996 Vs 993

Bit new to all this Porsche malarky, but looking at the prices of 996s Vs 993s the 993s seem to come out more expensive for a older car. Any reason why this is ?? I appreciate the 993 is the last of the air cooled models but apart from that i'm at a loss of figure out another reason.

I`m sure there will be plenty of views on this but I think the biggest single reason is that the 996 was the first mass produced Porsche meaning anything before is "rarer" hence the better depreciation. I personally think the 996 is a better every day car but you pay your money and take your choice Steve

Have a read through both 993 and 996 forums and you will see LOADS of discussions and opinion on this topic. The 3 main arguments are: supply and demand, classic 911 shape, purer driving experience.

Easy decision to make - depends on your brain :? Right brain (Emotional / creative) get a 993 Left brain (Rational / logical) get a 996 :thumb: But, as Chris says - if you have a week or two to spare, do a search and read all the arguments on here... :hand:

May I also controversially add the quality of the product? aperbag:

Not sure about that - IMO a bit of a myth... I've had both for well over 50,000 miles and the only difference in maintenance for me between the two has been radiators and electronics that the 993 didn't have. The 996 has actually cost less to service, uses less oil, and the air-conditioning works (as opposed to spending a considerable sum on my 993 vainly trying to get that to work) :wink: I've also never had to spend an hour under a bridge on the Brussels 'Ring' in hot weather in the 996, waiting for it to cool down a bit before I could rejoin the traffic jam! Even more controversially, perceived better build quality also often means over-engineering (and overweight) and/or old technology (less to go wrong): In my rallying days, if you wanted to get the car that was most likely to finish the 5-day and night RAC rally of old, you would buy a Skoda 120R, but if you wanted to have a chance of winning (and not having to constantly justify your choice of wheels).... :?:

You don't say which model you interested which makes it harder to give you a straight answer 1) If it's going to be driven every day then would suggest 996 or possibly moderately priced 993. If you going pile on the mileage onto the 993 it's resale price will take a hammering so don't waste you money on a low mileage car 2) If you like to take a car by the scruff of the neck and throw it around then think I would take the 993 3) I would also take the manual over the tiptronic. The tiptronic is far less engaging but if you going to be stuck in traffic most of the time then it might be worth considering 3) The 993's are quite robust and although it cost more to maintain than the 996, the difference was small

Ha ha, the controversy kicks in :wink: :hand: Not a myth, simply a function of cost saving and mass production I say. Examples? Take a look at the quality of hide, interior trim, plastics, carpet. Compare how they wear - I've been shocked at the state of many drivers seats in 996s after modest mileage. Slam the door on a 996 and compare with a 993. I'd argue these are more than perceived or old school build quality. Speak to a specialist who works on these cars and ask their opinions. (And I'm not going to mention engine issues) All of these factors are well documented and widely agreed upon, not just by blinkered owners like yours truely, but by press, specialists and commentators. But crucially they are not that surprising given the backdrop of what Porsche as a business was facing back in the '90s and therefore decided (read HAD) to do with the 996. Porsche could not afford to carry on building cars like the 993. They might not be in existance today if they had. The 996 has turned around it's fortunes, but it was built on a very different ethos, which at it's core was about making it's cars cheaper and therefore more profitably. In various aspects this bean counting can be seen. However with these downsides came many upsides - the 996 is a cracking car, don't get me wrong :thumb: . But if you're looking for that "traditional" Porsche feel, the 993 is arguably the ultimate expression of it and certainly goes a long way to explain why they are so sort after. It's the last Porsche built before the accountants took control. BTW, if your 993 was overheating I'd suggest the ballast resistor was faulty :wink: Air con - not true that it's a vain expense. Once the age related issues are sorted it can be very effective (although admittedly maybe not as good as a 996s, but not as bad as people suggest)

Thanks for the replys guys. To be honest i posted an earlier thread about changing from my current Impreza STi and getting a 996. The interior trim and build quality of the STi is jap crap poor so i'd of thought either the 993 or 996 would be worlds better. I'm only going to be looking at a budget of around £22k so looking at classified adds a 996 makes more sense to me. A Carrera 2 manual would be my first choice, tiptronic really doesn't float my boat (although the only car i've driven with it is a M3 AMG) It would be used as a everyday driver but would only cover around 20 miles per day, all on nice B roads :lol: What roughly are the service costs and intervals on a 1999ish 996 Carrera?? I've already been quoted £150 LESS to insure the Porsche than the STi and in everday driving i'd imagine i'd also get better MPG. Not to mention cheaper road tax and far less depriciation (i'm trying to talk myself into this can you tell!!!)

The last of the 993's and 996's were built by the same people on the same production line. Lets put this to bed once and for all the quality is the same. They didn't use inferior leather or plastics when making the 996. Fact When looking for a Porsche I test drove many 993 and 996 and I'd say there were just as many tatty 993 with dropping doors and poor shuts as were 996. And just as many if not more worn and tatty drivers seats -not suprisingly as most 993 were well into there 80,000. There are good uns and bad uns in both models - 993 is holding its value as you said due to supply and demand of course there are going to be fewer good low mileage examples of a 10+ year old cars out there. But I don't think its because its a better car, older and rarer yes

Really :?: We'll have to agree to disagree on this vlad I didn't claim the 993 to be a better car - that depends entirely on what one defines as better. I'll stand by my observations on quality, and it's backed up by many who know much more on this subject than me.

I think a lot of the percieved differences are down to, dare I say it, a different sort of chap bought the 996. It was pitched squarely at Jag, BMW and Merc, and bought and used in the same way, day in day out. 993s were not a big seller in their short production life (hence ironically the rarity that now drives the values)- they appealed to the enthusiasts, and still do, but Porsche knew that they had to appeal to a wider market to thrive. Again, ironically, the success of the 996 has proved to be its achilles heel in terms of oversupply, and the fact that there are many more about to be both neglected and therefore potentially unreliable which skews the stats. My 996 C4S, which has been well looked after by me and previous stewards is in perfect nick inside. There are some baggy ones about, but no more so than any other car of similar miles, usage. My 29k mile 993 was certainly not a rattle-free paragon, and the previous owner had spent £££ having oil leaks sorted. The interior plastics were good, but, well, plastic and lots of it. Certainly not befitting of a £60k new car. I believe that the full-leather trimmed, alcantara rooflined cocoon of the 996 is more in keeping with the class. The door-closing point is as much to do with the 993's door frames (and quarterlights, how quaint!) making for a smoother action that the window-drop of the 996. Close the doors with the windows open, and they aren't that different. Anyway, this debate is getting boring. We'll all have to agree to disagree!

Car ownership and specifically how we view our cars is such an emotional and subjective issue that so often battles with the dynamic qualities of metal, plastic, and 4 rubber contact patches on the road... The 996 was a huge leap forward from the 993. It was the advent of modern manufacturing and technology that enabled the brand new 996 chassis to provide increased rigidity, impact safety, and greater dynamic handling limits over the previous 40+ year old chassis design that was originally designed for the 4 cylinder 356 but survived until the 993. It is debatable whether the build quality was a function of design (framed doors vs frameless doors), manufacturing quality (hand build vs automated robots), or intrinsic quality of materials: anyone who has owned an old Toyota/Honda from the 80s-90s may argue that the touchy/feely sensations of hard and shiny plastics is not the last word in refinement, but they may argue it is far better engineered considering they will continue working dozens of years after the same-era leather clad BMW have broken down or erupted in an electrical fireball. I love the terminology being used in this thread (especially by the 993 boys :wink: ). I especially love the translation of "dynamically less able and stable" into "purer driving experience" first class :hand: At the same time, let's never forget that the "ultimate expression" of the "traditional Porsche feel"... is probably the likes of the CGT or current 997 GT2 - both are definitively Porsches, and they are certainly the ultimate expression of what Porsche are able to produce for the road given their technology, resources, and development. Of course in terms of GT3s, everyone knows that the purest expression of Porsche's darling model range is the first and original Mk1 996 GT3 :wink:

Thanks for the replys In the experience of owners of 996s am i asking for trouble and expense by attempting the jump into 996 ownership with a budget of £22k? I apprecite that there are a lot of 996s out there at that sort of price with reasonable mileage c10k a Year and with full historys. I know i've been told the running costs are going to be much higher than my STi, but my thinking is i'm not going to be tempted to modify the Porsche as i have been with the STi. Constantly searching to make it a car that it probably never will be. Therefore all the thousands of pounds i've spent will be used as cash for servicing and running costs.

Let me add some wood to the fire as well : I bought recently my first Porsche. I always loved Porsches and now I was wondering between three models : 993 TT 996 TT 996 GT3 MK1 Unfortunatly, SheWhoMustBeObeyed took the GT3 out of the equation straight away - but its by far the one who takes my heart and makes my hair rise in the back of my neck all the time. Then the classic 993 vs 996 : seen loads, from C4S to C2, tip´s to manuals. Problem with the 993 is the amount of owners and the 996 is the careless of owners, at least that is what I observed : its easy to find a 996 with 1 or 2 owners and we can see if they treated the car right or not ( mine was treated like a king and money no expenseve by its previous owner ). 993´s today have racked up few owners and if there´s one bad , the car will suffer at one point. Although since the 996´s are cheaper and more "modern" looking, they get picked up frequently by people who understand little to nothing about Porsche and just want to show off - again, car suffers. I believe that the 993 can be a little over eng and that the 996 was built with more cost issues in mind, but I think that the 996 closes the gap because it has newer technology and therefore they are equivalent in the end. I didnt saw 993´s generally better than 996´s and neither the opposite - I saw many dogs in both camps. In the end, the everyday usage of the 996 won over the 993 and I bought it - but I stress that what counts in this car, its the previous owners - the less and more fanatical about the marque the better. Two things are utterly important and makes sense either you are buying a 964, 993, 996 or even a 997 : always buy on condition ( although the 996 was produced more heavily therefore you can be more picky on things like colours, trims, etc ) and buy cheap - buy twice. One thing I dont understand though - why the air boys always say that the 996 was the first mass produced porsche ? The 993 was mass produced as well, just not in such higher numbers. It almost seems that was FP mother and some friends that were hand building every element of 993 and older - Of course I understand that with the Boxster and 996 these cars jumped to uber high numbers of car produced but the 993 werent built by hand at a rate of 1 per month or something. In the end, since they are older and rarer, a good 993 comands a steep price : and the shape is more desirable ( normal 993 vs normal 996 ), specially when the 997 looks more like a 993 than a 996. Although my favorite car of all time is a 964RS and a 996 GT3 MK1. Then my 996tt and GT2