Cayman GT4 - Page 2 - Boxster/Cayman - PistonHeads UK

This will get Cayman fans excited. PH gets a mention. http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/Secret-new-cars/Searc...

The new, be-winged 2015 Porsche Cayman GT4 coupe has been caught testing near the Nurburgring in Germany by CAR magazine's spy photographers. It's a major change for the Porsche Cayman sports car: the GT4 is due to become the first factory-finished turbocharged Cayman in the model's eight-year history and it's the first roadgoing Porsche expected to deploy the GT4 badge. Following in the footsteps of the Cayman R - and then some - the forced-induction Cayman GT4 is bound to raise questions with enthusiasts, who are already fretting over the revvy nature of its turbocharged flat-six in forums such as Pistonheads. CAR understands the engine powering the GT4 is the company's 3.8-litre twin-turbo boxer six, tuned to develop around 450bhp.

I very much doubt it will be a turbo flat 6. Either flat 6 or turbo flat 4 and nowhere near 450bhp imho. However, if true, put me down for one in Guards Red.

old news, old shots and guess work regarding engine ! but I very much doubt a 3.8 twin turbo in it lol. 2.5 turbo or a 3.8 NA lump maybe.

The rumored starting price (no options) is $120,000 USD according to MotorTrend's Johnny Lieberman. For comparison, a Cayman GTS is $75,000 USD. That is Carrera 4S with PowerKit money, and only $10,000 USD shy of a 911 GT3. 3.8L bi-turbo making 450HP is certainly plausible. That's 996 Turbo S power output (which made about 460lb-ft of torque as well). If it's still RWD, and weight is kept to within 50kg of the Cayman GTS, it would be absolutely nuts. Power to weight ratio would be lower than a GT3, but it'd also have a mountain more torque. We'll find out next year, I would assume at Geneva. I doubt many GTS buyers would switch, as the cost to "move up" would be brutal. Running costs won't be cheap either. Plus it's not as every day as a GTS. For me, I've already ruled it out.

Will be so disappointed if this is a turbo.

As above. NA every time for me. And as Goofnik says if the cost to change is such a chunk, a GTS would be perfectly good enough. Or a Lotus Exige Cup *ducks and runs for cover* You're welcome!

Whilst it being a turbo would utterly ruin it for me, I'm not in the market for this car anyway. For Porsche maybe it would be a way to test the market reaction to a GT line turbo...

Would prefer NA but I will be very, very interested in a new one of these if/ when they are released as 2015 was new sportscar buying year! Will follow this thread with interest It certainly looks good in those pictures

anonymous said: [redacted] Beats me. Ask 996 Turbo S owners what the point of their car was. The big point would be a drastically different power delivery characteristic. A GTS produces a peak of 280lb-ft. The 996 Turbo S produced 457lb-ft. Imagine an RWD Cayman with that much torque (and possibly with rear-wheel steering). Would be a VERY interesting car.

and it's not going to happen. be the 2.5 turbo lump at about 380bhp or the 3.8 NA lump at about the same. There is no way Porsche are going to give a Cayman over 400BHp imo. They might have Kers lag fill on the turbo though to show off the new tech.

I've got a deposit down for one of these should the media predictions become a reality. the idea of a Cayman on a diet with more power and a race honed chassis (the initial reports are that it'll be homologated for competition) rather appeals, as the 911 gets fatter and more tech laden.

I doubt you have a deposit down on one the cars not confirmed :-) once spec and price is confirmed Porsche will start wanting 10k deposits.

Is this going to be released as a homologation car for the FIA GT4 series? (amateur drivers, prepped track day level cars) Are Porsche going to try and increase their customer motorsports revenue stream off the back of this car or are they just using the name of the series that sits below GT3 in the FIA system? Porsche already tried to push the Cayman in this and had them homologated for the GT4 series (its converted via a purchased add on kit) however no one was using it and it was replaced by first a street GT3 and then by a downgrade package for early Cups. In spite of this Porsche have no real exposure so far in this series. If the plan is to try to increase cars running in this series then a look at the cars that are homologated makes for interesting reading (in terms of what this cayman GT4 if it appears will be like) given that the series runs balance of power. Approx weight and power: BMW M3 GT4: 1380kg, 420hp Aston Martin Vantage GT4: 1350kg, 420hp Ginetta G50 GT4: 945kg, 340hp Lotus Evora GT4: 1200kg, 360hp Ford Mustang FR500GT4; 1360kg , 420hp The Toyota GT86 GT4 has also been homologated but I haven't seen a weight for this yet.

mrdemon said: I doubt you have a deposit down on one the cars not confirmed :-) once spec and price is confirmed Porsche will start wanting 10k deposits. ah you calling me a liar ? my local OPC had 2 'letters of intent' already, and 1 deposit, so i was the 2nd customer leaving a deposit which will guarantee me a car. all this is refundable if i don't like the spec of the car when announced, or indeed if it's never actually built. next i suppose you'll want me to send you the 'kin paperwork ?

In that case it's going to need at least 400bhp. Hold out hope for an exhaust note to match that anticipation.

fioran0 said: Is this going to be released as a homologation car for the FIA GT4 series? (amateur drivers, prepped track day level cars) Are Porsche going to try and increase their customer motorsports revenue stream off the back of this car or are they just using the name of the series that sits below GT3 in the FIA system? Porsche already tried to push the Cayman in this and had them homologated for the GT4 series (its converted via a purchased add on kit) however no one was using it and it was replaced by first a street GT3 and then by a downgrade package for early Cups. In spite of this Porsche have no real exposure so far in this series. If the plan is to try to increase cars running in this series then a look at the cars that are homologated makes for interesting reading (in terms of what this cayman GT4 if it appears will be like) given that the series runs balance of power. Approx weight and power: BMW M3 GT4: 1380kg, 420hp Aston Martin Vantage GT4: 1350kg, 420hp Ginetta G50 GT4: 945kg, 340hp Lotus Evora GT4: 1200kg, 360hp Ford Mustang FR500GT4; 1360kg , 420hp The Toyota GT86 GT4 has also been homologated but I haven't seen a weight for this yet. Very interesting reading, thanks for posting. If Porsche do go down this route then the figure of 400bhp would be about right. Lots of different engines in that GT4 line up too from NA V8 to Turbo 4

There was the rumour of the Super 8 that one of the Porsche big wigs was running around in. Could there be 8 cylinders in the GT4? Could this be the mooted "916"?

ill settle for your bank details, pin number and security code if thats ok Seawise? Will this GT4 be a limited run or will OPC's get demo cars? Or do you have to be in the know to get a TD before making up your mind?

seawise said: mrdemon said: I doubt you have a deposit down on one the cars not confirmed :-) once spec and price is confirmed Porsche will start wanting 10k deposits. ah you calling me a liar ? my local OPC had 2 'letters of intent' already, and 1 deposit, so i was the 2nd customer leaving a deposit which will guarantee me a car. all this is refundable if i don't like the spec of the car when announced, or indeed if it's never actually built. next i suppose you'll want me to send you the 'kin paperwork ? I spoke to Portsmouth OPC and they confirmed 2 deposits on a GT 4. Fully refundable, of course.

mrdemon said: be the 2.5 turbo lump at about 380bhp or the 3.8 NA lump at about the same. There is no way Porsche are going to give a Cayman over 400BHp imo. They might have Kers lag fill on the turbo though to show off the new tech. I think that is is spot on - and makes absolute sense. ERS Torque fill McLaren P1 style. Would be a perfect demonstration and translation of the LMP1 919 Car technology applied to the road. This is the reason why Porsche decided against F1 and went LMP1 - because the technology is more relevant and more direct applicable to the real world. I, for one would absolutely love that.

Could they go for the V4 turbo from the 919 with a bit of ERS tech?

VladD said: Could they go for the V4 turbo from the 919 with a bit of ERS tech? Motorsport derived/inspired. As seems to be a growing trend now, if they put the 'Hot in the V' then it could work as packaging will be tight and tidy. Cooling solution would need to be COMPREHENSIVE and we haven't seen much in the way of bodywork changes from the spy shots to cater for extra cooling inlets and outlets. Sounding more and more like a bigger N/A Edited by TDT on Friday 4th July 12:19 Edited by TDT on Friday 4th July 12:19

seawise said: I've got a deposit down for one of these should the media predictions become a reality. the idea of a Cayman on a diet with more power and a race honed chassis (the initial reports are that it'll be homologated for competition) rather appeals, as the 911 gets fatter and more tech laden. Agreed - I still haven't committed actual cash but my LOIs been with them for a while now. Fiorano - I was at the PEC on Wednesday trying out the new Cayman GTS (very nice car). One of the instructors suggested that Porsche is looking to enter GT4, so will need to homologate somethinga apparently (I've no idea how the rules work) - Cayman GT4 is what he believed they would be building but was very non-committal beyond "something is being worked on".

Thanks J-P. Thats interesting to hear. One hopes that this is going to be the case and its not just another name grabbed from racing that has no relevance to the actual car situation. V8KSN/Olber. Indeed, I would say that 420hp range would be more likely needed looking at that list versus weights. Given GT4 regs a cayman race prepped would be up in the 13XXkg weight bracket. Does anyone think this car (if it is for GT4 class) will finally see some proper rear suspension design added to the platform?

fioran0 said: Does anyone think this car (if it is for GT4 class) will finally see some proper rear suspension design added to the platform? If Porsche DO make this car then they will have to diffrentiate it from the 991 GT3 and make it ....how do I say this.... less technologically advanced as they will want people to buy the all-singing, all-dancing 991 GT3 with its RWS etc. It could be a really good car if its a manual, NA 450HP with passive suspension. Marketing could pitch it as a GT3 'wannabe' so the accountants are happy.

With turbo technology advancing as much as it is, is that argument for NA and against turbo quite as valid as it used to be?

anonymous said: [redacted] Are you talking from a power delivery perspective or from a lag standpoint, or both?

V8KSN, I was meaning multilink rear suspension (or double wishbones) instead of the current strut design setup. I hadn't even progressed as far as the idea as to whether they may fit RWS but since it seems to be going onto everything its an interesting point you raise. Constantly poor Cayman sales, A potential tap in to an as yet un exploited customer motorsports stream. Those two would seem to be enough to make the car worth a punt from Porsche, I guess time will tell if its the case and howe serious they actually are with it.

anonymous said: [redacted] OK, understood.

anonymous said: [redacted] Mmm, not convinced.......drove the latest M3 M4( out of interest only).....lag virtually non existent and reasonably linear power delivery too. Appears lots of the new age M3 salivators actually prefer this green engine to the E90 92 fossil guzzling V8 screamers (which incidentally some appear to be recently exploding BTW) Biggest problem with the new turbo substitutes is how they sound.....and no matter how much 'authentic' superficial piped induction engine noise is cabin fed, the general consensus is it sounds s it.....

The thing that makes me say 400hp rather than 450hp is the lack of blistered arches. As the car will probably run with the gt3 centre locks the car would surely need wider arches to take 305 rubber, centre locks or not. Can't see them placing 450hp into the car with 275 section tyres.

seawise said: ah you calling me a liar ? my local OPC had 2 'letters of intent' already, and 1 deposit, so i was the 2nd customer leaving a deposit which will guarantee me a car. all this is refundable if i don't like the spec of the car when announced, or indeed if it's never actually built. next i suppose you'll want me to send you the 'kin paperwork ? nope but there is no need to give money to OPC's to secure a car atm, I have a 'letter of intent' and that's good enough to get me a car, you normally leave a deposit when the car is a real car which is normally 6 months before you can even order one. So why leave a deposit ?

fioran0 said: Thanks J-P. Thats interesting to hear. One hopes that this is going to be the case and its not just another name grabbed from racing that has no relevance to the actual car situation. V8KSN/Olber. Indeed, I would say that 420hp range would be more likely needed looking at that list versus weights. Given GT4 regs a cayman race prepped would be up in the 13XXkg weight bracket. Does anyone think this car (if it is for GT4 class) will finally see some proper rear suspension design added to the platform? No worries - I'm hoping it's going to be a properly lightweight Porsche Motorsport special and not some pointless marketing exercise. If it's the latter, I'll pass! Rumour has it that it will be a 3.8 engine with around 380 to 400bhp. Awesome if true but undoubtedly expensive!

mrdemon said: nope but there is no need to give money to OPC's to secure a car atm, I have a 'letter of intent' and that's good enough to get me a car, you normally leave a deposit when the car is a real car which is normally 6 months before you can even order one. So why leave a deposit ? Me2 ... Letter of Intent and no deposit. But I'm very excited by this. The car should surely be under 1300Kg's ?? I can't understand why everybody gets hung up by noise. It doesn't mean fast, and it does compromise circuit options.

With the GT3 going flappy paddle and super technical with RWS etc it'd be awesome to think they will produce an analogue, manual, lightweight pseudo racer with a high revving NA. 4 pot turbo pdk it is then.

I really hope Porsche do make this car with a manual gearbox,NA 450 HP engine and no RWS or other nonsense electronics. It would be a great drivers car with a mid-engine configuration and a relatively small footprint.

av185 said: Biggest problem with the new turbo substitutes is how they sound.....and no matter how much 'authentic' superficial piped induction engine noise is cabin fed, the general consensus is it sounds s it..... My Boxster has been turbo charged and was described by 991 & Porsche World quite positively. "Predictably, the first thing you notice with this car is the noise. Quite simply, it makes one of the very best noises I've heard from the tail pipes of a Porsche. At one point during the shoot, David drove his car backwards and forward for the photographer so he could capture a panning shot. Having an idle moment I set off in search of some mobile phone signal and climbed up onto a hill overlooking the road where we were working. I must have been about 100 metres away by this point, but the sound of this Boxster was loud and rich in tone: if you’d been facing the other way you’d have guessed that some exotic old Porsche race car was flying past behind you. It’s a deep sound, far more so than you’d normally associate with a Boxster, and when the car is being worked hard there’s the slight chirrup of the excess boost between gears." So it would seem that maybe the problem isn't that you can't make a turbo sound good, but that they don't want to. Piping the noise into the car makes it sound good for the enthusiastic driver, but keeps it nice and quiet for the car hating general public?

anonymous said: [redacted] It is one thing to read that journalists aren’t too happy with the sound the engine makes but it’s another thing to read a comment like this. Part of me wants to see you post this over in the M forum to see what happens. As for the GT4, I would hope it will be a swan song for the six cylinder Cayman/Boxster. Using it as a test platform for new hybrid/turbo 4 cylinder performance would make a lot of sense in many ways but it is still too early for that. They would probably have a hard time getting the performance below 991 GT3 levels with a mid engine 400 PS turbo 4 and full use of torque vectoring as pioneered in the 918. The rumored mid-engine car between 918 and 911 would be a perfect candidate for that kind of technology. Edited by EricE on Sunday 6th July 10:51

VladD said: av185 said: Biggest problem with the new turbo substitutes is how they sound.....and no matter how much 'authentic' superficial piped induction engine noise is cabin fed, the general consensus is it sounds s it..... My Boxster has been turbo charged and was described by 991 & Porsche World quite positively. "Predictably, the first thing you notice with this car is the noise. Quite simply, it makes one of the very best noises I've heard from the tail pipes of a Porsche. At one point during the shoot, David drove his car backwards and forward for the photographer so he could capture a panning shot. Having an idle moment I set off in search of some mobile phone signal and climbed up onto a hill overlooking the road where we were working. I must have been about 100 metres away by this point, but the sound of this Boxster was loud and rich in tone: if you’d been facing the other way you’d have guessed that some exotic old Porsche race car was flying past behind you. It’s a deep sound, far more so than you’d normally associate with a Boxster, and when the car is being worked hard there’s the slight chirrup of the excess boost between gears." So it would seem that maybe the problem isn't that you can't make a turbo sound good, but that they don't want to. Piping the noise into the car makes it sound good for the enthusiastic driver, but keeps it nice and quiet for the car hating general public? Interesting.....it is quite bizarre that we currently have a 'market' which presumably has few objections to piped synthetic sound even in cars such as the new Hurracan, despite its howling N A V10... My Cayman S 'loaner' with its quite intrusive sports exhaust does sound convincingly authentic, presumably all natural sound, almost resembling a 458 on the overrun. Shame the top end performance is understandably nowhere approaching the 911.... On the subject of 911s, it would be interesting to see if more people would buy Turbos if they sounded better...whilst the 991 is an improvement over the 997.2 which in turn was an improvement over the 1, none of them sound particularly good, contributing to the overall feeling of driving detachment and more like a nuclear washing machine than sports GT..... :