Engine Failure Recap - 2007 Cayman S

Instead of hijacking someone elses post I am posting the recap of my recent engine failure as a new thread. I've read quite a few peoples's experiences and opinions on engine failures due to oil starvation so I take opinions with caution. The one person I have lot's of faith in is my indy, Roger, who has been repairing Porsches for over 30 years, built Porsche race cars, and keeps steady work rebuilding these M96 & M97 engines from a variety of failures. My bad week began last Saturday when my neighbor kindly backed into my beautiful car I had only owned for seven weeks. I spent time with her insurance adjuster and a body shop to get estimates that will encompass replacing the bumper and some associated brackets behind it, replacing the head light assembly, repairing the slightly buckled fender and putting on a new clear bra. So, my week already had started off on a bad foot. Then Wednesday I took it to Roger for my pre DE safety inspection. He always checks the water pumps because of their known issues so of course mine was bad. It was pretty obvious as the pully was rocking with the bearing wearing out. It was the original water pump on my 70,000 mile CS. $1400 later for the water pump and LN Engineering low temp thermostat and housing the car was ready for it's debut at the track on Thursday. The previous two weeks saw me replacing all the filters, plugs, belt, brake flush with Motul 600 fluid, race pads put on, and oil topped off so I had confidence the car was ready to go. Drove to the track on my street tires and all was good. Engine purred the trip out and everything was normal. Upon arrival I put on my track wheels/ tires , Toyo R888's on OZ Allegeritta's which I hauled there on my roof. The track was NJMP (New Jersey Motorsports Park) on the Lightning circuit. This track has a huge 180deg right hand sweeper that can easily rack up the G's called the Lightbulb. The first two laps were under a yellow flag so I wasn't really pushing too hard. The third lap after the Lightbulb then down the straightaway my check engine light came on at around 125mph in 5th gear. No overrevs. The engine seemed to be running smoothly but hard to tell. I slowed down a little and after the next four turns I got a low oil pressure warning momentarily then back to check engine. I immediately pulled off the track into the infield. Just as I left the track the engine quit. I rolled to a stop well clear of the track and tried starting the engine. It started right up but was a little rough and the check engine light was on so I turned it right off and decided to wait for a tow back to the paddock. My engine temps were normal...about 175 and oil temp was good. Outside temp was about 85deg. Back at the paddock I let the car sit for an hour or so to let it cool down. It started right up with no check engine light and it ran smoothly. I drove it around then the check engine light came back on there was a distinct roughness from what felt like a miss. Shut her down and called Roger. He wanted to get the codes, his initial thought was a cam sensor went bad or a coil pack gave out but wanted to be sure. There is a Porsche mechanic that frequents the track who I was able to get over with a Durametric tool. His verdict was two bad cylinders from oil starvation. He says it happens all the time at that track with Caymans because of the lightbulb. Stupid me never considered putting the deep sump on prior although it was in the plans to eventually get done. The car is now at Roger's shop and needs to be rebuilt. Fortunately it was caught in time that he doesn't think the crank shaft is damaged but won't know for sure until it comes out. It will be a while though, there are three other M97 engines in front of me for rebuilds. I'm still considering options. First is to put in a salvage engine. If I do that he has strongly recommended the car never be tracked with that engine even with a deep sump. He showed me parts he's pulled out of other M96 and M97 engines that even to my novice eye look like crap. Cheap plastic paddle arms, bent connecting rods, scorred pistons, d-chunked stock sleeves, etc. He has seen too many of these stock engines blow up not only from the track but just driving around town. The second option is to rebuild my engine using better quality parts, much from LN Engineering , Nickies, up it to a 3.6L, billet paddles, Carrillo pistons, rings and rods, polish, valve job, deep sump, IMS Solution upgrade, LN screw on oil filter, and some other goodies to make it more track durable for a few thousand $$ more. So, I think I deserve to rant a little now. These engines are garbage. Porsche cut corners and put in crappy parts, didn't fully test out problems, and now doesn't back up their mistakes. Even the IMS suit had a rediculous outcome that doesn't help the many people that had IMS bearing failures blow up their engines. The whole fuel starvation issue seems like it should have been an obvious potential issue. Inferior alloy used for the cylinder sleeves. I'm sure the folks in Stuttgart are laughing their butts off at us as they take our money with no remorse for their poor engineering work. They should be ashamed of themselves. Ok, rant over, I feel a little better now. I hope that someone can use my expereince to make an informed decision on tracking their car. If nothing else, at least add the deep sump and be sure your oil level is topped off.

sorry to hear about your situation! I decided long ago that I'll keep street tires on my car whenever I do any closed course driving. If I should ever have an engine failure you better believe I'll be getting it rebuilt to a 3.6.

Followed you here from other thread! Sorry to hear what happened, shitty situation but definitely can serve to remind people to not go on R-compound tires without resolving the oil system issues. I chose to put an extended sump with X51 baffle even though im running on street tires , makes me sleep a bit better. Please keep us posted on what you end up doing. Just throwing this out there...but ive heard people can fit 996 turbo motors into these

Disconcerting to hear this on an '07. Seems to always be the '06's that fail. I always had a theory that Porsche secretly discovered an issue on the '06's and updated the design resulting in a lower percentage of '07 and '08 with engine failure, but maybe there are just a lot more '06 cars and that's why. I have an '07 with x51 baffled oil pan but no other oil mods. I run street tires but wish I could run R comps. I'm always a little concerned about engine failure but the car has about 30 track days and no engine issues to date. I've pretty much accepted that there is a risk that I'll have to do a rebuild at some point, but would be pissed if it happened. Some people sell their 987.1 's to upgrade to 987.2 due to these engine issues, but I think I'd wind up with a better car than a 987.2 for similar money if I did an upgrade/rebuild compared to preemptively selling mine and buying a 987.2 , so that will be my plan if it happens. Good luck with your build.

Thanks for taking the time to provide such a detailed explanation of what happened. I'm sorry to hear the final diagnosis was terminal. Thanks for starting this new thread, please continue to provide updates here with any new info you get, and what route you eventually decide to take going forward!

I re-read your synopsis, and it still doesn't add up for me. I 100% believe that your account is accurate...I just can't wrap my brain around how the motor could let go on the 1st green flag lap of the first session. Your oil and coolant would just be getting up to temp, so over-heated/over-thinned oil was definitely not the issue. Yes, you were running race rubber, but I would argue that the tires were barely up to temp and you probably weren't capable of much more grip than a decent street tire. Given that your low oil pressure light flickered on/off, along with a check engine light, I'm wondering if you experienced one of the following: - An AOS failure that caused oil ingestion, or - An oil-pump failure that caused low oil pressure, causing engine failure It totally stinks that you're confronted with this rebuild...but from what you've described here this doesn't sound like the typical M97 engine failure at a track saga. It sounds more like some component in the engine failed, caused low oil pressure/starvation, and then the engine failed. Keep us posted, Matt

Thanks all for the condolances. It has been a while since I have had a good nights sleep. I hope to never have to do the same for anyone else but, alas, I know there will be more failures to come. Matt, I am in agreement with you that there may be another cause of the failure. I just can't wrap my head around a high oil temp thinning the oil as there just wasn't enough stress or time on track to cause it. I'm sure the G's contributed to perhaps a hidden condition and was just the catalyst to bring on the failure. The more I study the M96 engine the more concerned I get that some are lucky and others of us are a rising statistic experiencing a myriad of internal issues. The more I read the more I am amazed at the low quality levels of parts Porsche used in these engines. The Flat 5 Innovations site was a real eye opener. I'm leaning toward an engine rebuild as opposed to dropping in a salvage engine, my trust in stock Porsche internal componenets is about down to zero. If so I'll be all eyes and ears on what is found on the engine teardown. I'll keep everyone informed.

I just think that if you track an M96 - M97 its going to blow eventually, unless you do extensive modifications. My experience M96 2003 Boxster tracked, engine replacement at 23k by Porsche . IMS about to fail. Detected while investigating rear main seal leak. M97 engine CS, not tracked by me traded in, detonated at Sebring racetrack by purchaser. So essentially all engines M96 and 97, I have owned failed as a result of taking the car to the track, without any modifications. CTLS N920CT. Cheers

First off I am so sorry for the troubles and stress that you are having. It's a fear that is always in the back of your mind if you track a 987.1 . It is ridiculous how the 987.1 is not a suitable track car. As you stated you are left with the choice of a superior rebuild, used engine replacement and or replacing your car with a 987.2 . You will have to add up all the costs of the rebuild with Carillo rods etc and the cost to address the oil starvation, additional oil pick ups,extended sump, and Motorsports AOS etc. At that point you can make a clear decision. Just don't jump right in before considering the cost versus buying a 987.2 which have come down in price. Good luck with all.

Sorry to hear of your Cayman troubles and I agree Porsche should be ashamed, embarrassed and held accountable, but they are not. I mean how else are they going to maintain their status as the highest profit per vehicle if they do the right thing? 987.1 's have IMS issues (I know, I know the failure rate is small according to some on Porsche forums), oil starvation problems and shifter linkage challenges (my PC term for piss-poor design). Your problems and others only reinforces my inclination to go 987.2 with PDK even if it means waiting a few months. Good luck to the OP. Eddie

I feel your pain and share your frustration. After 100k of street miles and ~20 autocross events, the engine in my '06 let go in a big way on the second lap of the second session of the first DE I attended with it. Contrary to what many people claim, I don't think running real street tires would have saved you, as I was still on my daily-driver tires (Continental DWs) because the track was still wet from the rain the night before and having never driven it before, I decided to take it easy for the first session or two. Oh, and unlike you, I had no warning whatsoever ... it was running smoothly and pulling strongly, right up until it made a loud, blatty noise and started billowing clouds of oil and coolant smoke from the tailpipes. I ultimately elected to install a used engine and am seriously considering selling the car once I finish the swap, as I don't think I'll dare to ever take it on a track again. In fact, I doubt I will ever autocross it again, either, as once burned, twice shy... It's a shame, too, because I really like it overall. It handles great, works well as a daily-driver, is easy to work on (at least everything I've done to it so far, including R&R'ing the transmission to replace the clutch and flywheel, refreshing the suspension at all four corners, and dropping the engine) and has been a pleasure to drive. But I'm on a tight budget these days and I'm not sure I can stomach the risk of suffering another costly mechanical failure ... we'll see.

Well crap, that kind of sums up my thoughts of the day. I'd been contemplating getting a 987.1 for near $10k less than a 987.2 with pdk . Thinking I'd be saving myself $10k, but my luck is this. If it can happen it WILL happen.

I guess I don't see a failed engine in a car that has 100,000 miles with countless DEs / autocrosses a huge failure...

UPDATE FINALLY! My car is back on the road and my bank account is $26K lower. Yup, your read it right, $26K. The car looks and drives great. I'm now working on breaking in the engine on break-in oil and attempting to get the full break-in done before heading off to VIR next month. There were many problems found in the engine after teardown so it was more than just the spun #6 bearing plus I added a few mods to help lower the chances of destroying the engine again. A previous owner obviously had abused the engine. Upon engine teardown we found the crankshaft not in pristine condition so that was sent out to a shop that specializes in Porsche and race car crank refurbishiment. This was $2000 of the tab. There is also something else that no one has spoken about and is apparently a huge problem with the M97 engine and that is the valve guides are too short and wear prematurely. The valves were incredibly sloppy in the guides so they all had to be replaced. Porsche does not sell valve guides so thanks to another poster we found a shop that makes them then they have to be custom honed. Along with that I had a full head job done, valves resurfaced and seats cut which all added another $1050 to the rebuild. The crankcase looked good and was sent to LN Engineering so they could perform their magic with resleeving with 3.8L Nickies plus they throw in JE pistons and rings. We switched out the rods to Carillos, added LN IMS bearing retrofit, billet tensioner padle, oil pump drive, filter adapter, billet micron reusable filter, and their 3.8L modified head gasket. ARP head and carrier bolts. All new chains, guides, bearings, and all hardware. I put in a new clutch and unfortunately the flywheel had a deep score in it plus burn marks so it needed to be replaced, add another $1006. No way I screwed up the flywheel, I only had the car for 7 weeks/500 or so miles and I'm not one to abuse clutches so it had to have been from the previous owner. I remembered there was some minor chatter but just thought it was the clutch needing to be replaced. Other additions included the Mantis 2L deep sump, center radiator along with a grill to put in front of it for protection. Unfortuantely with the bill hitting the flight levels I had to make a decision to hold off on the Motorsports AOS. I'll save that until my bank account gets another infusion of cash. The stock one is only $90 so if I have to replace it, I'll live. Hopefully I can get the expensive one on later this year. Not included in the above I added the LED light bar while the car was at the body shop. One week before I blew the engine my neighbor was kind enough to back into my parked car. While the LED bar came out of my pocket her insurance company picked up the tab for a new bumper, fender, chemical stripping and repainting of the entire front end and a new clear bra. The body shop put on the center radiator while they had the front end off the car and only charged me one hour to install it. Future performance mods on the wish list: Installing the PSS9's I purchased used (they should go back to Bilstein first for a refurb), plenum & throttle body and of course the Motorpsorts AOS. So guys, what do I now refer to my car as with the 3.8L since GT4 is already taken? I was thinking Cayman S8 or perhaps leave it be as a stealth car. Gotta go now, time for a joy drive to get my daily Caymin grin before the snow comes.

Wow! Thanks for sharing!

So, for 27k you now have a Cayman with a purpose built 3.8 track motor, and a new clutch/flywheel? I guess given that context it seems slightly, somewhat reasonable. How does it run around town? Any dyno/perf numbers? What are the expectations? I really like the idea of the Flat 6 stage 1 street perf engine. I'm sure the price is steep though.

If you're going back to the track I'd *strongly* suggest an accusump, and mantis gen 2 oil pan. My $28K LN rebuild is sitting in my garage on the floor after slowly working up to a quart of oil every 200 miles. I don't drive the Cayman on the track any more and my current engine is a used one out of a crashed boxster . it doesn't use a drop of oil. mmmv, -PM.

Eventually the accusump and a power steering line cooler is in the plans but probably not until next year. The deep sump is the Mantis 2nd gen 2L so I've got that covered. The car drives really well. Smooth and strong with nice street manners. My engine builder was very tedious and did a great job. His 30 years of Porsche experience plus having been a racer he put his best effort into it. No dyno numbers, perhaps I'll check it one day. I'd hate to guess at the number but it is certainly higher than it was. Once the rpm's hit 3K it takes off like an F15 on afterburners.

Any idea why?

RV4Flyer, I hope it works out for you on the track. Let us know how it goes. I have an '06 and after reading all about the IMS and oil starvation issues, I have to put a plan in place in case something like this happens. Good luck! -Moto

My 08 CS blew up on the second lap on Laguna Seca a few months ago. Have all sorts of metal in the oil pan, dropping engine next week. Was your upgraded rebuilt worth it? I was thinking of the exact same build but I see you upgraded to a 2014 Cayman so maybe I shouldn’t do it 🤣. I just sold my SR22T, perhaps going LSA next. thanks

Startemp- Check the date of the previous post, 2015! Yes you can get a rebuilt done, but a Canadian member had a similar incident and used a junkyard motor. Here is his thread. fnel1771 www.planet-9.com

Yes, thanks. I know it was an old thread but it seems like RV4flyer is still active. A Junk yard motor is 10k and you don’t know what you are getting so I thought to rebuild mine would be a better option. Just deciding to rebuild stock or is it worth the extra cash to do the performance mods. Have fun at the track!

The longivity of ownership is what determines how many dollars go into the engine. If you are fully committed to keeping the car, I would opt for the 400 hp version as you can use the additional HP a lot especially if you have a good LSD .

How do I get the 400hp? I believe the 3.4 to 3.8 upgraded gets you less than that. Thanks