel was wicked,where has it all gone wrong! Digga i think that is a good starter for 10,i never modified mine at all bar geo,they still look good.

Yellow491 said: That bean can was one of the best cars i have ever just jumped into and drove when we were on that lemans track day,steering and feel was wicked,where has it all gone wrong! Like I said earlier in thread, there’s just something so pure and ‘right’ about the 996 GT3. How about the 992 GT3 though? You enjoying it so far aren’t you? Yellow491 said: Digga i think that is a good starter for 10,i never modified mine at all bar geo,they still look good. Isaldri has put better shocks on his 4.0 and reckons there’s a definite improvement.

Hi LaSource, thanks for posting! Would be great to know when you had the car and for how long and if you know any of the other owner's. Feel free to message me if easier. My point re the service records is that there is no paperwork accompanying the stamps so I can’t see what was done/replaced in addition to the normal service to build that view of history. I had a manual 430 a while back which was similar but had comfort through buying via a Ferrari dealer with 2 year warranty. I then spent some time calling around to get copies of its history sent to me.

Yellow491 said: That bean can was one of the best cars i have ever just jumped into and drove when we were on that lemans track day,steering and feel was wicked,where has it all gone wrong! Digga i think that is a good starter for 10,i never modified mine at all bar geo,they still look good. If anyone sees me at a track and wants a go, pop over and say hello-everyone should experience it once As above, Manthey 3.9 engine, JRZ remote dampers, Geo to PARR Nürburgring set up, Cup final drive, Cup diff, 4.0 clutch and Cup lightweight flywheel, Cup gearshift cables, Cup aero (body and underneath), solid engine and gearbox mounts, performance friction steel brake conversion, the list goes on… It’s currently stripped out with full cage (factory Clubsport originally) but I’m half in the mind to put the carpets back in this winter when it’s off the road and do an interior restoration-get rid of the tinted rear windows etc. It’ll still be light, all the airbags, stereo and speakers are removed and it’s just running a carbon Cup footwell board.

LaSource said: I really liked the JZM car in how it drove. I had a grey/red one after it - lower mileage, folding buckets, etc - but that just didn’t drive as nicely as the white one. You wrongly installed the higher wing that was giving me serious wing envy in the garage I suspect……

Digga said: LaSource said: The JZM white/black car is one I owned before. It was factory delivered in that colour scheme via some exclusive options. Notice it has a white cage which none of the standard trims which Nurburgsingh listed came with. It is a high spec car - PCCBs, dynamic lights, cgt seats, lift, etc. Doesn’t have stitched/alcantara dash but does have some white trim (inc vents and centre tunnel) that set off well against the other white bits. I believe it is the only factory white/black car. There was another in the UK but that was a post delivery job with a typical black or red cage - likely reverted to its original scheme now. I really liked the JZM car in how it drove. I had a grey/red one after it - lower mileage, folding buckets, etc - but that just didn’t drive as nicely as the white one. The JZM car was a good car whilst I had it - clean no stories, warranty etc. I didn’t understand the OPs point about limited history. I find it tempting to buy again…but alas, other priorities. Plus each time I look at these I get lost in a rabbit hole of comparing 997.2 991.1 991.2 GT3s and RSs all at similar ish prices with different track performance levels! Edited by LaSource on Saturday 6th July 07:48 I did know it was yours before but I didn’t want to ‘out’ you on here. It’s interesting what you say about the difference between the two, and then also what Yellow 491 always says about his 3.8 disappointing slightly. I bet a 3.8 on a decent set of KW’s or Ohlins might be the answer I am looking for. Looks brilliant in white very motorsport colour

isaldiri said: LaSource said: I really liked the JZM car in how it drove. I had a grey/red one after it - lower mileage, folding buckets, etc - but that just didn’t drive as nicely as the white one. You wrongly installed the higher wing that was giving me serious wing envy in the garage I suspect…… Hoist by his own petard.

LaSource said: The JZM white/black car is one I owned before. It was factory delivered in that colour scheme via some exclusive options. Notice it has a white cage which none of the standard trims which Nurburgsingh listed came with. It is a high spec car - PCCBs, dynamic lights, cgt seats, lift, etc. Doesn’t have stitched/alcantara dash but does have some white trim (inc vents and centre tunnel) that set off well against the other white bits. I believe it is the only factory white/black car. There was another in the UK but that was a post delivery job with a typical black or red cage - likely reverted to its original scheme now. I really liked the JZM car in how it drove. I had a grey/red one after it - lower mileage, folding buckets, etc - but that just didn’t drive as nicely as the white one. The JZM car was a good car whilst I had it - clean no stories, warranty etc. I didn’t understand the OPs point about limited history. I find it tempting to buy again…but alas, other priorities. Plus each time I look at these I get lost in a rabbit hole of comparing 997.2 991.1 991.2 GT3s and RSs all at similar ish prices with different track performance levels! Edited by LaSource on Saturday 6th July 07:48 Mates car, ordered from Cambridge OPC

Mates current car or original owner? If current, would be good to talk with him/her.

PRO5T said: Yellow491 said: That bean can was one of the best cars i have ever just jumped into and drove when we were on that lemans track day,steering and feel was wicked,where has it all gone wrong! Digga i think that is a good starter for 10,i never modified mine at all bar geo,they still look good. If anyone sees me at a track and wants a go, pop over and say hello-everyone should experience it once As above, Manthey 3.9 engine, JRZ remote dampers, Geo to PARR Nürburgring set up, Cup final drive, Cup diff, 4.0 clutch and Cup lightweight flywheel, Cup gearshift cables, Cup aero (body and underneath), solid engine and gearbox mounts, performance friction steel brake conversion, the list goes on… It’s currently stripped out with full cage (factory Clubsport originally) but I’m half in the mind to put the carpets back in this winter when it’s off the road and do an interior restoration-get rid of the tinted rear windows etc. It’ll still be light, all the airbags, stereo and speakers are removed and it’s just running a carbon Cup footwell board. Sounds perfect,dont let diga near it,he will want to buy it

griggsy2 said: Mates current car or original owner? If current, would be good to talk with him/her. No the original owner when new, sorry!

Yellow491 said: Sounds perfect,dont let diga near it,he will want to buy it Saw it already - we were on same DN day in May - beautiful car.

993rsr said: No the original owner when new, sorry!

They can prize the keys from my cold dead hand. Yellow - did you say disappointing lack of steering feel?? Seriously?!

Fl0pp3r said: They can prize the keys from my cold dead hand. Yellow - did you say disappointing lack of steering feel?? Seriously?! What a beauty

Thank you Dr Looking immaculate after its Max Protect detail. Janis used to prep all the JZM stock and has now set up just down the road from them in Kings Langley. Highly recommended!

Fl0pp3r said: They can prize the keys from my cold dead hand. Yellow - did you say disappointing lack of steering feel?? Seriously?! So I take it your not going to sell it back to me Best car I've owned.

https://collectingcars.com/for-sale/mez-38-number-... Good numberplate going tonight

griggsy2 said: Hi LaSource, thanks for posting! Would be great to know when you had the car and for how long and if you know any of the other owner's. Feel free to message me if easier. My point re the service records is that there is no paperwork accompanying the stamps so I can’t see what was done/replaced in addition to the normal service to build that view of history. I had a manual 430 a while back which was similar but had comfort through buying via a Ferrari dealer with 2 year warranty. I then spent some time calling around to get copies of its history sent to me. I would suggest a few things to look out for at that age and miles having had one for over 10 years and almost 40k miles. Check all the recalls were done in period, the service book will show you if so and there were a few. Radiators will deteriorate with age not miles, this is normal but the whole front set will probably need doing if not done. Consumables are just that and just depends where it is in the cycle. Clutches will wear regardless, the clutch fork is a weak spot and you can tell by the pedal feel. A fresh clutch will feel smooth on the pedal and heavy ish, think a mk6 golf +50%, they are heavy but should not be HEAVY. The centre locks and hubs, rightly or wrongly, were subsequently lifed by Porsche after a few incidents early doors with “track rats” across the world failing to the read the manual properly and some wheels flew off..official service intervals were 12k miles or two years, a bit light IMHO but would depend on usage which is hard to know on a used car. It will hide track use very well in fact I would go as far as to say track use with proper maintenance is a non issue on these. DEFINITELY look at an engine hours and over revs report. Make sure this look feasible on things like average mph, miles driven etc. don’t get over worried about range 1’s and the odd range 2. The engines are super strong unless you get very unlucky.

ttdan said: DEFINITELY look at an engine hours and over revs report. Make sure this look feasible on things like average mph, miles driven etc. don’t get over worried about range 1’s and the odd range 2. The engines are super strong unless you get very unlucky. Yes, as I said earlier, these things can be 'wiped' and the data needs to be looked at carefully, but also with a pinch of salt. The general consensus on over-revs is that, unless extreme, after 50 hours has passed without any issues, it is probably all fine. Over it's whole life, aside from actual upgrades - i.e. greater displacement, different air boxes, addition of variocam etc. - the Mezger from 996.1 3.6 to 997.2 4.0 changed very little. It is not like the 991.1 GT3 engine that now on 'Z2.128' update or whatever. On low miles/collectors cars, rear main seals will likely leak. A small leak will stop when engine is run up and vacuum pulls seal back into place but anything more than a tiny drop and you may need the engine out to fit a new one. Not the end of the world, but very likely on low use Mezger cars. Otherwise, there should never be any trace of oil leakage or use.

ttdan said: I would suggest a few things to look out for at that age and miles having had one for over 10 years and almost 40k miles. Check all the recalls were done in period, the service book will show you if so and there were a few. Radiators will deteriorate with age not miles, this is normal but the whole front set will probably need doing if not done. Consumables are just that and just depends where it is in the cycle. Clutches will wear regardless, the clutch fork is a weak spot and you can tell by the pedal feel. A fresh clutch will feel smooth on the pedal and heavy ish, think a mk6 golf +50%, they are heavy but should not be HEAVY. The centre locks and hubs, rightly or wrongly, were subsequently lifed by Porsche after a few incidents early doors with “track rats” across the world failing to the read the manual properly and some wheels flew off..official service intervals were 12k miles or two years, a bit light IMHO but would depend on usage which is hard to know on a used car. It will hide track use very well in fact I would go as far as to say track use with proper maintenance is a non issue on these. DEFINITELY look at an engine hours and over revs report. Make sure this look feasible on things like average mph, miles driven etc. don’t get over worried about range 1’s and the odd range 2. The engines are super strong unless you get very unlucky. Great info, thank you!

griggsy2 said: Hi LaSource, thanks for posting! Would be great to know when you had the car and for how long and if you know any of the other owner's. Feel free to message me if easier. My point re the service records is that there is no paperwork accompanying the stamps so I can’t see what was done/replaced in addition to the normal service to build that view of history. I had a manual 430 a while back which was similar but had comfort through buying via a Ferrari dealer with 2 year warranty. I then spent some time calling around to get copies of its history sent to me. I owned the White/Black one after LaSource. Bought it from JZM and sold it back to them after about 18 months from memory. Lovely car and wanted for nothing. Pretty sure I had a major service done on it at Porsche Silverstone. Of the two I have had, it was by far the nicest. They look great in white and the black decals was something a bit different. Tracked it a few times at Goodwood (and Silverstone) and it was epic. Sold it in summer 2020.

DT398 said: I owned the White/Black one after LaSource. Bought it from JZM and sold it back to them after about 18 months from memory. Lovely car and wanted for nothing. Pretty sure I had a major service done on it at Porsche Silverstone. Of the two I have had, it was by far the nicest. They look great in white and the black decals was something a bit different. Tracked it a few times at Goodwood (and Silverstone) and it was epic. Sold it in summer 2020. Top stuff, thanks for posting! Are you the one that had the JZM service pre OPC Silverstone for extending the Warranty then? 20,253 on the clock in 2020 so only covered a 1000 miles since. Says 3 former keepers so looks like 2 previous owners here and the original owner known, which might make it a contender! Nice Wisteria!

Please, someone buy it. Stop me cooking up some daft 'affordable' finance deal (Yes, I have run the figures twice.)

Yes it’s all coming back to me now. I bought it from JZM and they serviced it. Took it to Porsche for the warranty and their rules mandated a full Porsche major service to allow the warranty to go on the car as it had been serviced “outside the network” at JZM. So it had a JZM minor and then a Porsche major service in short order and a two year Porsche warranty applied maybe April 2019 ish? Yes 20k miles at the time. The only thing replaced under warranty while I had it was one of the dynamic engine mounts, that was it. Didn’t do a lot of miles in it and sold it summer 2020. I was the third keeper and the car was really clean and in great condition. I’d also be tempted to get it back but I don’t do track days any more and it would be a shame just to have it sitting. I’ve been through the whole GT3/RS thing over the years and had most of them from the 996 onwards jumping off the merry go round at the 991.2 GT3RS. If I ever went back, it would be the 7.2RS, no question. Edited by DT398 on Friday 12th July 16:00 Edited by DT398 on Friday 12th July 16:04

Top man, thanks for taking the time to reply

Apologies doesn’t help the OP, but stumbled on this thread because of the title. 997.2 GT3 RS is probably the best car I’ve ever driven in every explicable way, as a non professional driver/journalist and I’ve been fortunate to drive many comparative options. The gearbox, the engine, the poise, the steering, the noise, the feel, but all in what a package. And coming from not a proper Porsche fan. Converted dissenter.

Mine finally has TÜV again Looks like a trashcan that had a pack of dogs sleeping in it inside, but that can be rectified … I guess anyway Still late on the service though by quite a few months, something else to sort out eventually Porsche Salzburg just told me they now charge 300 euros an hour - I nearly fell off my chair, then laughed, then asked if he is kidding - nope he was not - ouch

holy bike, 300, thats a lot... way to much, but then a lawyer can be even more pricy.

DT398 said: I’ve been through the whole GT3/RS thing over the years and had most of them from the 996 onwards jumping off the merry go round at the 991.2 GT3RS. If I ever went back, it would be the 7.2RS, no question. What did you move into after you got out of RS’s ? I can’t see anything else that I want to move into that could do what an RS or other 911 does

[Image-only or quote-only post; no author-written text.] https://forums-images.pistonheads.com/172344/202407133931564?resize=720

Nurburgsingh said: What did you move into after you got out of RS’s ? I can’t see anything else that I want to move into that could do what an RS or other 911 does 458 Speciale. Just had to try one. Sold that too after about a year.

993rsr said: LaSource said: The JZM white/black car is one I owned before. It was factory delivered in that colour scheme via some exclusive options. Notice it has a white cage which none of the standard trims which Nurburgsingh listed came with. It is a high spec car - PCCBs, dynamic lights, cgt seats, lift, etc. Doesn’t have stitched/alcantara dash but does have some white trim (inc vents and centre tunnel) that set off well against the other white bits. I believe it is the only factory white/black car. There was another in the UK but that was a post delivery job with a typical black or red cage - likely reverted to its original scheme now. I really liked the JZM car in how it drove. I had a grey/red one after it - lower mileage, folding buckets, etc - but that just didn’t drive as nicely as the white one. The JZM car was a good car whilst I had it - clean no stories, warranty etc. I didn’t understand the OPs point about limited history. I find it tempting to buy again…but alas, other priorities. Plus each time I look at these I get lost in a rabbit hole of comparing 997.2 991.1 991.2 GT3s and RSs all at similar ish prices with different track performance levels! Edited by LaSource on Saturday 6th July 07:48 Mates car, ordered from Cambridge OPC Hi both! Just called Porsche Cambridge who told me the car is showing as delivered in Black from the factory. They are going off to check again but any details either of you might have on the initial build spec would be very helpful, especially your mate 993rsr given he ordered it.

griggsy2 said: 993rsr said: LaSource said: The JZM white/black car is one I owned before. It was factory delivered in that colour scheme via some exclusive options. Notice it has a white cage which none of the standard trims which Nurburgsingh listed came with. It is a high spec car - PCCBs, dynamic lights, cgt seats, lift, etc. Doesn’t have stitched/alcantara dash but does have some white trim (inc vents and centre tunnel) that set off well against the other white bits. I believe it is the only factory white/black car. There was another in the UK but that was a post delivery job with a typical black or red cage - likely reverted to its original scheme now. I really liked the JZM car in how it drove. I had a grey/red one after it - lower mileage, folding buckets, etc - but that just didn’t drive as nicely as the white one. The JZM car was a good car whilst I had it - clean no stories, warranty etc. I didn’t understand the OPs point about limited history. I find it tempting to buy again…but alas, other priorities. Plus each time I look at these I get lost in a rabbit hole of comparing 997.2 991.1 991.2 GT3s and RSs all at similar ish prices with different track performance levels! Edited by LaSource on Saturday 6th July 07:48 Mates car, ordered from Cambridge OPC Hi both! Just called Porsche Cambridge who told me the car is showing as delivered in Black from the factory. They are going off to check again but any details either of you might have on the initial build spec would be very helpful, especially your mate 993rsr given he ordered it. Nope, it was 100% white, I gave him a lift to collect it new. Saturday 27 March 2010 to be precise. https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...

Well that's clearly not black is it..

Rev report looks good to my eyes, mostly range 1, dozen in range 2, nothing 3-6. Operating hours range 1 of 488hrs and 136hrs in range 2. 'Operating hours counter' has 505hrs over 34051km which averages 67km/hr (42mph). Only odd part to me is the 'Operating hours counter' not matching the sum of the range 1&2s (624). Should it, or do the range 2s also show as range 1s so double count? EDIT: Sounds like this is the last occurrence from what I have read, so last range 2 was 136hrs ago. Edited by griggsy2 on Saturday 13th July 14:16

It will be some confusion with the black decals probably. Pretty sure the v5 said “white” when I had it!

It will be some confusion with the black decals probably. Pretty sure the v5 said “white” when I had it!

They have confirmed white with black and white cage now. Nice attention and follow up from the team at Cambridge OPC to clarify, though apologies to IMOM if this interrupted his day “I’ve spoken to the Sales Executive who supplied the car from new who has spoken to the original keeper for you.”

griggsy2 said: Rev report looks good to my eyes, mostly range 1, dozen in range 2, nothing 3-6. Operating hours range 1 of 488hrs and 136hrs in range 2. 'Operating hours counter' has 505hrs over 34051km which averages 67km/hr (42mph). Only odd part to me is the 'Operating hours counter' not matching the sum of the range 1&2s (624). Should it, or do the range 2s also show as range 1s so double count? EDIT: Sounds like this is the last occurrence from what I have read, so last range 2 was 136hrs ago. Edited by griggsy2 on Saturday 13th July 14:16 Operating hours is very different from what the rev range counts are. The latter are when they occurred so you’d expect less 2 than 1 as a rr1 has to happen before you get a rr2.

GTRene said: holy bike, 300, thats a lot... way to much, but then a lawyer can be even more pricy. I think Sam on the latest behind the glass podcast episode mentioned his 992 GT3 was making a noise and a Porsche dealer was charging him £291 an hour for diagnosis. Which would be refunded if they found an issue which would be covered under warranty.

PaulJC84 said: GTRene said: holy bike, 300, thats a lot... way to much, but then a lawyer can be even more pricy. I think Sam on the latest behind the glass podcast episode mentioned his 992 GT3 was making a noise and a Porsche dealer was charging him £291 an hour for diagnosis. Which would be refunded if they found an issue which would be covered under warranty. I believe by us in the Netherlands its cheaper, maybe 100-130 euro per hour I guess. I could not find specific Porsche hourly rate on the Porsche website, but in NL they use this guide for Porsche on dealer websites for prices, what amazed me, maintanance for the older Porsche 911 is a lot more expensive then the later ones? here you can scroll from old to knew cars https://www.porschecentrumgelderland.nl/service-pr... or here click on the model, then you go direct to the car, I wonder if those 2024 prices are the same in the UK converted to GBP?> https://www.porschecentrumgelderland.nl/service-se...

A new player has entered the game: https://www.pistonheads.com/buy/listing/17035582 Never heard of Promus but 1 owner, low mileage and grey/red. Known car?

griggsy2 said: Never heard of Promus... It's in the part of Cheshire my mate from Prestbury would call "fur coat and no knickers". HTH ETA I'm from the bit of Chshire that'd be pleased if they could even afford a coat, let alone a fur one. FWIW, you could do worse than get it inspected at/by Sports & Classic, just down the road. Edited by Digga on Friday 19th July 12:57

Digga said: t's in the part of Cheshire my mate from Prestbury would call "fur coat and no knickers". HTH ETA I'm from the bit of Chshire that'd be pleased if they could even afford a coat, let alone a fur one. FWIW, you could do worse than get it inspected at/by Sports & Classic, just down the road. Edited by Digga on Friday 19th July 12:57 Thanks, might go visit then

Geoff39GL said: Fl0pp3r said: They can prize the keys from my cold dead hand. Yellow - did you say disappointing lack of steering feel?? Seriously?! So I take it your not going to sell it back to me Best car I've owned. Geoff I’ve not forgotten about you Gonna hang onto it for a while yet I think. Will defo drop you a DM if/when. Might be my wife though, cos I might be dead!

PaulJC84 said: GTRene said: holy bike, 300, thats a lot... way to much, but then a lawyer can be even more pricy. I think Sam on the latest behind the glass podcast episode mentioned his 992 GT3 was making a noise and a Porsche dealer was charging him £291 an hour for diagnosis. Which would be refunded if they found an issue which would be covered under warranty. He's having his trousers taken down then. Car is under warranty they don't charge. I assume his car is still under warranty ? I've never had to pay for an inspection, and by coincidence I booked my Cayenne in yesterday for Service and told them it has an engine warning light on. "It'll be £250 to check that"...pointed out that despite the car having 160k miles on it it's still under warranty. "Oh yes....no charge then"

Another grey/red up at Rockhurst (Bracknell) 2 owner with 15k miles. Went too have a look, it’s immaculate, almost too clean but big pile of paperwork, all spot welds look ok, paint measures suggest no re spray, etc. That said, rev report shows zeros from 1-6 which makes me somewhat suspicious Anybody know the car, or Rockhurst? Edited by griggsy2 on Sunday 28th July 10:40

griggsy2 said: rev report shows zeros from 1-6 which makes me somewhat suspicious I don't know that particular car but my mates .1RS, that we both have driven loads on track and is now on 40k miles has no over-revs so it can happen especially on something as low mileage as what you're looking at.

Interesting, thanks. Car seems to have been on car and classics recently but ad gone. https://www.carandclassic.com/car/C1669283

997 don’t record over revs till 9000 rpm for RR1. So not uncommon to have a clear rev range on 997,s

Never heard of them. Not sure I’d spend more than kebab & chips money there. Do you have a VIN for the .2 RS we can check?

Think the vin is WP0ZZZ99ZBS780292 (current number plate correct) Which is showing up as this grey black car with 3 (now 4) former owners: https://collectingcars.com/for-sale/2010-porsche-9... He mentioned a guy going to Porsche to spray the roll bar red but made no mention of turning it to full grey red from grey black. Interior not houndstooth now either so full retrim including centre consol, original steering wheel has been put back on. 4 owners now not 2 doesn’t say much about the dealer… Still looks like it might be a nice car but will skip… Edited by griggsy2 on Sunday 28th July 22:45 Edited by griggsy2 on Sunday 28th July 22:53 Edited by griggsy2 on Sunday 28th July 22:53

Why would anyone do that to a 997?

Evening chaps, Can anybody let me know if they are looking to sell their 997.2 3RS Came extremely close to buying a .1 but I just prefer the .2 in terms of looks and styling! Feel free to DM me. Thanks