Servicing woes, 981 Cayman GTS - Page 3 - Boxster/Cayman - PistonHeads UK

Took my car in for it's 8 year major service to my local OPC. Got home and checked the oil. It shows just the bottom segemnt as green, leaving three grey segments, not including the over max top segment. Thats underfilled by 1275 ml or circa 2 1/2 pints. I dont think the brakes have been bled as there is no residual brake fluid inside the nipples. Tested by inserting a cotton earbud stick, came out bone dry. I'd be interested to know how the front brakes were bled without taking the wheel off. I had marked the wheel bolts nearest the valve cap and they were still in the same place. I was however charged for 2 ltrs of brake fluid which sounds a LOT. Not convinced the plugs have been changed as the wheel liners (which as far as I know have to be removed to get access to the plugs looked very much undisturbed. I'll get the car jacked up tomorrow for a better look. Oh, and I had to add over 2 ltrs of water to the screenwash.. Finally, I seem to have acquired a scratch on my wing. The problem is like going to a new restuaraunt. If the strter is a bit off, then you doubly scrutinise the main course. If thats substandard, by the time the dessert appears, you are on a mission!

Whereabouts are you?

Rather not say at the moment thanks. Doesn’t really change the story anyway… .)

andygo said: Rather not say at the moment thanks. Doesn’t really change the story anyway… .) under warranty?

Back in summer 2022 I had an oil issue after having my 2014 981 Boxster S serviced at an OPC. The oil level looked right at the bottom of the scale with only the bottom triangular segment lit. I called the service centre, who were baffled as apparently the oil is dispensed in exacting measures by a computer. But they came out to have a look, and brought a couple of 1-lite bottles of Mobil-1 with them. Once they had verified the oil level was indeed showing as I had described, they added one litre, followed by the second litre. By this point, the oil level according to the indicator was just above half way. Luckily I keep Mobil 1 in the garage, so I brought out and unsealed a 4 or 5-litre bottle, and we added more oil until the oil level indicator showed one bar from totally full, but still within the OK range. The OPC representative apologised profusely and could not explain how my car had been delivered back to me in this state. I didn't have the opportunity to drive the car for nearly a week, but when I did I suddenly got a message on the dash that the oil level was above maximum, but it was possible to drive on. I drove home gingerly, and the OPC collected the car. The next day they reported back that they had drained all of the oil, and found that it was massively overfull. Turns out that the oil level was correct after the service, but the sensor was misreading. Somehow, either when I drove the car or when they drained and refilled the engine, the sensor fixed itself was now reading correctly. The problem has not recurred since. I can't comment on anything else you've found, but perhaps your oil level sensor is doing the same as mine did.

andygo said: Rather not say at the moment thanks. Doesn’t really change the story anyway… .) Welly your not saying where and your not asking a question, what's the point of the post again?

Interesting, quite possibly mine is the same although it’s always been steady before. I’ll open the tailgate to reset the reading just in case.

Honestly…..really would find it incredibly hard to believe you were charged for an 8 year and they didn’t 1. put enough oil in it 2. go near the brakes or have the wheels off 3. change the plugs 4. fill your screen wash. And you have been changed for all the above! Apart from 4 which is an easy oversight, that would ruin a reputation if true.

Youforreal. said: Honestly…..really would find it incredibly hard to believe you were charged for an 8 year and they didn’t 1. put enough oil in it 2. go near the brakes or have the wheels off 3. change the plugs 4. fill your screen wash. And you have been changed for all the above! Apart from 4 which is an easy oversight, that would ruin a reputation if true. Well I'm not sure about the plugs as I haven't physically looked at one. Will have a look tomorrow, easy enough. But certainly the front wheels haven't been off and the lack of residual fluid in the bleed nipples doesn't instill me with confidence. I'm curious about charge for 2 litres of brake fluid, seems excessive. I'm going to reset the oil level and see if it improves. But to be fair, it's the only method I have of determining the oil level. Whatever the actual level is, if it's reading low you would expect the garage to notice and sort. I'll be doing a bit more investigation before raising issues with the OPC. Hopefully all will be ok and my faith in garages will be restored to it's previous low bar!

How are you going to reset the oil level?

LunarOne said: How are you going to reset the oil level? If you open the rear hatch for 10 secs or so, that resets the display after a few miles. Seems a weird way of finding out how much oil you may not have in the engine. https://www.porscheclubgb.com/forum/threads/oil-le... Various confirmations available re this on the net.

Mate of mine worked for a major main dealer in the 90’s. Household brand. When company cars came in for service under warranty and it was busy, service books were often stamped with no service at all carried out. I believe that was common place at the time .

andygo said: Youforreal. said: Honestly…..really would find it incredibly hard to believe you were charged for an 8 year and they didn’t 1. put enough oil in it 2. go near the brakes or have the wheels off 3. change the plugs 4. fill your screen wash. And you have been changed for all the above! Apart from 4 which is an easy oversight, that would ruin a reputation if true. Well I'm not sure about the plugs as I haven't physically looked at one. Will have a look tomorrow, easy enough. But certainly the front wheels haven't been off and the lack of residual fluid in the bleed nipples doesn't instill me with confidence. I'm curious about charge for 2 litres of brake fluid, seems excessive. I'm going to reset the oil level and see if it improves. But to be fair, it's the only method I have of determining the oil level. Whatever the actual level is, if it's reading low you would expect the garage to notice and sort. I'll be doing a bit more investigation before raising issues with the OPC. Hopefully all will be ok and my faith in garages will be restored to it's previous low bar! Seems incredible but you could be right! If nipples are dry it’s impossible they have been bled, oil could be the sensor though, if you do check the plugs and find they haven’t been touched.,,,,,,,if it were me I’d honestly hit the roof!

andygo said: I'll be doing a bit more investigation before raising issues with the OPC. Hopefully all will be ok and my faith in garages will be restored to it's previous low bar! ...but is it under warranty? if not then why on earth use an OPC over a top notch Indie?

KittyLitter said: andygo said: I'll be doing a bit more investigation before raising issues with the OPC. Hopefully all will be ok and my faith in garages will be restored to it's previous low bar! ...but is it under warranty? if not then why on earth use an OPC over a top notch Indie? Possibly his location to a ‘top notch’ one as I can assure you, they are all not.

I went to the OPC to maintain my warranty otherwise I would have used RPM Technik.

You could have had an incredibly diligent Tech that actually dried out the nipples after bleeding them? On the other hand... Interested to see how this pans out, my car is booked in at Leeds at the end of the month for the same treatment.

plynchy said: You could have had an incredibly diligent Tech that actually dried out the nipples after bleeding them? On the other hand... Interested to see how this pans out, my car is booked in at Leeds at the end of the month for the same treatment. More reliable than relying on what may or may not be found inside the bleed nipple covers … : https://www.amazon.co.uk/ITEQ-Liquid-Tester-Lights...

Slippydiff said: More reliable than relying on what may or may not be found inside the bleed nipple covers … : https://www.amazon.co.uk/ITEQ-Liquid-Tester-Lights... I get your point with the tester, but I replaced my brake fluid about 18 months ago when I fitted the new rear calipers that the original OPC sent me. They sent me the calipers as no slots were available over the Christmas period and the January for them to replace so I did it myself.All four nipples in the rear calipers were seized, impossible if the bleeding process had been carried out 4 months earlier. Actually that saga is the main reason I'm picky about the whole service process. The master tech from that OPC told me that they only need to flush about 20ml of fluid from each side of the calipers. I found that quite shocking. Edited by andygo on Friday 10th May 08:41 Edited by andygo on Friday 10th May 08:44

andygo said: Took my car in for it's 8 year major service to my local OPC. Got home and checked the oil. It shows just the bottom segemnt as green, leaving three grey segments, not including the over max top segment. Thats underfilled by 1275 ml or circa 2 1/2 pints. I dont think the brakes have been bled as there is no residual brake fluid inside the nipples. Tested by inserting a cotton earbud stick, came out bone dry. I'd be interested to know how the front brakes were bled without taking the wheel off. I had marked the wheel bolts nearest the valve cap and they were still in the same place. I was however charged for 2 ltrs of brake fluid which sounds a LOT. Not convinced the plugs have been changed as the wheel liners (which as far as I know have to be removed to get access to the plugs looked very much undisturbed. I'll get the car jacked up tomorrow for a better look. Oh, and I had to add over 2 ltrs of water to the screenwash.. Finally, I seem to have acquired a scratch on my wing. The problem is like going to a new restuaraunt. If the strter is a bit off, then you doubly scrutinise the main course. If thats substandard, by the time the dessert appears, you are on a mission! To use your analogy I would have finshed all the meal, established exactly what was right, wrong or happened and then started the thread already knowing what it is you were not happy with.

I have added just over a litre of oil to get the level to indicate full. The OPC has told me that they bleed the brakes without removing the wheels as they bleed them whilst on the ramps. Is that even possible?

andygo said: I have added just over a litre of oil to get the level to indicate full. The OPC has told me that they bleed the brakes without removing the wheels as they bleed them whilst on the ramps. Is that even possible? Litre is a fair wee bit to judge short, why they never put a dipstick in these things I’ll never know! It could possibly be done but you would need 20 inch wheels and it would depend on which ones for access. Tbh it does sound a bit far fetched as it’s 100 times easier to do with the wheel off and that’s a 2 min job, tricky one, if get that fluid tester linked above.

Surely they'd want the wheels off to inspect the brakes and suspension components??

You would think so tbh. I am on 20 inch wheels, but you would have to be a gynaecologist to do it! Edited by andygo on Sunday 12th May 11:57

andygo said: I have added just over a litre of oil to get the level to indicate full. The OPC has told me that they bleed the brakes without removing the wheels as they bleed them whilst on the ramps. Is that even possible? I managed to bleed my brakes without removing the wheels, it's fiddly but doable

I went to the OPC to maintain my warranty otherwise I would have used RPM Technik.

andygo said: I have added just over a litre of oil to get the level to indicate full. The OPC has told me that they bleed the brakes without removing the wheels as they bleed them whilst on the ramps. Is that even possible? This doesn’t make sense to me - why would you add oil when you’ve just paid for an oil service? Surely you should have ask the OPC to check what they’ve done. Regarding bleeding the brakes, if they work and you’re happy with them, why waste your time speculating? If I were you I’d have complained to the OPC about the oil and use that in accusatory way to question whether they’d done the other work and let them prove that they had. I certainly wouldn’t be substituting work that I’d already paid for.

plynchy said: Surely they'd want the wheels off to inspect the brakes and suspension components?? They can do it without taking the wheels off. I've been present for brake and suspension checks for one of my Porsches on a couple of occasions. I'm an ex race car engineer, and I was impressed with the ingenuity of the measuring equipment used, and that they were able to accurately check both disc and pad thickness without taking the wheels off. Had a proper look over it all next time I had the wheels off myself though... maz8062 said: The OPC has told me that they bleed the brakes without removing the wheels as they bleed them whilst on the ramps. Is that even possible? Yes, absolutely commonplace on many vehicles. If there's room to get a bleed pipe on and loosen the bleed nipples, no reason to remove the wheels unnecessarily. Edited by LiamH66 on Sunday 12th May 22:25

At this rate of going they could do the service in the car park if it’s that easy.

maz8062 said: This doesn’t make sense to me - why would you add oil when you’ve just paid for an oil service? Surely you should have ask the OPC to check what they’ve done. Regarding bleeding the brakes, if they work and you’re happy with them, why waste your time speculating? If I were you I’d have complained to the OPC about the oil and use that in accusatory way to question whether they’d done the other work and let them prove that they had. I certainly wouldn’t be substituting work that I’d already paid for. The OPC offered to fill up the oil, but taking a 35 drive each way to get some oil seemed a bit of a faff tbh. I filled it up little by little myself so I knew exactly how much as in there. The car typically uses no oil between changes. As regards the brake feel, they felt fine before I took the car in, no different afterwards. I'm just not confident they have done a professional job on the brakes, just on me!

andygo said: ..............but I replaced my brake fluid about 18 months ago when I fitted the new rear calipers that the original OPC sent me. They sent me the calipers as no slots were available over the Christmas period and the January for them to replace so I did it myself. How is that supposed to work with the warranty, allowing customers to fit calipers on a car themselves surely isn't in keeping with the warranty rules? What about the plugs, you were concerned about if they had been changed, were they?

981Boxess said: How is that supposed to work with the warranty, allowing customers to fit calipers on a car themselves surely isn't in keeping with the warranty rules? Perhaps Mat Armstrong is fine rebuilding Marcus Rashford's RR Wraith and keeping it in warranty after all?

981Boxess said: How is that supposed to work with the warranty, allowing customers to fit calipers on a car themselves surely isn't in keeping with the warranty rules? What about the plugs, you were concerned about if they had been changed, were they? I was happy to fit the calipers myself, at least I knew they were done properly and bled well, pistons retracted into the calipers etc, plus I didnt have to wait several weeks for the privilege. Ref the plugs, I could see shiny scuff marks on the bolts and finger smudges where the coil packs had been held to unplug them so I assumed they had been done, Edited by andygo on Monday 13th May 19:42

DJMC said: 981Boxess said: How is that supposed to work with the warranty, allowing customers to fit calipers on a car themselves surely isn't in keeping with the warranty rules? Perhaps Mat Armstrong is fine rebuilding Marcus Rashford's RR Wraith and keeping it in warranty after all? I think you will find Mat Armstrong is doing just fine full stop - never let the truth get in the way of a good story/Youtube video.

andygo said: Ref the plugs, I could see shiny scuff marks on the bolts and finger smudges where the coil packs had been held to unplug them so I assumed they had been done Charging for jobs not done would have been a red card, a yellow it is then. No garage is perfect indy or OPC, at least it is all sorted now.

I am so glad I have a dipstick and a cable handbrake come to that!

981Boxess said: Charging for jobs not done would have been a red card, a yellow it is then. No garage is perfect indy or OPC, at least it is all sorted now. Having your car serviced and not sure it's been done properley shouldn't even be up for discusssion rally. Garages can be their own worst enemy and unfortunately their reputation sometimes goes before them..

andygo said: 981Boxess said: Charging for jobs not done would have been a red card, a yellow it is then. No garage is perfect indy or OPC, at least it is all sorted now. Having your car serviced and not sure it's been done properley shouldn't even be up for discusssion rally. Garages can be their own worst enemy and unfortunately their reputation sometimes goes before them.. It doesn't matter if you run a garage, a restaurant or a brothel you are always going to have a member of staff that isn't great at what they do. Look around where you work, are you the best, is there someone rubbish there? As someone who has spent decades working in one of those areas let me assure you that as many problems stem from dealing with the general public as getting it wrong at the coal face. No questions about cars or food please

981Boxess said: andygo said: 981Boxess said: Charging for jobs not done would have been a red card, a yellow it is then. No garage is perfect indy or OPC, at least it is all sorted now. Having your car serviced and not sure it's been done properley shouldn't even be up for discusssion rally. Garages can be their own worst enemy and unfortunately their reputation sometimes goes before them.. It doesn't matter if you run a garage, a restaurant or a brothel you are always going to have a member of staff that isn't great at what they do. Look around where you work, are you the best, is there someone rubbish there? As someone who has spent decades working in one of those areas let me assure you that as many problems stem from dealing with the general public as getting it wrong at the coal face. No questions about cars or food please The difference being the general public are paying for your "expertise"... It is literally your job to fix their problems.

BandOfBrothers said: The difference being the general public are paying for your "expertise"... It is literally your job to fix their problems. Agreed - but the point I was making was that all businesses will have 'issues' along the way, once that has happened their only option is to put what was wrong right and try to reduce the odds of it happening again.

981Boxess said: Agreed - but the point I was making was that all businesses will have 'issues' along the way, once that has happened their only option is to put what was wrong right and try to reduce the odds of it happening again. This. It shouldn't happen in the first place, but when it does, how the customer reacts makes a big difference to whether the problem is fixed, and the likelihood of it happening again. First step has to be to confront the garage surely?

Discombobulate said: 981Boxess said: Agreed - but the point I was making was that all businesses will have 'issues' along the way, once that has happened their only option is to put what was wrong right and try to reduce the odds of it happening again. This. It shouldn't happen in the first place, but when it does, how the customer reacts makes a big difference to whether the problem is fixed, and the likelihood of it happening again. First step has to be to confront the garage surely? I would have contacted them ASAP to raise my concerns (no ranting). I would have arranged for them to finish their job off to my satisfaction at a convenient time to myself while I wait. I would expect them to offer me some sort of compensation to take the edge off the situation so everyone leaves happy. The workshop manager should then mark the fitter's card and keep an eye on his jobs.

981Boxess said: Discombobulate said: 981Boxess said: Agreed - but the point I was making was that all businesses will have 'issues' along the way, once that has happened their only option is to put what was wrong right and try to reduce the odds of it happening again. This. It shouldn't happen in the first place, but when it does, how the customer reacts makes a big difference to whether the problem is fixed, and the likelihood of it happening again. First step has to be to confront the garage surely? I would have contacted them ASAP to raise my concerns (no ranting). I would have arranged for them to finish their job off to my satisfaction at a convenient time to myself while I wait. I would expect them to offer me some sort of compensation to take the edge off the situation so everyone leaves happy. The workshop manager should then mark the fitter's card and keep an eye on his jobs. From personal experience of 2 different OPC's and an approved bodyshop I just will not use anything official porsche anymore, in my eyes the Porsche badge in the uk is a warning to be best avoided. They charge a fortune, are generally incompetent and in one case genuinely dangerous.

I came here as the OP linked this thread rom another. It seems unless I’m missing something that there maybe an issue with an oil sensor. We haven’t got to the bottom of whether the brakes were done. The plugs may have been done. Has the OPC been challenged?

Discombobulate said: This. It shouldn't happen in the first place, but when it does, how the customer reacts makes a big difference to whether the problem is fixed, and the likelihood of it happening again. First step has to be to confront the garage surely? The Crimson Avenger confronts : https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=pCCdT_THQzw&pp=y...

Mikebentley said: I came here as the OP linked this thread rom another. It seems unless I’m missing something that there maybe an issue with an oil sensor. We haven’t got to the bottom of whether the brakes were done. The plugs may have been done. Has the OPC been challenged? I don’t believe there is an oil sensor issue. It was showing as circa 1litre short and sure enough, that’s how much it took to show the correct level. I haven’t re contacted the OPC as I’m waiting until I can put in a personal appearance.

andygo said: Mikebentley said: I came here as the OP linked this thread rom another. It seems unless I’m missing something that there maybe an issue with an oil sensor. We haven’t got to the bottom of whether the brakes were done. The plugs may have been done. Has the OPC been challenged? I don’t believe there is an oil sensor issue. It was showing as circa 1litre short and sure enough, that’s how much it took to show the correct level. I haven’t re contacted the OPC as I’m waiting until I can put in a personal appearance. When you go nose to nose with them, what are your expectations? Is it worth wasting your time on as you will get an insincere apology, yes they might offer a few crumbs but would you really want these muppets working on your car again? I can understand about the warranty but the car is at the age where wear 'n' tear is the likely outcome rather than a sucessful claim so the warranty value is diminishing.

Agreed, they don’t give a monkeys imho.

I guess there are OPC's and OPC's ... it's not how problems happen (other than for future best practice) ... it's the way in which they are (hopefully) amicably resolved that's important to me. Problems can be built-up or solved ... ??

FMOB said: From personal experience of 2 different OPC's and an approved bodyshop I just will not use anything official porsche anymore, in my eyes the Porsche badge in the uk is a warning to be best avoided. They charge a fortune, are generally incompetent and in one case genuinely dangerous. There are 46(?) OPCs in the UK, you have used only two of them maybe a few times in total and an approved bodyshop and from that very limited OPC network experience you have concluded they are "generally incompetent". If you have had genuine complaints about poor service you have experienced then that is unfortunate but that is only based on your visits to those two OPCs, others using those very same places may have had a completely different experience to yours. If you take all the PH Porsche posters and lump them together that number will be a very small percentage of UK owners so I wouldn't use what you read on here as an overall picture either. People will generally only post to complain, how many posters start a thread to say they had great service and work done without any issues, I never have. No, OPCs are not cheap but I wouldn't say they charge a 'fortune' either given the level of cars we are talking about. It seems to me that people all want the Brand/Image and chrome and glass palaces, but when it comes to paying for them some have a problem with that. Maybe they have bought the wrong car.

andygo said: Mikebentley said: I came here as the OP linked this thread rom another. It seems unless I’m missing something that there maybe an issue with an oil sensor. We haven’t got to the bottom of whether the brakes were done. The plugs may have been done. Has the OPC been challenged? I don’t believe there is an oil sensor issue. It was showing as circa 1litre short and sure enough, that’s how much it took to show the correct level. I haven’t re contacted the OPC as I’m waiting until I can put in a personal appearance. Making a complaint weeks later is just a waste of everyone’s time.

Making a complaint without gathering your facts is even bigger waste of time imho.

andygo said: Making a complaint without gathering your facts is even bigger waste of time imho. I would have done all that before starting the thread

Surely the OPC would have the right to say that nothing was reported for weeks since the car was collected and therefore dispute any claims due to time lapsed.

981Boxess said: FMOB said: From personal experience of 2 different OPC's and an approved bodyshop I just will not use anything official porsche anymore, in my eyes the Porsche badge in the uk is a warning to be best avoided. They charge a fortune, are generally incompetent and in one case genuinely dangerous. There are 46(?) OPCs in the UK, you have used only two of them maybe a few times in total and an approved bodyshop and from that very limited OPC network experience you have concluded they are "generally incompetent". If you have had genuine complaints about poor service you have experienced then that is unfortunate but that is only based on your visits to those two OPCs, others using those very same places may have had a completely different experience to yours. If you take all the PH Porsche posters and lump them together that number will be a very small percentage of UK owners so I wouldn't use what you read on here as an overall picture either. People will generally only post to complain, how many posters start a thread to say they had great service and work done without any issues, I never have. No, OPCs are not cheap but I wouldn't say they charge a 'fortune' either given the level of cars we are talking about. It seems to me that people all want the Brand/Image and chrome and glass palaces, but when it comes to paying for them some have a problem with that. Maybe they have bought the wrong car. Well I have been dealing with cars for many years and used dealers from many different brands and a couple of bodyshops. The top 2 worst service experiences have been Porsche, have cost me several £k's in unecessary cosmetic repairs and finally put the lives of myself, other road users and pedestrians at risk because they can't repair things properly. No other dealers I have ever used have demonstrated such extraordinary levels of incompetence in doing basic servicing and repairs. My opinion of Porsche dealers is based on experience but I have no issue with paying their rates but do object most strongly when I get dangerous incompetence in return. Other people maybe quite happy with their experiences and can make their own judgements, I have used another dealer brand with more than 20 services overall and without any issues, with Porsche it must 4 or 5 services tops with 2 absolutely terrible experiences. As statistics go that is a shocking record for Porsche.

981Boxess said: andygo said: Mikebentley said: I came here as the OP linked this thread rom another. It seems unless I’m missing something that there maybe an issue with an oil sensor. We haven’t got to the bottom of whether the brakes were done. The plugs may have been done. Has the OPC been challenged? I don’t believe there is an oil sensor issue. It was showing as circa 1litre short and sure enough, that’s how much it took to show the correct level. I haven’t re contacted the OPC as I’m waiting until I can put in a personal appearance. Making a complaint weeks later is just a waste of everyone’s time. After my issue (which we put down to the oil sensor) the OPS returned my car with a Porsche-branded mug by way of apology for the inconvenience. Which is fair enough since it turned out not to be their fault in the end. I would have preferred a complimentary map update to PCM though!