964 RS - Daily Driver???????? - Page 2 - Porsche General - PistonHeads UK

Hi, anybody out there use a 964 RS as a daily commuting transport? I'd like to consider one of these, but it would have to be my everyday car and I'm really concerned about the harsh ride, becoming impossible to live with, once the novelty has worn off. Alternatively can any one reccommend or have experience of, a std. 964 being modded to a RS type spec., but maintainimg a acceptable ride quality?

Domster!!!!

On my 964C2 i have had the standard suspension set up, H+R coilovers, and H+R supercups. The standard suspension is fine for the road but is too soft for trackwork IMO. The H+R coilovers are a fasr road/track set up and while noticably firmer than the stock set up is perfectly usable as a daily driver and I did use mine as such with these fitted. On track they gave 95% of the RS experience and the performance of the car in this state was not manifestly different from a stock RS. As a daily driver this would be my choice. The H+R supercups are equilant or slighly stiffer than RS spec suspension and while the car is drivable on the road it's not a particularly pleasant experience. I would also say that on UK roads the car is slower than with the H+R coilovers because the lack of suspension compliance affects grip on bumpy badly surfaced roads. It's also true to say the car is handful in the wet road or track with the supercups.

I used to drive an RS 70km a day: no problem! The ride is hard and if traffic is very slow the engine temperature will rise but otherwise you're ok.

Quite agree, not the most comfortable, but worth it once you get to an open stretch

Thanks Paul. Yeah, the RS can be used everyday. I commuted in it 70 miles a day at one point (once upon a time, a long long time ago). Poor road surfaces and speedhumps were a pain, but normal roads were fine. B roads are where you have to be careful, you can get launched off a hump in the road if they are very uneven. It can be done. I used to commute in a Caterham 7 (even in the snow) so it really depends on how committed you are. You even get locking doors and a stereo in the 964RS. You can always put softer 993RS struts on the front of the 964RS to make it more road-useable. A few owners do this. Everything will be a compromise between road manners and track ability. I quite liked the hardcore nature of the RS, so I wouldn't worry about changing the struts. I'd rather change my fillings every few years when the old ones fall out Go on, don't be a jessie!

PS The novely WON'T wear off. That's the beauty of the 964RS. If it's the right car for you then nothing else will really have the same appeal. PPS It's also worth pointing out: 964RS + road manners = 993RS Which is why it is probably the best production Porsche that has been made. >> Edited by domster on Thursday 19th May 14:16

crbox, I'm going down the route of gradually modding my '90 C2 towards RS spec. To date it has the following : Decat Cup pipe Cup airbox / K&N RS clutch and flywheel Fully rebuilt top and bottom end (to standard 964 spec) Re-bushed front wisbones Bilstein HD shocks H&R progressive springs Lowered 30mm (RS is 40mm) Front splitter Air ducts Front strut brace Momo Monte Carlo wheel Recaro SPG seats Stable energies harness bar Luke 4 point harnesses Rear seats removed 993 front and rear brakes Performance Friction pads Non-elec teardrop mirrors 17" Cup wheels Dunlop SSR track tyres Full geo and corner balance by Neil Bainbridge erm... think that's it. The ride is certainly stiff, but certainly useable on road - indeed comfortable on motorway. I think that it starts to become unacceptable when you move to solid top mounts - much more noise / vibration etc transfered through the suspension. The seats are a pain to get in and out of (the slightly wider Pole Position seats would be easier). The RS clutch and flywheel make it quite hard work to drive in heavy stop / start traffic and the brakes squeal like hell. So, would it be useable as an everyday car? well yes, but would I want to ? Probably not ! I think it just requires a bit too much effort and concentration to drive esp. if you are having to deal with heavy traffic. Also lack of aircon adds to commuter discomfort. All that said, I love the car to bits, but this is still a long long way from full RS spec, which just isn't realistically / economically achievable. There are so many tiny differences in almost every component that just make the RS a brilliant package. My car goes some way to approximating it (and once I have my new RS interior, it will be virtually indistinguishable from an RS cosmetically). I would never badge it as an RS as that would be disingenuous. It is more of an 'homage' to the RS, whilst still trying to retain some of the manners of the C2. Jamie

You're right in saying that it isn't economicaly viable to replicate an RS from a C2. You can however make a C2 into a better track car than a stock RS for less money than you would have to pay to buy an RS.

[/quote] You can however make a C2 into a better track car than a stock RS for less money than you would have to pay to buy an RS.[/quote] Probably true, but even so I think you'd be better off buying an RS in the first place (assuming that's an option) as that should, in theory, hold it's value, whereas the investment required to make a C2 a better track car than an RS would not necessarily enhance its value significantly. Pound for pound spent the RS would be the better buy, all other things being equal.

Absolutely right.

Hmmm, so why am I busy pouring money into a car that will never b worth much mre than I paid for it ?????? Since when have cars and the basic rules of sensible economics ever gone together

JS because you will get a lot of enjoyment out of a car that is much better than a standard 964. Sorry to say but mods on cars rarely pay for themselves come re-sale...just enjoy it.

True, but if you enjoy the car then money doesn't matter (that much!).

And it's good for your job as well: 1) you always walk into the office with a smile on your face 2) they'll hear you arriving

Thanks for the quick responses guys - I guess that I'll just have to take one for a long test drive - and try and make the right decision - for me. I don't particularly object to any discomfort -I actually want to go back to a simple car. However, I find that whenever I take my Austin Healey Comp. car in to work, for example, I find myself getting hacked off by slow or stationary traffic. The hotter the engine gets, the worse it is to operate and the more I wish I wasn't in it. I hope an RS won't have similar traits. Obviously any 911/964/993/996 would be a better all rounder, it's but the attraction of an exotic, especially a Porsche, is sadly inescapable. Do you think LHD be easy to sell on, if it didn't work out and why do people really suppose that these cars are not likely to depreciate?

I think that the interior of a non-Clubsport spec 964 RS is fine for driving into work. It will be fine in traffic, I don't mind traffic in my 993 RS which is way more mental than most. A well cared for 964 RS in LHD will be easy enough to sell. Don't worry about that. They are also depreciation-proof, as long as you don't spend too much on one in the first place of course.

The 964RS is fine in traffic. The engine oil may heat up a little but never critically in my experience - although many owners remove the rear undertray as a precaution as (I believe) the exhaust valve guides suffer under excessive heat. Someone more technical like 9M may be able to chip in here. If you can get past the lack of power steering (fine when on the move), floor mounted pedals (every 911 before the 996 had these of course!) and sharp clutch, then they are easy as a Micra to drive. Sweet gearbox, especially. As for LHD, 99% of the 964RSs produced were LHD. Only 50 or so were RHD out of a production run of a couple of thousand. The RHD ones have power steering (frowned upon by the hardcore) and underseal (most UK LHD ones will have been waxoyled by now anyway). The prices between LHD and RHD ones have narrowed considerably. The RHD still has a premium of course, but rarity and driving on the 'proper side' has not proven as attractive to the market as it perhaps should have done...the non-PAS and therefore arguably more pure LHD version has the majority appeal. All the above in my very biased and somewhat warped opinion

A big factor has, surely got to be the nature of the commute. A previous commute of mine was a 50 mile cross country hack. Average speed 50 odd mph. mmmmm Now it’s a 2 hour M1 / M25 / M4 or M1 / North Circ effort. Average speed 19mph. I need my head testing. Both journeys dictate a very different choice of car.

Cars only lose money when actually sell them; until then you only actually waste money. If you put an RS clutch and flywheel in an RS it doesn't increase it's value either. If you crash an RS on track you lose £35K or pay insurance. Crash a C2 and you loose £15k at most. How many RSs do you see unmodified anyway. Fitting Motec to a C2 costs the same as fitting it to an RS.

Funny enough I have just been using my RS for a few days as my everyday car, as a stop gap whilst I got another everyday car. Whilst the ride is stiff it's not really so bad that you could'nt use it everyday. The problem I would have if I kept using it, is keeping my licence. The power is so usable and the noise soooo adictive it's a real job to keep to sane speeds. 100mph and sure fire banning teritory come up real quick. You may also find your left leg grows bigger and your biceps become similar in size to arnies :-)) Winter and wet weather do not mix with the initials RS either. And then there is snow!!! to be honest in the wet on uk roads you would be quicker in just about anything else and I do mean anything. If you think you can live with the above then you'll be fine.

Absolutely right - when I buzzed my engine, I had to have new exhaust valves too - and the engine had only covered 25k miles at that time. All down to the higher temps caused by the rear undertray - which I then smartly removed. An RS is bloody noisy inside too - can be drowned out by the radio (or CD actually, as there's no amplifier for the aerial in an RS, despite the car using the standard 'screen complete with aerial embedded in it)

This undertray thing is a bit confusing. If overheating occurs, surely the oil temp will reflect this? I have my undertray on and have been stuck in a few jams. The oil temp has risen but stayed well within safe limits (no where near the red zone but maybe at 9.30). Therefore, the oil temp is within spec and cooling the engine as designed. I could understand if the oil temp went crazy in traffic and helped to do so be lack of ventilation due to the undertray but it doesn't. Maybe I'm missing someting here?

Silver, its not really overheaing as such, its that tray off is more a good way of reducing heat build up by giving beter ventilation, a/c 911s run a bit warmer in the head dept than a wasssen pumpen conventinonal engine- accelerating top end wear, its one of the reasons behind why in general a/c 911 heads & top end rebuilds are needed (on road cars) before the type of miles youd expect to need to rebuild a head on a well built normal water cooled engine.

Is there any reason why you have to use the RS as a DD? For me the commute is a 45mph (if I'm lucky) 35 minute bumper to bumper dirge. It seems wasted on my 968CS, so a '64RS would be miserable. Personally I'd hate the thought of all that salt and crud slowly destroying my P&J, and sometimes after a long day shining my trouser arse in front of a key board I just need cosseting. Can't you manage to run a cheap daily set of wheels , and keep the RS for week-end/sunny day etc use? Even a nice old 924S would do the trick. A limited mileage Classic Car insurance policy for the RS would offer some savings too. SS7

Is corrosion a problem with heavily used RS's? Would you need to take any extra measures to keep road salt and other impurities off the non-undersealed RS? tat

I think they were galvanised as standard anyway and that the underseal was just an additional measure. I may be wrong. I believe many UK RSs that are used regularly have been waxoyled now.

They are all galv, but not undersealed.

Today from Mr Metcalfe. Porsche 964 RS. The purest, best driving air-cooled 911 of all or is the RS a flawed diamond?

Oh yes! Just take it to Center(sic) of Gravity and tell them you want it set up as a daily driver. And enjoy. Cool car to use this way. Respect.

Discombobulate said: Oh yes! Just take it to Center(sic) of Gravity and tell them you want it set up as a daily driver. And enjoy. Cool car to use this way. Respect. Center Gravity, not Center of Gravity Well done Kitty, yet another old thread pointlessly resurrected …

Slippydiff said: Center Gravity, not Center of Gravity Well done Kitty, yet another old thread pointlessly resurrected … there wasn't another 964 RS thread I could find in order to keep matters on topic. You do realise you aren't forced to click

Slippydiff said: Center Gravity, not Center of Gravity Well done Kitty, yet another old thread pointlessly resurrected … Details. It’s always been spelt wrong anyway

Great vid from Harry, I remember that 911 Heaven article. I couldn’t afford a 911 at that time so ended up buying a E30 M3 instead, kept that a few years before buying a 964 C4 that had a similar stance to an RS (or I thought so) as it was lowered. That must of been 20 years ago and it was my first Porsche. Happy memories.

KittyLitter said: there wasn't another 964 RS thread I could find in order to keep matters on topic. You do realise you aren't forced to click You're right, I'm not forced to click on any threads, but unlike you who wanders around this forum aimlessly resurrecting threads or posting on the "Restomods" thread, some us do actually try and post useful information that may be helpful and of use to others. If you cast your mind back, I suggested you start a new thread of your own, you can then post links to cars for sale, dogsh*te restomods and other such stuff you and others may find interesting. Rather than looking for an old thread to resurrect to then add a link to. Of course having been banned, and returned "under the radar", you most likely don't want to do that, for fear you'll be recognised and booted off here again, so you continue to resurrect near 20 year old threads instead. By starting your own new thread, people can happily visit it, whilst those clicking onto the old threads you insist on resurrecting, thinking they may be able to contribute something useful to the original topic, needn't. In all honesty, I guessed this was another of your thread resurrections, but I hoped it might actually be someone genuinely resurrecting a topic seeking information/advice (but having just watched Harry's video earlier this evening, I was pretty sure it was another of your "special resurrections" (yes, unfortunately you are THAT predictable ...)

Holy thread resurrection Batman. WTF. I’m pretty certain Harry never suggested driving the RS daily. Seems like yet another odd choice of thread from last century with a tenuous link

Slippydiff said: KittyLitter said: there wasn't another 964 RS thread I could find in order to keep matters on topic. You do realise you aren't forced to click You're right, I'm not forced to click on any threads, but unlike you who wanders around this forum aimlessly resurrecting threads or posting on the "Restomods" thread, some us do actually try and post useful information that may be helpful and of use to others. If you cast your mind back, I suggested you start a new thread of your own, you can then post links to cars for sale, dogsh*te restomods and other such stuff you and others may find interesting. Rather than looking for an old thread to resurrect to then add a link to. Of course having been banned, and returned "under the radar", you most likely don't want to do that, for fear you'll be recognised and booted off here again, so you continue to resurrect near 20 year old threads instead. By starting your own new thread, people can happily visit it, whilst those clicking onto the old threads you insist on resurrecting, thinking they may be able to contribute something useful to the original topic, needn't. In all honesty, I guessed this was another of your thread resurrections, but I hoped it might actually be someone genuinely resurrecting a topic seeking information/advice (but having just watched Harry's video earlier this evening, I was pretty sure it was another of your "special resurrections" (yes, unfortunately you are THAT predictable ...) oy vey, fine, ok. Shall start a thread afresh then. Best regards

Mental how Domster sold his RS for £25k back in the day. How times change.

KittyLitter said: Slippydiff said: KittyLitter said: there wasn't another 964 RS thread I could find in order to keep matters on topic. You do realise you aren't forced to click You're right, I'm not forced to click on any threads, but unlike you who wanders around this forum aimlessly resurrecting threads or posting on the "Restomods" thread, some us do actually try and post useful information that may be helpful and of use to others. If you cast your mind back, I suggested you start a new thread of your own, you can then post links to cars for sale, dogsh*te restomods and other such stuff you and others may find interesting. Rather than looking for an old thread to resurrect to then add a link to. Of course having been banned, and returned "under the radar", you most likely don't want to do that, for fear you'll be recognised and booted off here again, so you continue to resurrect near 20 year old threads instead. By starting your own new thread, people can happily visit it, whilst those clicking onto the old threads you insist on resurrecting, thinking they may be able to contribute something useful to the original topic, needn't. In all honesty, I guessed this was another of your thread resurrections, but I hoped it might actually be someone genuinely resurrecting a topic seeking information/advice (but having just watched Harry's video earlier this evening, I was pretty sure it was another of your "special resurrections" (yes, unfortunately you are THAT predictable ...) oy vey, fine, ok. Shall start a thread afresh then. Best regards Well I beg to differ. I found it really interesting comparing a question from 2005 when the car was 13 years old (and now almost 20 years ago) to the way Harry sees the car now. I really enjoy his insightful videos ... not totally correct because the Motec modification was an exchange ECU and at 325bhp it probably had a cat bypass, different fuel injectors, secondary silencer delete ... and hopefully rebuilt with ARP rod bolts ... but otherwise just as I remembered mine (which was set-up and rolling roaded at 335bhp, though it was the torque uplift that was the most noticeable). On the subject of suspension, the Cup car front dampers were more compliant than the standard road ones, and some did fit 993RS ones ... some even fitted the 993RS six speed gearbox. But I guess that most now just need the dampers reconditioning ?? I'm sure that Slippy will have a view on this