Has anyone thought about fitting a Vortex Valve to the snorkel on their Cayman? It seems like a lot of rubbish to me but my dad swears that he had a noticeable power improvement from his Lada (yes, he has a Lada). The long snorkel on the Cayman's seems like a perfect application for this - if it actually works. In case you don't knwo what a 'vortex valve' is, you can checkout the rather gimmicky-looking website at
http://www.vortexvalve.com/product_data.shtml
And shipping and handling are FREE!
It's the recip version of an IGV (inlet guide vane) that pre-swirls the intake as well as making it more laminar. It does work (in the case of an IGV to the tune of about 3% efficiency gains) on centrifugal units, but I can't say I've seen it tested on a recip.
Paul
Is this similar to the
Turbonator
? I did the desnork a while ago and thought a similar thing about the Turbonator, though I think these haev to go downstream of the air filter to have any effect.
So the Cayman is a 'recip' system? If you could elaborate, that would be great : )
A 3% power improvement would work out to roughly a 9hp gain which, given the cost, would make the vortex valve a great bargain!
ahhhh, snake oil rears its head again...
brad
Edited by - beez on 06/15/2006 11:52:38 AM
Whattaya expect? Snakes and crocs are both reptiles ...
Yes, yes, but shipping is FREE!
Recip = reciprocating.
Yes, it does work on a centrifugal (same theory) by pre-swirling the air prior to hitting the impeller. So, I'm assuming this gadget is doing something similar in using the intake air and doing work with it (which makes the charge air more efficient) to better fill the cylinder.
However, I've never seen test data for a reciprocating version. On the centrifugals, IGV's are30 year-old technology, so it is well-proven. I'd assume that it 'could' work for a recip....butagain, we'd need to see the data.
Paul
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Who in the hell would put something that el cheapo on their Cayman?/fckeditor/editor/images/smiley/MWPX/crazy.gif You gotta be kidding me? And just where would the jiffy pop contraption fit? But wait, it's 110% guaranteed. -sjd
Interesting..... I have never seen either the Turbonator or Vortexvalve before. They are basically the same product. The Vortexvalve site basically gives a BS explanation of the fluid dynamics of it while they mix in true statements of the measured results from emisions tests. The turbonator site at least has a resonable attempt at explaining the fluid dynamics, although I'm not sure I buy all of it:
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The Turbonator’s airflow dynamic is designed to improve your vehicle’s air intake system in two ways. First, by creating a more efficient airflow path throughout the intake hose, air reaches your engine with greater momentum. As air travels through an intake it bounces around bends and elbows in the hose causing it to slow down. Spinning air is less susceptible to these abrupt changes in direction.
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Secondly, once this redirected air reaches the engine, it produces a swirling, fast burn effect in the combustion chamber to create finer particles of atomized fuel, allowing better flame propagation and more complete combustion. The swirling air has longer residence time with fuel than flat air. Since the air spins through the fuel rather than just shooting through in a straight line, it spends more time mixing with the gasoline in your engine.
Their first claim as to creating a more efficient air path through the intake sounds plausible, and I'm sure lots of you reading it believe it because of that. I once had a similar idea in a flow aplication and was proved wrong through a careful finite element analysis (FEA) of the situation. In actuality, by pushing the air in a direction not along the flow path, ie. making it swirl, you take away some of the forward momentum and turn it into angular momentum. This can only INCREASE the pressure drop of the system, making it more resistant to air flow.
The second claim I certainly believe, though. You would definitely get better mixing of the air and fuel which would certainly increase combustion efficiency, resulting in fewer unburned hydrocarbons and oxides of nitrogen (NOx). Indeed both sites claim to significantly reduce emisions and even prove it by showing results.
As for increasing fuel efficiency, that is probably also true to some extent, but not necessarily for the reasons they say. It's also possible that the gain is due to some other inefficiency in the engine like dirty fuel injectors that no longer properly atomize the fuel into the air. I would bet if you put this on a new car with a clean, well designed intake system, you would see very little increase in fuel economy or horsepower. Maybe better emissions, but most cars today have pretty good emissions already.
I predict it would have no effect or a slightly worse effect on power if you put one of these things in the intake snorkel. The only thing it would do for sure there is cause turbulence, and hence a larger pressure drop. But as always, these are just my opinions based on my experiences with fluid dynamics and engines (although turbines). These things are cheap and easy to install, so why not try it and tell us if you think it makes a difference. Or better yet, do a dyno run before and after. And do a milage test of course. Let the discussion continue! ...... Craig
craig sorry dont mean to hijack this thread but i have been trying to get some kind of feedback on fitting the side pods as per the strosek car as well as the de snork ,do you think that this will inrease hp ?i know this is slightly off topic but you seem to know a thing or two about this .
Hi raysman. Check out my post on the 'Air intake mod- 13 RWHP gain' topic, page 11 right after your post from 06/08. I gave a more complete thought there, but short answer is yes, I believe side scoops would increase horsepower when the car is moving. Craig
Sorry, hijacking this thread again briefly..... raysman, I said all those things without having looked at the Strosek car, which now I have. The 'scoops' they have on the side do not stick out very far away from the car, and therefore probably would not grab too much air when the car is in motion. I could see them adding a little bit maybe but probably not as much as taking out the plate. They do look cool I must admit, though. If you were to add scoops that stuck out say 5', that would add a significant amount of pressure to the intake. Also, if your interested in adding them, why not pose your question directly to Strosek? After reading their website and notes about dyno testing in general, I believe they know what they're doing. Craig
