Terrified!

I must admit to now being absolutely terrified after buying my first Porsche two weeks ago (2003 C4S) and studying all the threads on this site over the last few days. It seems that an OPC warranty at £895 is absolutely essential if I am to sleep at night because of fears that I'm goint to get lumbered with a £10K bill for a new engine. £1K for a replacement RMS I can live with but £10K !!!!!!!! I don't feel to aggrieved at paying for a warranty as I recognise the peace of mind that this gives and from reading the threads it sounds like the little things can make it well worth the initial £895 outlay. What is scaring me is taking it to an OPC to be inspected at £200 to be told it needs a new RMS at £1000 before I can take out a warranty at £895 as it sounds like the general consensus is that 9 out of 10 OPC's will claim it needs doing regardless of whether it really does and they've got you over a barrel because if you decline you can't have a warranty! This all adds up to over £2000 (assuming nothing else is wrong that also needs fixing!!) I am going to book it in for the 111 check. If it comes back OK and no RMS replacement required I will take the warranty. If they tell me the RMS needs doing (for info I have observed absolutely no oil loss in the last two weeks on the garage floor!) I am actually seriously considering just taking the car home and putting it straight back on the market which is thoroughly depressing.

Why didnt you get a porsche warranty put on before you purchased your car ? I just had my warrenty extended and all i needed was six ignition coils at £260.00. Lets hope yours check comes back ok even if the rms does need doing you still going to have 12 months peace of mind.

Chris - before you make any drastic decisions, you might want to consider alternatives: Join Porsche Club GB - for an annual fee of I think £65, you are invited to come and book your car offered at various OPC clinics who will do the 111 pt check for free (a few of us did this at Chiswick OPC in Autumn last year). Cambridge OPC also ran one as well. I have only been a member since summer last year so I don't know if these free clinics are offered all of the time. Take a 3rd party warranty - this is what I have myself as I bought my car from a performance car specialist. My warranty cost me £500 but then it's not as comprehensive as an OPC warranty as mine covers engine and gearbox only. To buy a 3rd party warranty you won't have to tend to the RMS first. Lastly - My 111 revealed that the RMS needed replacing and Chiswick kindly offered to cover approx 90% of the cost (the rest was charged to Porsche AG) as my car had been serviced by them previously before I bought it. This kind of offering I think depends from OPC to OPC but it's worth finding out. You definitely don't want to put the car up for sale as the enjoyment a 911 will give you will be worth much more than the headaches you have read about. ~ Maxie

I took my privately purchased car (although I knew the previous owner very well), took it in for it's major service and had the 111 point check at the same time. Nothing needed to be fixed (including RMS) for the OPC warranty. This car has never had it's RMS replaced (2003, so nearly 5 years old), but it is a tip. On balance, it seems that more manual cars seem to need their RMS replacing, when compared to the equivalent automatic version....but it's not huge numbers. 1 or 2 people have said that the OPC claimed the RMS needed replacing, when they thought that it didn't, but these are in the minority...I wouldn't worry about it.

I wouldn't worry too much. As you say, get the 111 pt check, it most likely will not need RMS, they are not as common as is sometimes portrayed by internet forums and you do not have any noticable leak. If it does, there are options open to you, ask them to contribute - a lot of OPCs will, or get it fixed done by an indie etc. You have got yourself a fantastic car, i would not let this spoil what should be the start of a love affair it really is not as bad as is made out!

Thanks for your comments so far. My nearest OPC is Cambridge and I have read so positive comments on this board about these guys. I am awaiting a call back to book the car in. I will certainly ask if the 111 check is free if I am a Porsche Club GB member. On reflection I wish that I had done all this research before buying the car and then I would have done the check before purchasing. Oh.... the benefits of hindsight! I also take some comfort from the fact that cars with the tiptronic box (as mine is) appear to suffer less RMS failures.

Oh if yours is a tip, you are pretty certain not to have a problem, very very rare for RMS in a tip car. So get your warranty and enjoy the car! (have you got a Porsche Sports Exhaust?)

I've been without warranty for 2 years now with a 3.4 996 manual, which has now done 93,000 miles. It doesn't use any oil (yet the dealer said I needed a new RMS to renew the warranty when it had lapsed) and I sleep every night! The proportion of catastrophic engine failures is very low (less than 5% I'm told) and no different to any other high performance engine in overall maintenance costs: Let's face it if it was a Ferrari you would be spending several thousand every year just on scheduled maintenance and you can't claim any of that on warranty! Even in the worst case scenario, let's say my engine lets go tomorrow: - In 8 years of Porsche ownership I've saved £4,000 on warranty premiums, and about £2,000 on OPC labour costs by using Indies for servicing, - I can get an exchange engine for about £7-8,000 through Autofarm (or a 4.0 litre for about £10,000 :mrgreen: ). - I can then have another year of worry-free motoring and then have a car with a newish engine - probably worth about £5,000 more than a 100,000 miler on it's original engine! OK, so there are a few cash-flow implications there, but I almost want it to blow up now - (note to self: Drive it like I stole it from now on!) :lol: :twisted:

Don't worry too much about the scare stories. That's the web for you- whilst you get people registering on 911uk to say their car has broken, you rarely get people registering just to say their car is fine! Wattie's points are good, but you do get some failures, and if it happens to you it sucks so I can understand your concern. To put it in perspective though, a ROUTINE cambelt change and annual service, even with a special offer from the main dealer cost me £3400 on my old F355. My warranty is with Lumley Auto- it covers RMS and seems as comprehensive as an OPC wty. The OPC warranty is by no means bullet-proof, and they seem to try hard to worm out of claims.

I'm in a similar boat to the OP in that I bought a late 3.4 two months ago from an independent with a three month warranty therefore I've just one month cover remaining and am considering my options. Picking up on some of what the OP said; I do think that the internet has an amazing ability to blow things like this out of all proportion, the RMS issue being a case in point, it's just a leaky seal which in almost all cases is nothing more than the most microscopic of leaks or even misting (if that's the correct term) An independent will replace said seal for half the OPC price which in reality is best done when the clutch is changed. Mine was reported as 'leaking' seven thousand miles ago but in the last two months and two thousand miles not a single drop of oil has appeared on the garage floor and not a drop of oil been used. I've been under the car with a torch etc and I can see the area in question, sure it's a bit 'wet' but no worse than any other car and definitely not a leak! Likewise the horror stories about sudden engine failure, whether it be from intermediate shaft failure or broken cylinder liners are truly terrifying as an owner but 95% of what you read on internet forums has been generated by the small number of unfortunate souls to which it happened; joining and posting for the first time on forums such as this never to be heard of again. Also I think the apparent frequency of such internet posts and articles reflects the comparatively large volumes that the M96 engine was manufactured in, certainly when compared the air cooled units that went before it. Talking to various independents and reading between the lines it's obvious that in reality these failures are very rare. My independent (admittedly a small one) claims to have dealt with just one Boxster intermediate shaft failure (which hadn't actually failed but was on its way out) but not a single 996 engine failure, that said they're obviously aware that certain problems exist (and the fixes) One point they did stress however was to warm these engines up properly before giving them the beans, I know that's just common sense but they've made a point of mentioning it to me on more than one occasion. It strikes me that the OPC's way of dealing with (and presumably still is) virtually all M96 engine failures was to replace the complete unit without investigating too deeply the nature of the failure and whether or not it could be repaired. This must be the single biggest contributing factor as to why the view exists that if virtually anything happens to said engine it's going to cost you £10-£12k for a replacement (which I'm sure it will if you go to an OPC!) But many independents are now working on, repairing, rebuilding and offering solutions to these engines in exactly the same way as any other thus offering a genuine, cost effective alternative to an OPC. At the end of the day my car is seven years old and I'm not sure the OPC / OPC inspection / warranty is for me but I fully understand why others deem it essential. But please don't let the internet hype dilute the enjoyment of such a great car (to the point of selling!!) which for many the ownership of which is the realisation of a dream! Anyway, just my 2p and sorry if this duplicates some of what others have said, it took me a while to write in-between work etc ... Mike

Mike has it spot on.

Hear, hear... Just out of interest, I was told I needed a new RMS by an OPC at the 111-point check, just 3 months after a different OPC had changed the RMS in the last week of the warranty! Their justification was 'some oil on the engine undertray' As Mike said it is a tiny tiny oil leak in most cases that will probably result in nothing worse than a few spots on your garage floor! Incidentally, at Cambridge OPC the Service Manager is (or used to be) a technical adviser to PCGB, and it was him that told me that he believed 996 engine failures to be almost exactly the same % as the 993 (about 3%) - it's just that there are more of them! The warming up bit is critical too - especially with a dry sump type arrangement. Most of the failures have been low mileage, occasional use cars and probably (dare I say it) originally owned by posers who wouldn't have bothered about warming up properly before giving it the beans to win the traffic light Grand Prix!

Gary Sorrell at Cambridge OPC is a good guy. 111pt checks are not free for PCGB members unless through a special event organised by one of the PCGB regions, although these happen from time to time through the year depending on what is planned for the region. But it will definitely be worth it getting the warranty on a C4S. Good luck -

Guys, Thanks very much for all your comments. I really do appreciate it as a 'newbie' to Porsche. I will certainly let you know how I get on with the 111 point check and look forward to being 'involved' in discussions with you all in the future via this superb site. For now.... thanks for helping to ease my depression!

I love my 3.4 996 and wouldn't go back and change it (apart from a bigger engine :twisted . I know what you mean about reading all the scare stories but even with these I'm thoroughly enjoying every moment with the car. Just my 0.02$ though